DunderMifflin Posted October 10, 2016 Share Posted October 10, 2016 2 minutes ago, Kalbear said: That is true. However, only one candidate has had multiple lawsuits settled for sexual assault. Only one candidate is currently being tried for rape of a 13 year old girl. Only one candidate is on record as stating how they sexually assault women. Only one candidate has settled 20 lawsuits on sexual harassment. Which one is on record stating how they sexually assault women? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kalbear Posted October 10, 2016 Share Posted October 10, 2016 Just now, DunderMifflin said: Which one is on record stating how they sexually assault women? Trump. "Grab her by the pussy" is sexual assault. That this matches almost perfectly the described actions of two of his accusers is kind of a big deal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DunderMifflin Posted October 10, 2016 Share Posted October 10, 2016 Just now, Kalbear said: Trump. "Grab her by the pussy" is sexual assault. That this matches almost perfectly the described actions of two of his accusers is kind of a big deal. I don't see anything wrong with grabbing a pussy if you have consent. Seems kinda harsh but if two adults want to do that I'm not going to call it sexual assault. What I heard Trump say was "they let me do it" . Clearly to me he thinks he has consent. If he had said "they don't let me grab their pussy but I do it anyway" then I'd consider that a clearer admission of sexual assault. Now I, or anyone could speculate that he didnt have consent but thats a different claim than saying he has admitted to sexual assault. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kalbear Posted October 10, 2016 Share Posted October 10, 2016 Just now, DunderMifflin said: I don't see anything wrong with grabbing a pussy if you have consent. Seems kinda harsh but if two adults want to do that I'm not going to call it sexual assault. What I heard Trump say was "they let me do it" . Clearly to me he thinks he has consent. If he had said "they don't let me grab their pussy but I do it anyway" then I'd consider that a clearer admission of sexual assault. Now I, or anyone could speculate that he didnt have consent but thats a different claim than saying he has admitted to sexual assault. Thinking that you have consent is not having consent. It's sexual assault. He also says 'you can do anything if you're a big star'. Again, the fact that this directly aligns with at least two reports of accusations of sexual assault he's done indicates that this is what he likes to do, and in at least two cases it was not with consent. And in at least 20 cases, he did something that warranted legal action against him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tempra Posted October 10, 2016 Share Posted October 10, 2016 33 minutes ago, Kalbear said: It's immaterial to what he wants. And what he wants was on discussion, and what you wanted to dismiss out of hand. It's a good thing that it doesn't exist as it stands, but what he wants is to punish opposition to him. That's what he desires. He indicated how he might try to do it, but what he wants is her to be in jail. That's a pretty important point - that what he wants is to be an authoritarian controller. You can argue reasonably that he can't, currently, legally do that, and that's fine - but that's not what we were arguing about. We're arguing what he wants. And what he wants is to suspend the current rule of law and dictate precisely the outcome. Your belief in what Trump wants is completely undermined by the (immaterial) statement that he would have a special prosecutor appointed to investigate Clinton. You do realize that the purpose of a special prosecutor is to work within the legal system, by investigating and, if appropriate, filing appropriate charges against an individual for violations of the law, right? That's not immaterial; that's extraordinarily material because it reveals Trump's intent to work within the legal system. With that said, i'll bow out of the echo chamber for now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DunderMifflin Posted October 10, 2016 Share Posted October 10, 2016 2 minutes ago, Kalbear said: Thinking that you have consent is not having consent. It's sexual assault. What? How would anyone in the world ever have sex this way??? "Well, I've asked her if I could kiss her. She said yes, now I think I have consent. But thinking you have consent is not consent...sooooo....hmmm" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kalbear Posted October 10, 2016 Share Posted October 10, 2016 1 minute ago, Tempra said: Your belief in what Trump wants is completely undermined by the (immaterial) statement that he would have a special prosecutor appointed to investigate Clinton. How? You can easily recognize that you don't have the legal right to do something but want to do it. This makes zero sense. He wants to put Clinton in jail. He knows he cannot do that directly. 1 minute ago, Tempra said: You do realize that the purpose of a special prosecutor is to work within the legal system, by investigating and, if appropriate, filing appropriate charges against an individual for violations of the law, right? That's not immaterial; that's extraordinarily material because it reveals Trump's intent to work within the legal system. Well, kinda. As pointed out, using the power of POTUS to attack personal enemies is against the DoJ code of ethics, caused an AG to resign in protest and was one of the charges that was going to be brought up against Nixon. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kalbear Posted October 10, 2016 Share Posted October 10, 2016 1 minute ago, DunderMifflin said: What? How would anyone in the world ever have sex this way??? "Well, I've asked her if I could kiss her. She said yes, now I think I have consent. But thinking you have consent is not consent...sooooo....hmmm" Asking if you have consent is a reasonable expectation that you have consent. "Thinking" that you have consent doesn't imply this. That you believe this speaks a lot to some frankly scary ideas - namely that so long as you aren't immediately charged with rape, whatever you're doing is fine. Which, by the way, Trump has been charged three times with rape. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OldGimletEye Posted October 10, 2016 Share Posted October 10, 2016 From Steve Schmidt, on Meet The Press: Quote STEVE SCHMIDT: When we look at where this race is today, the presidential race is effectively over. Hillary Rodham Clinton will be the 45th president of the United States. Chuck Schumer will be the majority leader of the United States Senate. And the only question that's still up in the air, is how close the Democrats will come to retaking the House majority. What this exposes though is much deeper, and goes to the Republican Party as an institution. This candidacy. The magnitude of its disgrace to the country is almost impossible, I think, to articulate. But it has exposed the intellectual rot in the Republican Party. It has exposed at a massive level the hypocrisy, the modern day money changers in the temple like Jerry Falwell Jr. And, so this party to go forward, and to represent a conservative vision for America, has great soul searching to do. And what we have seen in the -- and the danger for all of these candidates -- is over the course the last year, these candidates who have repeatedly put their party ahead of their country, denying what is so obviously clear to anybody who's watching about his complete and total, manifest unfitness for this office. Intellectual rot is right. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DanteGabriel Posted October 10, 2016 Share Posted October 10, 2016 12 minutes ago, DunderMifflin said: I don't see anything wrong with grabbing a pussy if you have consent. Seems kinda harsh but if two adults want to do that I'm not going to call it sexual assault. What I heard Trump say was "they let me do it" . Clearly to me he thinks he has consent. If he had said "they don't let me grab their pussy but I do it anyway" then I'd consider that a clearer admission of sexual assault. Now I, or anyone could speculate that he didnt have consent but thats a different claim than saying he has admitted to sexual assault. This is grotesque reasoning that bends in ridiculous shapes to excuse a thoroughly established pattern of unwanted sexual advances and assault. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stannis is the man....nis Posted October 10, 2016 Share Posted October 10, 2016 So with Paul Ryan backing off does Trump have any resources for a ground game? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DanteGabriel Posted October 10, 2016 Share Posted October 10, 2016 Just now, Stannis is the man....nis said: So with Paul Ryan backing off does Trump have any resources for a ground game? Ryan's not backing off. He hasn't dropped his endorsement. He's just wringing his hands a little more desperately in public to try to convince people he doesn't actually support the narcissistic sleazeball he's endorsed. It is pure craven gutlessness. And Trump's still hammering him for being insufficiently devoted to Maximum Leader. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kalbear Posted October 10, 2016 Share Posted October 10, 2016 2 minutes ago, Stannis is the man....nis said: So with Paul Ryan backing off does Trump have any resources for a ground game? It's a really weird situation, honestly. There are a lot of ways that it can backfire. Right now there are already threats by Trump supporters that say to ONLY vote for Trump and vote for no one else on the ballot. That would be disastrous for the GOP in general, as Trump supporters are not strong enough by themselves in basically any state to elect Trump, but are an absolute requirement for many of the house and senate seats. It is also precisely the kind of tactic that Trump prefers - to threaten and attack disloyalty. At the same time, being loyal to Trump is absolutely brutal if you're in a tight race at all, and the attack ads are absurdly easy and very, very damaging. We already have polling that indicates a double-digit lead for Clinton and a ground game isn't going to help that no matter what - and that's with the notion of a good ground game like Romney and Bush had. Trump has nothing in place by comparison. The best hope for the GOP is that turnout in general is low and most people aren't rabid Trump supporters - but my suspicion is that Trump will have caused some major damage on downballots. And with all THAT being said, even causing major damage is still likely not enough to flip the house. Democrats got 1.3 million more votes than Republicans in house elections and still have a 30-seat loss. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stannis is the man....nis Posted October 10, 2016 Share Posted October 10, 2016 1 minute ago, Kalbear said: It's a really weird situation, honestly. There are a lot of ways that it can backfire. Right now there are already threats by Trump supporters that say to ONLY vote for Trump and vote for no one else on the ballot. That would be disastrous for the GOP in general, as Trump supporters are not strong enough by themselves in basically any state to elect Trump, but are an absolute requirement for many of the house and senate seats. It is also precisely the kind of tactic that Trump prefers - to threaten and attack disloyalty. At the same time, being loyal to Trump is absolutely brutal if you're in a tight race at all, and the attack ads are absurdly easy and very, very damaging. We already have polling that indicates a double-digit lead for Clinton and a ground game isn't going to help that no matter what - and that's with the notion of a good ground game like Romney and Bush had. Trump has nothing in place by comparison. The best hope for the GOP is that turnout in general is low and most people aren't rabid Trump supporters - but my suspicion is that Trump will have caused some major damage on downballots. And with all THAT being said, even causing major damage is still likely not enough to flip the house. Democrats got 1.3 million more votes than Republicans in house elections and still have a 30-seat loss. His ground game is gonna haunt him reports are Hillary is already up in early voting in NC a state he can't afford to lose Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kalbear Posted October 10, 2016 Share Posted October 10, 2016 Just now, Stannis is the man....nis said: His ground game is gonna haunt him reports are Hillary is already up in early voting in NC a state he can't afford to lose At this point I don't think his ground game matters. Romney was behind by 1% in 2012 at this point in the race; Trump is behind anywhere from 7 to 11% now. In order to make that up, the difference in turnout between the two candidates in states that matter would have to be on the order of 50-60% higher in the demographics favorable to Trump (namely white men with no college) than the history of the entire united states. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SerPaladin Posted October 10, 2016 Share Posted October 10, 2016 1 minute ago, Ferocious Veldt Roarer said: A related thought - did he really sound like someone who cared? Seriously. It's the entitlement mentality that has the Trump defenders all wrapped up in their own tortured logic. In Trump's mind, and in many of theirs, his celebrity and stardom are consent, just the like the star quarterback or the movie producer or the chairman of Fox News. - In the (deluded) minds of the assaulters, of course they have consent, they hold the power and leverage, the world lays down before them grateful for it. Why would they care about an object, a receptacle, a trophy? - Two types of defenders are worse in many ways. First, the "someone else did it too" types piss me off. I don't care about Clinton or Kennedy or Jefferson, and that's a damn slippery slope in which everyone has that excuse. - The second group are genuinely dangerous. They think this is how it really is, or how it really should be, the "Alpha" stuff is the natural order. These are the ones that want a "strong leader". You been looking for a dog whistle in all of Trump's BS? "Strong" is the one that should scare you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nolendil Posted October 10, 2016 Share Posted October 10, 2016 Efforts by Hillary Clinton to simulate charm and laughter are very good, they've commended by leading computer scientists. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mormont Posted October 10, 2016 Share Posted October 10, 2016 [mod] Don't feed the troll, please. [/mod] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr. Pepper Posted October 10, 2016 Share Posted October 10, 2016 Jeff Sessions doesn't recognize forcing a kiss or a genital grabbing on a woman as sexual assault. He's directly in charge of lawmaking. I imagine this man exhibits the temperament rapists and rape apologists hope for in a lawmaker. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kalbear Posted October 10, 2016 Share Posted October 10, 2016 Aw...you deleted my Chris Kluwe link? That was on topic! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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