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Who will be our POV for Euron?


The Bard of Banefort

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Although I personally do not expect Aeron to die in whatever magic ritual Euron is involving him in (I doubt GRRM would give that away in a sample chapter), the possibility that Aeron could either die or end up washed up on some shore somewhere got me thinking about how we'll witness Euron's plot in TWOW. Since he is not a POV character himself, who will be our eyes and ears for the Crow's Eye? Sam is in Oldtown, but it seems unlikely that the two will end up coming face-to-face anytime soon.

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Thats an interesting question. 

 

Sam is the most likely candidate.

 

However, its just as likely that we won't get POV with Euron anymore until certain events unfold and he comes eye to eye with Victarion. That makes it also easier for GRRM to let certain things unfold off-page, which speeds up the narrative. 

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I could easily see Aeron dying in his second or max third chapter, during, or at the end of the battle with the Redwyne fleet. Part of what makes Euron so interesting is that we don't see much of what he does, or what his plans are, so that a good part of him is still mysterious, which makes him unpredictable, and full of surprises for the reader. However, it's pretty much accepted that Euron will turn his eye to Oldtown after his victory, where Sam is currently studying to become a maester. While we may never actually see Euron in Sam's chapters, we could have constantly some news from the battle spreading through the city, feel the threat of the ironmen's attack growing through his eyes, and finally we could witness the attack on Oldtown and whatever magic Leyton Hightower is cooking up to defend the city through his PoV as well. So we probably won't see Euron after Aeron's likely death, but we will keep witnessing the unfolding of his plans. 

We might see Euron after all that in a very late TWOW chapter, or very early ADOS one, through Cersei, as she flees to Casterly Rock, and Euron shows up, proposing an alliance, as many are anticipating. We might see how he has changed after the battle against the Redwyne fleet, and the sack of Oldtown. A meeting between him and Cersei would be very cool to read !

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If we assume that sam won t spend years studying at oldtown then it is very likely that he will become the euron pov.

Don t forget that there is something hidden in oldtown that the faceless want so euron might also be after that. I wouldn t be surprised if sam ends up being involved with euron because of this. Either because sam will spend a lot of time runing from euron in order to protect said item or because he will be caught early on it makes sense that their stories will be linked.

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The Ironborn are raiders, using their mobility to seek easy conquests and spoils. Euron may be seeking the Iron Throne, but his men want to drink, plunder, and rape. Since their coup de main was foiled, it is unlikely they will pursue a siege of Oldtown. Moreover, the Ironborn (other than Rodrik the Reader) despise maesters and Greenland learning. Even Euron is unlikely to know or care what the Citadel has in its possession.

Some have suggested that after defeating the Redwine fleet, Euron will attack Starfall in order to get Dawn. (A magic sword to go with his magic armor.) I think that idea might very well be true. Feinting at Oldtown as a diversion, then using his mobility advantage to concentrate on Starfall would be a sound strategy for Euron. Meanwhile, Obara Sand and Areo Hotah are supposedly attacking High Hermitage (upriver from Starfall) in order to bring Dorkstar to justice. Hotah would be well within range to provide narrative coverage of Starfall. This may explain why AH is still being used as a POV by GRRM. It would also be a mechanism to get Dawn involved in the story - no one really expects Ned Dayne to wield it, do they?

Aeron Greyjoy is one of the weakest POVs in the story, and was originally part of the mega-prologue, intended to be killed or bypassed as soon a a regular POV could take over. He will likely be sacrificed by Euron. Narrative coverage of Euron could be passed off from Aeron, to Areo, to someone close to KL, much as coverage of Stannis was passed off from Davos, to Jon, to Asha.

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3 hours ago, Ibbison from Ibben said:

Some have suggested that after defeating the Redwine fleet, Euron will attack Starfall in order to get Dawn. (A magic sword to go with his magic armor.) I think that idea might very well be true. Feinting at Oldtown as a diversion, then using his mobility advantage to concentrate on Starfall would be a sound strategy for Euron. Meanwhile, Obara Sand and Areo Hotah are supposedly attacking High Hermitage (upriver from Starfall) in order to bring Dorkstar to justice. Hotah would be well within range to provide narrative coverage of Starfall. This may explain why AH is still being used as a POV by GRRM. It would also be a mechanism to get Dawn involved in the story - no one really expects Ned Dayne to wield it, do they?

I laughed really hard at this!

Don t you think it makes more sense for dorkstar to try to steal dawn given that he is a dayne and thinks he is the best thing ever? And AH could still be a pov for this and we could have a mini story about someone more worthy trying to get the sword back from dorkstar.

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17 hours ago, Ibbison from Ibben said:

The Ironborn are raiders, using their mobility to seek easy conquests and spoils. Euron may be seeking the Iron Throne, but his men want to drink, plunder, and rape. Since their coup de main was foiled, it is unlikely they will pursue a siege of Oldtown. Moreover, the Ironborn (other than Rodrik the Reader) despise maesters and Greenland learning. Even Euron is unlikely to know or care what the Citadel has in its possession.

Some have suggested that after defeating the Redwine fleet, Euron will attack Starfall in order to get Dawn. (A magic sword to go with his magic armor.) I think that idea might very well be true. Feinting at Oldtown as a diversion, then using his mobility advantage to concentrate on Starfall would be a sound strategy for Euron. Meanwhile, Obara Sand and Areo Hotah are supposedly attacking High Hermitage (upriver from Starfall) in order to bring Dorkstar to justice. Hotah would be well within range to provide narrative coverage of Starfall. This may explain why AH is still being used as a POV by GRRM. It would also be a mechanism to get Dawn involved in the story - no one really expects Ned Dayne to wield it, do they?

Aeron Greyjoy is one of the weakest POVs in the story, and was originally part of the mega-prologue, intended to be killed or bypassed as soon a a regular POV could take over. He will likely be sacrificed by Euron. Narrative coverage of Euron could be passed off from Aeron, to Areo, to someone close to KL, much as coverage of Stannis was passed off from Davos, to Jon, to Asha.

The problem with this theory is that there would be no event that would force Sam to leave Oldtown and come back to the North. He could theoretically stay in the Citadel until the end of ADOS. Also, why didn't Euron sack Starfall before the arrival of the Redwyne fleet? We know he stayed around the Arbor and Whispering Sound for months, as if he were waiting for the fleet to come meet him. If his ultimate goal was to attack Starfall, he could have done it before the arrival of the fleet, and then retreated to the Redwyne Straits to destroy it.

And we have seen that Euron has already been forced to abandon his plan to cross the ocean to Slaver's Bay with his entire fleet because his men didn't want to come with him, and wanted to stay and raid the Reach. Imagine their reaction if he told them that instead of sacking a city enriched by trade for centuries, which is literally just beyond the horizon, they will attack a near-worthless castle. They have nothing to gain from their perspective. Euron attacking Oldtown makes more sense imo, and the destruction of the Citadel would draw a nice parallel with the Great Library of Alexandria, which was destroyed during an attack from the sea. 

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On 12/12/2020 at 10:55 PM, The Bard of Banefort said:

Although I personally do not expect Aeron to die in whatever magic ritual Euron is involving him in (I doubt GRRM would give that away in a sample chapter), the possibility that Aeron could either die or end up washed up on some shore somewhere got me thinking about how we'll witness Euron's plot in TWOW. Since he is not a POV character himself, who will be our eyes and ears for the Crow's Eye? Sam is in Oldtown, but it seems unlikely that the two will end up coming face-to-face anytime soon.

That's the thing.

I think Euron's plot will have very few witnesses. I think he'll be the hidden horror lingering in the shadows. A few people will be aware of him and the danger he poses but they will either not care, they will support it, they will have their hands full with more "pressing" concerns or no one will believe them. The few people who ARE aware of Euron would be in for a nasty shock because, as I said, he's lingering in the shadows on the backburner. There's no way to see him clearly.

To answer your question: I think Aeron will be the POV character witnessing the Battle of the Redwyne Straits - krakens and all. Maybe Aeron actually spends some time under the sea and sees what Patchface once saw. If he survives that (I don't believe he will but let's just say he does), then he spends the rest of his storyline wandering the Seven Kingdoms trying:

  • to warn people about Euron and the horrors that lie under the sea
  • to put as much distance between himself and Euron and whatever horrors lie beneath

Except no one listens to him because the reputation of House Greyjoy and the Ironborn as a whole is trash at that point. So Aeron becomes the ASoIaF version of Cassandra from the stories of Ancient Greece.

This means that Aeron stops being a POV. I think that Sam will become our eyes and ears into Euron towards the end of The Winds of Winter - after Euron is able to seize control of Oldtown and the Citadel. I think Sam (and Gilly) will eventually escape either in one of the final chapters of The Winds of Winter or in the beginning of A Dream of Spring...where they will (or just Sam) will pay a long overdue visit to Horn Hill in A Dream of Spring.

After Aeron and Sam, I think Cersei will take over as the POV character that does the majoirty of the camerawork for Euron. I'm sure Jaime, Asha, Theon, Daenerys and Victarion will put eyes and ears on Euron but I think Cersei will be The One™

Even then I suspect that it will be an on-and-off, part-time thing.

 

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On 12/21/2020 at 9:07 AM, divica said:

If we assume that sam won t spend years studying at oldtown then it is very likely that he will become the euron pov.

Don t forget that there is something hidden in oldtown that the faceless want so euron might also be after that. I wouldn t be surprised if sam ends up being involved with euron because of this. Either because sam will spend a lot of time runing from euron in order to protect said item or because he will be caught early on it makes sense that their stories will be linked.

I can see both Sam and Aeron (if he makes it past chapter three) spending the rest of Winds and however long they survive in Dream running or hiding from Euron.

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54 minutes ago, BlackLightning said:

That's the thing.

I think Euron's plot will have very few witnesses. I think he'll be the hidden horror lingering in the shadows. A few people will be aware of him and the danger he poses but they will either not care, they will support it, they will have their hands full with more "pressing" concerns or no one will believe them. The few people who ARE aware of Euron would be in for a nasty shock because, as I said, he's lingering in the shadows on the backburner. There's no way to see him clearly.

To answer your question: I think Aeron will be the POV character witnessing the Battle of the Redwyne Straits - krakens and all. Maybe Aeron actually spends some time under the sea and sees what Patchface once saw. If he survives that (I don't believe he will but let's just say he does), then he spends the rest of his storyline wandering the Seven Kingdoms trying:

  • to warn people about Euron and the horrors that lie under the sea
  • to put as much distance between himself and Euron and whatever horrors lie beneath

Except no one listens to him because the reputation of House Greyjoy and the Ironborn as a whole is trash at that point. So Aeron becomes the ASoIaF version of Cassandra from the stories of Ancient Greece.

This means that Aeron stops being a POV. I think that Sam will become our eyes and ears into Euron towards the end of The Winds of Winter - after Euron is able to seize control of Oldtown and the Citadel. I think Sam (and Gilly) will eventually escape either in one of the final chapters of The Winds of Winter or in the beginning of A Dream of Spring...where they will (or just Sam) will pay a long overdue visit to Horn Hill in A Dream of Spring.

After Aeron and Sam, I think Cersei will take over as the POV character that does the majoirty of the camerawork for Euron. I'm sure Jaime, Asha, Theon, Daenerys and Victarion will put eyes and ears on Euron but I think Cersei will be The One™

Even then I suspect that it will be an on-and-off, part-time thing.

If Aeron survives, I believe he will spend TWOW trying to restore Theon to the Seastone Chair. Take this scene from The Forsaken:

Quote

“Aeron, my good and faithful servant, you must tell the Ironborn that the Crow’s Eye is no true king, that the Seastone Chair by rights belongs to … to … to …”

Not Victarion. Victarion had offered himself to the captains and kings but they had spurned him.

Not Asha. In his heart, Aeron had always loved Asha best of all his brother Balon’s children. The Drowned God had blessed her with a warrior’s spirit and the wisdom of a king – but he had cursed her with a woman’s body, too. No woman had ever ruled the Iron Islands. She should never have made a claim. She should have spoken for Victarion, added her own strength to his. It was not too late, Aeron had decided as he shivered in the sea. If Victarion took Asha for his wife, they could yet rule together, king and queen. In ancient days, each isle had its Salt King and its Rock King. Let the Old Way return.

This is right before Aeron is captured, and he's still in denial. But as many of the other lords pointed out before the kingsmoot, the answer is plain: the Seastone Chair by rights belongs to Theon. He's the one person with a stronger claim than Asha or Euron, and certainly Victarion, and he's the only one who can still contest the results of the kingsmoot, since it occurred without his knowledge. 

We've already seen a huge change in Aeron by the end of the chapter. I wrote about my interpretation over in the Aeron thread: 

If Aeron wants to take down Euron, then he needs to put the driftwood crown on his nephew's head. Based on what we've seen thus far, I believe he will soon come to accept this.

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19 minutes ago, The Bard of Banefort said:

If Aeron wants to take down Euron, then he needs to put the driftwood crown on his nephew's head. Based on what we've seen thus far, I believe he will soon come to accept this.

I can't disagree. I believe there's going to be second Kingsmoot in A Dream of Spring...one that will end in blood and will trigger an Ironborn civil war.

Euron (with Cersei somehow passively supporting or upholding his claim) vs. Victarion (Daenerys is not likely to support Victarion if it means usurping/killing Theon and Asha) vs. Theon and Asha

Or maybe it's Euron and Cersei vs. all the other Greyjoys

Whether Euron wins or loses this civil war, I still believe that he will take the Iron Throne and rule as King for a time.

But to get to that point, it's going to take Aeron all of The Winds of Winter (and maybe a good chunk of A Dream of Spring) in order to go from Oldtown to Winterfell on foot.

And if Aeron wants to take down Euron, he needs to put just as much of his faith in Asha.

I expect him to spend the interim trying to warn people about Euron. And the parallels between Patchface and Aeron are stark. I believe Patchface -- while mad -- is telling the truth. He may even be working an agenda. Something about him really bothers Melisandre in a way that no one else has been able to do since her days as a slave.

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2 hours ago, Table8 said:

Bran. Though it won’t be explicit.

Neat idea.

57 minutes ago, TheLastWolf said:

POV for Euron!? 

  Reveal hidden contents
  Reveal hidden contents
  Reveal hidden contents

Don't tell anyone! Sshh

  Reveal hidden contents

Euron Greyjoy, aka Crow's Eye 

 

 

 

 

Hehe another POV? Poor George. 

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9 hours ago, BlackLightning said:

I can't disagree. I believe there's going to be second Kingsmoot in A Dream of Spring...one that will end in blood and will trigger an Ironborn civil war.

Euron (with Cersei somehow passively supporting or upholding his claim) vs. Victarion (Daenerys is not likely to support Victarion if it means usurping/killing Theon and Asha) vs. Theon and Asha

Or maybe it's Euron and Cersei vs. all the other Greyjoys

Though a war between Victarion and Euron would be incredible to witness, I am still strongly convinced that Victarion won't make it pas his third or fourth chapter. He may already be dead for all we know. People have been suggesting that the fact that George has mentioned working on Victarion is evidence that he'll live until at least the end of TWOW or further. I think not. He has mentioned working on no less than 14 POVs in just a few months, so I think he was just quickly revising a Victarion chapter, as he would have done on an Asha chapter, or an Areoh. 

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14 hours ago, The Bard of Banefort said:

If Aeron survives, I believe he will spend TWOW trying to restore Theon to the Seastone Chair. Take this scene from The Forsaken:

This is right before Aeron is captured, and he's still in denial. But as many of the other lords pointed out before the kingsmoot, the answer is plain: the Seastone Chair by rights belongs to Theon. He's the one person with a stronger claim than Asha or Euron, and certainly Victarion, and he's the only one who can still contest the results of the kingsmoot, since it occurred without his knowledge. 

We've already seen a huge change in Aeron by the end of the chapter. I wrote about my interpretation over in the Aeron thread: 

If Aeron wants to take down Euron, then he needs to put the driftwood crown on his nephew's head. Based on what we've seen thus far, I believe he will soon come to accept this.

I don t think theon can rule the IB and anyone that him wouldn t chose him as their leader.

Don t forget we are talking about someone that looks like an old man, traumatized, without some fingers and probably an eunuch. I can't see IB wanting to follow someone like him.

I think it is much more likely that the IB will renouce their independance and form an alliance with the north via asha. There are plenty of IB in the north, they still have some castle and the northmen do need men for their army against the others. Besides, IB would be useful to comand the fleet the manderlys have been building.

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2 minutes ago, divica said:

I don t think theon can rule the IB and anyone that him wouldn t chose him as their leader.

Don t forget we are talking about someone that looks like an old man, traumatized, without some fingers and probably an eunuch. I can't see IB wanting to follow someone like him.

I think it is much more likely that the IB will renouce their independance and form an alliance with the north via asha. There are plenty of IB in the north, they still have some castle and the northmen do need men for their army against the others. Besides, IB would be useful to comand the fleet the manderlys have been building.

I'm guessing we'll see Theon regain more of his sanity as the story goes on. Theon looks like an old man, but you can also argue that he looks like a Drowned man--Aeron went from being young and comely to looking twice his age, but the IB are spiritual, and they revere him for his transformation. That's why it's essential that he puts his support behind Theon. 

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15 hours ago, Table8 said:

Bran. Though it won’t be explicit.

That's a very good idea. I love it.

I can see it happening. We've already gotten some major hints that Euron is a skinchanger. My head canon is that Euron was Bloodraven's original candidate to be the next Three-Eyed-Crow but something happened, Euron was deemed ineligible and Bran was chosen.

I like the idea of Euron being mortal enemies of both Daenerys and Bran. Adds to the ice and fire theme. And it makes him that much more dangerous to the rest of the world. Who wants an evil, twisted man like Euron to become the Three-Eyed-Crow, knowing that he would basically become omnipresent, omniscient and maybe even omnipotent.

7 hours ago, The Winged Griffin said:

Though a war between Victarion and Euron would be incredible to witness, I am still strongly convinced that Victarion won't make it pas his third or fourth chapter. He may already be dead for all we know. People have been suggesting that the fact that George has mentioned working on Victarion is evidence that he'll live until at least the end of TWOW or further. I think not. He has mentioned working on no less than 14 POVs in just a few months, so I think he was just quickly revising a Victarion chapter, as he would have done on an Asha chapter, or an Areoh. 

I think Victarion will make it to A Dream of Spring. I think he won't make it past his third or fourth chapter in A Dream of Spring. But he'll survive The Winds of Winter.

Think about it. Daenerys has to destroy the entire system of slavery. She can't do that without conquering and/or subjugating all of Essos. Daenerys has a massive army but it's all land-based. She (and we) need Victarion not only for transportation but to take the cities of Lys and Tyrosh and to bend the knees of the pirates of the Stepstones. I'm sure Yi-Ti and Asshai and the other nations east of the Bone Mountains will abolish slavery and pay homage to her without too much effort on her part. But Lys? Tyrosh? Myr? Pentos?

A slave rebellion will work in Volantis or Norvos. It won't work in Lys, Myr or Tyrosh where the free outnumber the enslaved. And it won't work in Pentos where the ratio of free versus slave is almost equal.

Since we don't have the time or the pages for Daenerys to go to every Free City and since GRRM is a writer who "shows, not tells," Victarion will be the POV we need to see the fall of Lys.

Besides, we have to go to Lys anyways. Not only are Jorah's ex-wife and Edric Storm there, but it's the birthplace of Varys...allegedly. GRRM promised us that we would know the truth about Varys in A Dream of Spring and I feel we can't do that without paying Lys of visit. There's also a lot of pureblood descendants of Valyrians there which would address some other ongoing subplots regarding the Doom and the Targaryen dynasty.

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