More on America's Obesity Problem

[alguien]

That being said, I agree with a lot of what Swordfish has said in this thread about exercise in small quantities. I totally don't get the all-or-nothing approach to exercise that some people take. If you're not running a marathon, is it not worthwhile? I would say that, calorie-burning aside, the other benefits to light-moderate exercise are tangible: having an improved mood, for instance, since depression is going to make some people less likely to want to improve their health in other ways. Not contributing to air pollution (which makes being outside more pleasant for people who do want to train for a marathon. Etc.

I can't begin to say how much I agree with this. Even when I'm only able to get in 15 minutes of jogging, I sleep way better, feel better, and even (dare I say) look better.

Putting weight loss and "exercise vs. diet" purely as a calorie-in >/<calories-out equation is misguided. [ETA: not to say that this isn't significant way of measuring things]

Anyway, related to the larger topic at hand, one thing I've learned is that my walking vs. driving perspective completely shifts when I'm in Chicago as opposed to when I go back to Michigan to visit my folks. Whereas normally I would walk/bike to anything within 3-5 miles of me in the Windy City, I find myself automatically reaching for the keys to my parents car if I'm going anywhere in Kalamazoo.

Another, when I've lived abroad, whether it be in Ireland, Peru, or Costa Rica, I've always lost at least 20 lbs. (oddly, a lot of my female co-students put on weight in Ireland... but that might be because they'd never had experience regularly drinking Guinness before) Whether it was due to lack of all the HFCS products around or all the walking we did, I would lose tons of weight without trying.

America makes me fatter.

[Ser Scot A Ellison]

Odie,

Respectfully, you get used to being a bit hungry when you eat less. I've been eating smaller portions and refraining from seconds. I recognize that it's really hard to do. All I can say is good luck.

[Tormund Ukrainesbane]

I have cut my daily calories to about 1200-1500 daily to compensate for my desk job. I was really hungry at first, but my body has gotten used to it. Combined with exercise I look like an entirely different person than I did 6 weeks ago.

[TerraPrime]

So, when does the contradiction of "calories in < calories out, oh wait, no I don't REALLY mean that..." start?

There are right ways, and there are wrong ways, to achieve calories in < calories out.

The way you argue this point is like saying people telling you that you can save money if you earn more than you spend should support your plan to stop paying all the bills. Well, you have achieved what they want you to do, haven't you, by stopping your payment to all your bills? So why are you in a worse financial state than before? Clearly, they are wrong!

[Odie]

Yeah, all true - but just look at the size of Chipotle Burritos - who thinks they're not getting a ton of calories in that thing? I wouldn't recommend Chipotle to anyone trying to reduce their caloric intake. Also how many people are able to finish an entire fully loaded Chipotle burrito? I do, but judging by many lunches at Chipotle with friends, think I'm in the minority.

It depends on what you get. A veggie burrito bowl with mild tomato salsa is 640 calories and 60 grams or carbs, and that's with cheese and sour cream. That's what I usually get there, and I see no problem with this.

http://www.chipotlefan.com/index.php?id=nutrition_calculator

Of course, it would be easy to go over that.

From the information I got from the nutritionist I saw in June, 45-60 carbs a meal is a good target. The second one said that's more a guideline for Type 2 diabetics, but I'm still using this as a goal regardless.

[Odie]

Which artificial sweetners? I am very interested in Stevia and am even frowing my own.

I give up Coke, but drink a ton of tea sweetened with Splenda. This can not be nearly as bad. I mean every one says calories in v. calories out, and using artificial sweetners is zero calories in, so how can they possibly make you fat?

I question this as well. Zero/minimal calories has to be better than the super calories in your average non-diet soda.

[Ser Scot A Ellison]

Odie,

Resturant food, generally, is not a great way to lose weight.

[Insert Edit]

As a male, when I was on my program I didn't count calories at all, just fat grams. I lost usually 4 pounds a week. That Chipotle burrito with sour cream will no doubt have about a whole day's fat in it.

As for non calorie drinks (which I'm trying to eliminate from my diet) what my understanding is - they fool your body into slowing its metabolism. So even though they're 0 calories, they make it harder for you to lose weight (or easier to gain weight).

I was allowed diet soda, but I had to drink an equivalent in water at the same time.

[Odie]

You're confusing hunger with appetite.

Then please explain the difference.

[Nichole]

I question this as well. Zero/minimal calories has to be better than the super calories in your average non-diet soda.

I think it is up to personal choice. We really don't know for certain if artificial sweeteners are bad for us or how bad. Personally, the idea of artificial sweeteners weird me out, plus I don't really like the taste. But, yeah no longer drinking tons of sugar a day, that is an improvement. We all make sacrifices when we decide to live healthier and you just need to find what is right for you. If drinking diet Coke instead of regular works for you, I say go for it.

[Odie]

There are right ways, and there are wrong ways, to achieve calories in < calories out.

The way you argue this point is like saying people telling you that you can save money if you earn more than you spend should support your plan to stop paying all the bills. Well, you have achieved what they want you to do, haven't you, by stopping your payment to all your bills? So why are you in a worse financial state than before? Clearly, they are wrong!

Not really, because your body will "pay the bills" ie, cover the calories it needs by using your reserve stores, naturally. To make your analogy work, you would need some kind of a direct withdrawl system set up to pull the funds to pay your bills out of savings or somesuch.

[Odie]

Odie,

Resturant food, generally, is not a great way to lose weight.

Generally, you're right. That doesn't mean there are no acceptable options available.

[Swordfish]

So, when does the contradiction of "calories in < calories out, oh wait, no I don't REALLY mean that..." start?

Eating less most certainly be done. Hunger (which has also been full of contradictions on this board) sucks, but I guess if we're supposed to eat less than what our bodies want to eat, it's a part of life.

It's not your body that wants it. It's your brain.

Our brains want all kinds of things that are bad for us.

You can lead a horse to water, but apparently you can't make it stop making excuses about why it doesn't want to drink.

[Odie]

I think it is up to personal choice. We really don't know for certain if artificial sweeteners are bad for us or how bad. Personally, the idea of artificial sweeteners weird me out, plus I don't really like the taste. But, yeah no longer drinking tons of sugar a day, that is an improvement. We all make sacrifices when we decide to live healthier and you just need to find what is right for you. If drinking diet Coke instead of regular works for you, I say go for it.

It's more Crystal Lite over fruit juice or other options with supper. I'd rather that than having to drink water with Every Single Meal. Then at least there's some flavor and I'll be less likely to get frustrated over the whole thing.

[Odie]

It's not your body that wants it. It's your brain.

Our brains want all kinds of things that are bad for us.

You can lead a horse to water, but apparently you can't make it stop making excuses about why it doesn't want to drink.

What excuses are you referring to?

I do understand the difference in feeling between my brain telling me I want something and the physical sensation of hunger. The first is "Go eat that cupcake, it looks tasty!" the latter is "Your stomach is empty and you should fill it." It's independant of outside stimuli, at least in its most basic form. If you are physically hungry, the brain compulsions can be harder to ignore.

[Ixodes]

I think it is up to personal choice. We really don't know for certain if artificial sweeteners are bad for us or how bad. Personally, the idea of artificial sweeteners weird me out, plus I don't really like the taste. But, yeah no longer drinking tons of sugar a day, that is an improvement. We all make sacrifices when we decide to live healthier and you just need to find what is right for you. If drinking diet Coke instead of regular works for you, I say go for it.

Artificial sweeteners have some weird effects. Here is an interesting review article, for those interested.

Essentially the calorie issue is a no brainer -- reducing your calories is beneficial. So if you are going to drink soda you will get less soda calories by choosing diet drinks. But one of the side effects of artificial sweeteners is that they stimulate appetite. So the calories you save by drinking diet soda will be lost from eating more throughout the day.

If you are trying to lose weight and you feel hungry all the time, you are making the problem worse if you consume artificial sweeteners.

[TerraPrime]

Not really, because your body will "pay the bills" ie, cover the calories it needs by using your reserve stores, naturally. To make your analogy work, you would need some kind of a direct withdrawl system set up to pull the funds to pay your bills out of savings or somesuch.

I think you're missing the point of my attempted analogy.

There are right, and wrong, ways to get more money. Some ways are legitimate, and some are not.

Similarly, there are right, and wrong, ways to re-balance your calorie intake so you expend more than what you consume. Some ways are legitimate, and some are not. The right plan will also differ from person to person depending on their specific situation. This is the point that you can't seem to concede.

[Guest Raidne]

Right, plus, if you have a history of overeating, you will be physically hungry for however long it takes for your stomach, etc. to readjust.

ETA: You can try to negate this by filling up with low calorie things, but for me it's better to just tough it out and drink lots of coffee for the appetite supressing effect.

[Tormund Ukrainesbane]

"Your stomach is empty and you should fill it." It's independant of outside stimuli, at least in its most basic form. If you are physically hungry, the brain compulsions can be harder to ignore.

Your stomach is stretchy. That sensation is the feeling of it contracting. If you put less in it on a regular basis, your mind will assume a different "default" amount of stretchiness, and you'll be less hungry on less food.

[drawkcabi]

I am having the hardest time with drinking water. The water here tastes terrible, it really grosses me out and for about a week once every coulple of months it tastes full of chlorine. There's even been an ongoing story in the local newspaper about something that was buried years ago and has been polluting the water only a few miles from here.

I've tried using filters but they don't help much. I can go the bottled water route but I hate the idea of all those bottles going into a land fill.

I may have to start looking into getting a water cooler service, until then I just can't drink the stuff without adding something to it like crystal light, but I also hate artificial sweetners, the after taste is what gets me, I also hate any kind of ice tea sugar sweetend or artificially sweetened or whatever. So more often than not I use kool-aid, and that's something I know I need to stop.