Jim Butcher #2 SPOILERS!

[Kouran]

If Queens and Ladies are bound by their very nature, how is it the events of Summer Knight unfolded? I haven't seen a lot of dogs empower sharks with the destruction of their packs in mind so that they may end the suffering inflicted upon fleas.

Ok to answer this question

It is pretty evident if you read Summer Knight and look for it that Aurora was acted on by an outside agency, also her madness is a reflection of her acting against her nature. Just as the Leansidhe's madness was a result of acting outside her nature. My gut feel is that the Black Council was behind Aurora's madness and prodded her along the path of trying to upset the balance of the world by permanently weakening Summer.

[alguien]

So why does Harry think Fitz looks familiar?

[Spaceman Hobbes]

So why does Harry think Fitz looks familiar?

I'll go crackpot here. Fitz is Cowl.

[AverageGuy]

So why does Harry think Fitz looks familiar?

Fitz is Morgan's bastard. Points of evidence:

1) Fitz is a bastard

- It's in his name.

2) Fitz is Morgan's specifically

- Fitz has red hair.

- Morgan had red hair (I may have made this up).

QED.

[Spaceman Hobbes]

As awesome as that would be, can you really picture Morgan having sex?

If so I'm sorry for you. Pervert

On the subject of Cowl I would absolutely love for it to turn out to be anyone who isn't a time travelling Winter Knight. That said, he's totally Harry.

[Contrarius]

Morgan didn't have red hair. I'm not in the mood to look it up right now, but maybe some other time. Sorry to burst that bubble. ;)

[Zelgrath]

The people on the butcher boards think that Fitz is

the bastard (fitz = bastard) of MacFin (the loup garou) and Tera West because he has irish (scottish?) features (red hair) and native american skin tones and possible similar eyes to tera.

It's all speculation so I don't know if it needs a spoiler but I'll put it in since it's ghost story related.

[TheKassi]

Ok to answer this question

It is pretty evident if you read Summer Knight and look for it that Aurora was acted on by an outside agency, also her madness is a reflection of her acting against her nature. Just as the Leansidhe's madness was a result of acting outside her nature. My gut feel is that the Black Council was behind Aurora's madness and prodded her along the path of trying to upset the balance of the world by permanently weakening Summer.

What outside force do you mean? I do not think a finger was pointed.

[kmgrey]

I thought Ghost Story was a mixed bag. I appreciated some of Harry's character development and having to face up to some of his rash actions from the previous book, even if he was *way* too hard himself at times. I also liked the development of Molly along with more moral ambiguity than normal in the situations that Molly and also Fitz and his crew were in. Didn't like Fitz as a character though- just a complete stereotype and not up to Butcher's normal supporting character standards.

The reveal of whodunnit was kind of clever, but it also made the book itself feel almost pointless and unnecessary.

Also, the pop culture stuff is starting to get excessive. The use of Star Trek was actually pretty well done but the Saving Private Ryan sequence just felt lazy. In fact most of the finale was flat. Butcher's has had so many insane 100+ page action sequences recently that this one felt like more of an obligation but didn't have the creative juice to make it stand up. Most of the finale could have been cut without hurting the book at all.

Finally, I wish I could stop Butcher from ever using "blink" to describe a character's reaction ever again. He used it 80 times in this book!

[Kouran]

What outside force do you mean? I do not think a finger was pointed.

It is just supposition at this point, but I would point the outside agent as being the Black Council. It would be in keeping with their moves to disrupt the existing powers. If you think back and recall that Cowl gave Bianca the athame in Grave Peril, that was in turn given to the Leansidhe which drove her crazy it points pretty solidly to the BC being a big power disruption team. What ever the BC's end game turns out to be they have gone about stirring up chaos everywhere.

So lets look at the things they have done. Gave the athame to Bianca who in turn gave it to Leansidhe, Lean goes crazy and has to be put down by Mad, Cowl and Kumori work to create the Darkhallow (side note Cowl still knows how to do this, but for some reason hasnt, or has he?), BC attack Arctis Tor and really piss Mab off, BC support coup of the white court, BC murders a senior council member and pin the deed on Morgan.

The BC looks more and more like a small team of power players who are pulling strings behind the scenes to disrupt the status quo, because when everything goes to hell in a handbasket its much easier to grab power. I would pin Aurora's actions squarely on the BC.

[Former Lord of Winterfell]

2) Fitz is Morgan's specifically

- Fitz has red hair.

- Morgan had red hair (I may have made this up).

QED.

For some reason, this cracked me up. Most of us in various threads go to great pains to craft these clever arguments, but AG just comes right out and admits he probably made something up, right when he's pimping his own theory.

That's just damn refreshing!

[Tormund Ukrainesbane]

Ok, I finished Ghost Story this morning. Very melancholy, kinda sad to see all of Harry's friends on what appears to be the edge of sanity. (Except Butters, who kicks ass).

This one was one of the episodic editions, which I enjoy. Sure we learned a bunch of stuff, but no big "the world is ending" plot. Just regular detective stuff, take down the bad guy, go Team Dresden kinda stuff.

As far as cryptic messages and individuals

Who talked to Harry?

I don't think that you can really doubt that it's Lasciel. Butcher said in an interview that her story wasn't done, and also that she appeared in the book, but not by name. Harry gave her coin to Forthill, and then Harry even shows Fitz where the secret wallspace is in Forthill's room. Who says Lasciel's coin isn't sitting in there?

The Parasite

I think this is Lash (not Lasciel). Demonreach said "Mab gave you breath, Here provided nourishment, The Parasite maintained the flow of blood." Nourishment was coming from the tree-root-IV things. Lash has been able to make Harry's body do stuff in the past. I think she is still inhabiting his brain (being a parasite to the eyes of Demonreach) and made his heart keep pumping.

[Kouran]

Ok, I finished Ghost Story this morning. Very melancholy, kinda sad to see all of Harry's friends on what appears to be the edge of sanity. (Except Butters, who kicks ass).

This one was one of the episodic editions, which I enjoy. Sure we learned a bunch of stuff, but no big "the world is ending" plot. Just regular detective stuff, take down the bad guy, go Team Dresden kinda stuff.

As far as cryptic messages and individuals

Who talked to Harry?

I don't think that you can really doubt that it's Lasciel. Butcher said in an interview that her story wasn't done, and also that she appeared in the book, but not by name. Harry gave her coin to Forthill, and then Harry even shows Fitz where the secret wallspace is in Forthill's room. Who says Lasciel's coin isn't sitting in there?

The Parasite

I think this is Lash (not Lasciel). Demonreach said "Mab gave you breath, Here provided nourishment, The Parasite maintained the flow of blood." Nourishment was coming from the tree-root-IV things. Lash has been able to make Harry's body do stuff in the past. I think she is still inhabiting his brain (being a parasite to the eyes of Demonreach) and made his heart keep pumping.

Tormund,

Spoiler 1:

Yeah I dont doubt that it was Lasciel talking to Harry. The only other fallen we have seen use shadows though was Anduriel which means it could have been Nic, just a thought.

Spoiler 2:

That's an interesting take on the parasite. I cant wait to see how this all shakes out.

[polishgenius]

The reason I don't think it's Lash/Lasciel is because there's no benefit to her in Harry either dying or giving in to Mab- unless the whisper was a backfired attempt to get him to pick up the coin. Word of Butcher, however, says that Nicodemus is terrified of Harry after their last encounter, so he'd need no excuse to nullify him any way possible.

[Tormund Ukrainesbane]

The reason I don't think it's Lash/Lasciel is because there's no benefit to her in Harry either dying or giving in to Mab- unless the whisper was a backfired attempt to get him to pick up the coin. Word of Butcher, however, says that Nicodemus is terrified of Harry after their last encounter, so he'd need no excuse to nullify him any way possible.

Harry specifically mentioned considering Lasciel's coin along with perfoming the Darkhallow and becoming the Winter Knight. Perhaps Lasciel thought he would take up the coin. Alternatively, perhaps Lasciel can't try to tempt anyone else since Harry touched the coin, and is trying to kill him in order to get back in business

[TheKassi]

It is just supposition at this point, but I would point the outside agent as being the Black Council. It would be in keeping with their moves to disrupt the existing powers. If you think back and recall that Cowl gave Bianca the athame in Grave Peril, that was in turn given to the Leansidhe which drove her crazy it points pretty solidly to the BC being a big power disruption team. What ever the BC's end game turns out to be they have gone about stirring up chaos everywhere.

So lets look at the things they have done. Gave the athame to Bianca who in turn gave it to Leansidhe, Lean goes crazy and has to be put down by Mad, Cowl and Kumori work to create the Darkhallow (side note Cowl still knows how to do this, but for some reason hasnt, or has he?), BC attack Arctis Tor and really piss Mab off, BC support coup of the white court, BC murders a senior council member and pin the deed on Morgan.

The BC looks more and more like a small team of power players who are pulling strings behind the scenes to disrupt the status quo, because when everything goes to hell in a handbasket its much easier to grab power. I would pin Aurora's actions squarely on the BC.

These events, even if one concedes your summation of all of them (I would argue you are taking Leansidhe's description of her lust for power as insanity too literally.) doesn't really explain how the Black Council manipulated the Summer Lady on such a profound level. That said, I would argue that the ability to be manipulated has a prerequisite. The ability to choose something other then instinctual reaction.

The Parasite

I think this is Lash (not Lasciel). Demonreach said "Mab gave you breath, Here provided nourishment, The Parasite maintained the flow of blood." Nourishment was coming from the tree-root-IV things. Lash has been able to make Harry's body do stuff in the past. I think she is still inhabiting his brain (being a parasite to the eyes of Demonreach) and made his heart keep pumping.

That is actually quite plausible. An impressive pulling together of details. Hope you are wrong, but still impressive.

[Dragons Dancing]

My take on whether Lash has a role in Ghost Story - Not

Dresden was shot in the chest near his heart by someone who does not miss. So there was some major heart damage. If the blood circulation was maintained by a beating heart, then Mab must have healed his heart almost instantly. And Mab was apparently providing "breath". If she can do all that, then causing the heart to beat is trivial. On top of that, the freaking tree can somehow magically grow conduits into Harry's blood vessels. If the tree can magically do that, it should be easy for it to also circulate the blood. Either way, there is no need to involve Lash to circulate the blood. If Butcher does write Lash into there for no good reason, then it is just lame. I hope he does not.

The problem with saying one of the Denerians is responsible for whispering to Dresden is the simple fact nothing they do qualifies as cheating. They exist in balance with the Knights and are free to maim, deceive, kill, and subvert to their black heart's content. Another reason to exclude the Denerians is because something so subtle would not really be practical at that moment and time for them. If they wanted him dead and managed to get that close to him, then why waste the breath? Just bash his head in and be done with it. As for Lash specifically, assuming that she even survived giving up her 'life' for Dresen, what would she gain by getting Dresden to kill himself? The entire purpose of the Shadow of Lasciel is to subvert Dresden so he will take up the coin; killing him would be quite counterproductive.

The truth is that Uriel's care to avoid saying the Fallen's name makes it clear who he is talking about. Think about how in Small Favors, Mab takes great care to refer to the archangels by titles and not by names, even cautioning Dresden about saying Uriel's name. How in Changes, the Erlking warned Dresden about the consequences about saying Mab's name a third time. To put all that it into context, the idiom "speak of the Devil" is more than just a turn of phrase in the Dresdenverse, and quite literal in this moment and time. It was the Prince of Darkness cheating in Small Favors that dragged Uriel into the story, and it seems the Prince of Darkness cheating in Changes dragged Uriel back in again.

[polishgenius]

Since the post title has Spoilers in it, I am not spoilering this. Don't read if you do not want SPOILERS.

In fairness though, it's spoilers for the whole series. It's soon enough after the release that it's probably fair to spoiler it, no?

You're right, it could be the devil (what was that about him in Small Favour though? I don't recall that). It definitely isn't Nicodemus, though- Uriel's description says it's purely the Fallen, not one of the possessed Denarians, though I don't know if there's a reason it could not be the one possessing Nic. It could also be someone we've not come across before at all; there's no reason why it has to be one of the Fallen of the coins; surely there were more than thirty of them, righ?

[Zelgrath]

Someone comes to the conclusion in small favor that only an arch angel has the power to drive the trap they use to capture ivy. The only fallen arch angel that would work with the denarians is assumed to be satan.

[Maia]

Some spoilery stuff:

I liked how meltdown of various friends of Harry turned out to be due mostly to their sadness and issues re: his death and not that they were not powerful / competent enough to keep the things together without him, as seemed initially.

OTOH - when will Murphy finally become Knight of the Sword?!! Her reluctance was contrived to begin with, but now it has become just blatantly stupid. If other wielders were so intransigent, the swords would have been been all but useless. Enough dancing around it, really.

Hopefully, Molly will finally explain the truth about Harry's failed assassination to her now.

As somebody who had been annoyed with Harry's kid-gloved handling of Molly and her relative uselessness after so many years of apprenticeship, I was very glad that, yes, it turns out that Harry had been holding her back significantly. Too bad that Lea will stop training her now. that he is back.

Also, if Harry, who is superb at destructive magic, always carried a firearm, why doesn't Molly, whose talents lie elsewhere, do the same? It would complement her skill-set even better than Harry's. She could be really dangerous that way and less likely to be forced to break the Law of magic when going against human villains.

I was very relieved that we didn't get any Molly/Harry romance either and I fervently hope that this issue is off the table permanently.

Hopefully, something will be done to legalize Molly's status with the Council, though - Harry really should have thought of it prior to the events in Changes. He himself was allowed to become independant after a couple of years with McCoy. Yes, I know, nepotism, but still... Of course, the whole Ragged Lady act isn't going to help, now.

Also, pseudo-killing Butters is getting old.

Fitz... yea seemed stereotypical and relatively boring, whereas Morty and Ser Stuart were superb, IMHO. Of course, Fitz was mostly there to get Harry to reminisce, so as long as he doesn't become too important, it's OK. He can't become Harry's apprentice, thankfully, as Harry didn't think that he had any latent magical talent for him to use.

Not that Harry will be in position to take apprentices, as a Winter Knight. I hope.

The loophole wasn't unexpected, but I do hope that Harry can't go back to juggling his old life with being a Winter Knight. There has to be some price, even if not quite as awful as what he envisioned.

I loved, loved the explanation re: why Harry was always left handling various villains with a ragged group of unlikely helpers instead of getting help from the Council.

It seemed quite Gary Stuish at times, so it was great that it turned out that for the most part the issues were just too complicated to charge into and only Harry was short-sighted enough to jump in, with nary a thought for the bigger picture/long-term consequences. Priceless ;).

Anyway, can't wait for... Cold Days, is it? The scene is set for some extremely interesting developements.