[Book Spoilers] EP103 Discussion

[Ser Kevan Raley]

I felt sorry for Ned in that scene as he was thoughtful in giving his daughter the doll, even if he wasn't tuned in to what she would appreciate. I wasn't happy with Sansa for being so ungrateful.

Even though I'm not the biggest Sansa fan at this point (like many other readers I didn't begin to feel sympathy for her until later) it should be obvious that you don't give a doll to a teenager. Unless you're Eddard "clueless" Stark, that is. And I can understand her being "ungrateful" since she's still upset about Lady's death - at her father's hand no less. Yeah, it was either him or Ilyn Payne, but still...

[LugaJetboyGirl]

I felt sorry for Ned in that scene as he was thoughtful in giving his daughter the doll, even if he wasn't tuned in to what she would appreciate. I wasn't happy with Sansa for being so ungrateful.

I don't know. As an ungrateful daughter, I can understand Sansa. Sure, it's nice that Ned gave her a gift, but did he even try to think about what she might actually like? It emphasizes that he knows nothing about her and that so far he has done a pretty crappy job of bothering to get to know her. "Here, have a doll." It's the sort of gift that says "I don't see you as a real person."

I wish Bran was getting more love in this thread. His only scene was phenomenal. Bran is postively otherworldly.

[Volderon]

I wish Bran was getting more love in this thread. His only scene was phenomenal. Bran is postively otherworldly.

Because Bran is boring? He had one scene but I didn't think it was anything special at all. Since most of us have read the books, we know the outcome of his story and it may make it boring to some people, and it's probably the POV that GRRM writes the less.

Sure Old Nan was amazing but yeah...

[sweetrobin]

My initial thought when Ned was watching Arya "waterdance" was that he saw his daughter acting so much like Lyanna. In the book series, we know that Lyanna was known for her abilities with horses though, not with swords. I think when Neds face turns to dread, he is therefore recalling a time when Lyanna might have fought with a sword, notably, as the Knight of the Laughing Tree at the Harrenhal Tourney.

[Mazikeen]

Finally watched the episode today, twice, and told my mother who hasn't read the book to start watching the series. I really enjoyed it, my biggest complain is a lack of cohesiveness and the timelines being muddled here and there (there is only one council meeting, but the way that part is edited may make it seem like two).

• The sets are great. King's Landing is slightly different than I envisioned it, but I liked it very much and the marked difference between what we've seen so far in the North. Someone made a good point that it's a little too similar with Pentos, perhaps, but they are on the same latitude so it makes sense that the climate is similar, and perhaps the architecture as well.
  
• I like the TV version of Cersei, a lot. To me she doesn't come across as "too smart" or "too composed", I think she's just fine at this point and a strong female character that is needed since they took the edge out of Catelyn a little (sniff). The only things that didn't fit so well was that bit about whores and virgin noble girls in her conversation with Joffrey, considering that this is what she has to suffer from Robert. Also I'd like to see her a little more relaxed and affectionate with Jaime.
  
• I think the Dany/Viserys scene in the grass was well-handled. In the books we get Dany's internal monologue to show us her change in perspective regarding Viserys and a lot of little details they couldn't have fitted in the TV series. So this scene served to show Dany that Viserys is not quite as scary and dangerous and she now has people to protect her, so I can well see that in the next episodes she'll start to actually stand up to him.
  
• Loved the interactions between Rakharo and the handmaiden in both scenes - Rakharo's look of disbelief and her tiny shrug when she relays Dany's order not to hurt Viserys, then the entire conversation about rabbits and ducks and dogs. Spoken Dothraki sounds really good and fits very well. The only nitpick is that the handmaiden should probably have been mounted, to better emphasize the humiliation of Viserys being made to walk, but then there wouldn't have been anyone to help Dany mount I guess.
  
• Catelyn wears a silver fish pin on her dress when she arrives in KL, nice touch.
  
• Interesting scene between Ser Jorah and Rakharo, maybe a hint that taking back Seven Kingdoms with a horde of Dothraki screamers may not be as easy as Viserys makes it sound, since their weapons are likely ineffective against heavy armour.
  
• I think the brothel where Littlefinger takes Cat is Chataya's, there's a baby crying in the background and several dark-skinned women.
  
• I really cannot make out what Ned's last line is in the scene with him and Jaimie. "You served him well. *something something* safe". Also, why is the floor in the throne room so dirty?
  
• I very much like this new Yoren and his bear's balls.
  
• Varys and Pycelle are perrr-fect. I expected Littlefinger to be better dressed (or at least more colourful) and with less stubble. He works very well otherwise.
  
• Benjen seemed a touch overdramatic on the Wall. Also, no frosty breath when he and Jon were talking, and generally very little of it in the Castle Black scenes.
  

[Kalbear]

I really cannot make out what Ned's last line is in the scene with him and Jaimie. "You served him well. *something something* safe". Also, why is the floor in the throne room so dirty?

"You served him well...when serving was safe".

[Yvone]

Even though I'm not the biggest Sansa fan at this point (like many other readers I didn't begin to feel sympathy for her until later) it should be obvious that you don't give a doll to a teenager. Unless you're Eddard "clueless" Stark, that is. And I can understand her being "ungrateful" since she's still upset about Lady's death - at her father's hand no less. Yeah, it was either him or Ilyn Payne, but still...

I can understand her reason for being so upset and I won't argue that Ned doesn't know his daughter well enough to know what she'd appreciate or to realise that she's too old for a doll. It's still the sentiment that counted for me because for his part, he didn't have much of a choice in Lady's death and there wasn't a lot he could do to make up for it. A lot of dads are clueless about an appropriate gift for a child, so I put it down to that... that Ned is one of those dads. Doesn't mean he didn't care for his daughter. And while I understand why Sansa reacted as she did to it, I felt for Ned on seeing the expression on his face. I wonder if Sansa would have felt differently if she had caught that.

[madking]

I love how Ned gives Sansa the older sister a doll and Arya a sword trainer. Nice contrast

[Xanrn]

Well he had Lyanna sister, no female cousins and his mother was gone for alot of his life.

Not suprising he gets Arya and not Sansa.

That conversation between Joffrey and Cersei, made me feal sorry for the little shit and then want to applaud him.

Joffrey of all people gets a standing army trained by veterans is better than armed peasants, holy crap. Is that to setup some sort of Young Wolf vs Young Lionag.

Lyanna didn't fight with a sword as the Knight of the Laughing Tree, she jousted the 3 Stooges, she did beat up their squires with a sword when saving Howland.

It was probably more of remembering what Lyanna picking up a sword caused, hence the Battle sound effects.

[NW Deserter]

Just rewatched the episode. The last few seconds gave me chills...the music's crescendo, the steel ringing on top of the wooden clacking, Ned's expression changing...extremely deep, poetic, and magnificently done scene. Stuff like this tells me that D&D simply get this series.

Side note: all the episodes are even better the second time. When the DVDs are released, I'm gonna be wearing them out!

[RedWeddingCake]

I find it amusing that some posters on here expect Lord Stark to understand Sansa. She is lost to him. The guy isn't Metro at all.

[Xray the Enforcer]

I don't know. As an ungrateful daughter, I can understand Sansa. Sure, it's nice that Ned gave her a gift, but did he even try to think about what she might actually like? It emphasizes that he knows nothing about her and that so far he has done a pretty crappy job of bothering to get to know her. "Here, have a doll." It's the sort of gift that says "I don't see you as a real person."

I wish Bran was getting more love in this thread. His only scene was phenomenal. Bran is postively otherworldly.

Yep, that's exactly how I interpret the scene as well. Ned's out of touch and while his heart was in the right place, he utterly failed to think of Sansa as a person -- rather, he evaluated her as "generic girl-child."

[L’Age d’or]

I love how Ned gives Sansa the older sister a doll and Arya a sword trainer. Nice contrast

Actually its not that simple, Ned learned two lessons after talking to Sansa and Arya. From his exchange with Sana he realized his oldest daughter is not a kid anymore and from his dialogue with Arya he finally came to get along with Arya's different personality, hence the recruitment of a sword master for her.

[Ayx]

Just finished watching the episode and just only question I have is "Why?!". "Why Russian for Syrio's accent?"

With the sophisticated courtesans, the dueling culture, the pleasure barges slowly floating along the canals, Braavos almost unmistakeably evoke Italy, Venice or such. I mean even the name Syrio is Italian sounding.

Italian accent like

would have been perfect. But now every time Syrio speaks I see Borat with a sword. Maybe actor could not do Italian accent? But they can find so many Italian sounding actors for Sopranos.

[iheartseverus]

Just finished watching the episode and just only question I have is "Why?!". "Why Russian for Syrio's accent?"

With the sophisticated courtesans, the dueling culture, the pleasure barges slowly floating along the canals, Braavos almost unmistakeably evoke Italy, Venice or such. I mean even the name Syrio is Italian sounding.

Italian accent like

would have been perfect. But now every time Syrio speaks I see Borat with a sword. Maybe actor could not do Italian accent? But they can find so many Italian sounding actors for Sopranos.

Actually, I think the accent is Greek. I think I remember hearing that the Syrio actor IS Greek. Also that he's trained in fencing techniques. So, Greek seems okay-ish to me, Mediterranian warmish climates and such.

[unJon]

Loved the episode. Am not at all bothered by the missing or added stuff that is tweaking some people in this thread. I like the added depth of JL's character and think it would have been a mistake to not include this just for the hope of having a bigger "reveal" in season 4 or 5 or 6 or whenever we might have gotten it in AFFC seasons. Also do not think they ruined CL by not making her completely stupid. And no, I don't think it takes away from Tyrion's skillz. Next season it will be easy to keep CL not stupid but still have Tyrion outsmart her.

Miss the direwolves.

Unreasonably bothered by Arya fighting right handed. Anyone else notice she wasn't holding Needle southpaw?

Worried that there are too many disparate story lines for non-book-readers. Most people will expect them to come together for the finale, but they will not. :unsure:

[L’Age d’or]

Just finished watching the episode and just only question I have is "Why?!". "Why Russian for Syrio's accent?"

With the sophisticated courtesans, the dueling culture, the pleasure barges slowly floating along the canals, Braavos almost unmistakeably evoke Italy, Venice or such. I mean even the name Syrio is Italian sounding.

Italian accent like

would have been perfect. But now every time Syrio speaks I see Borat with a sword. Maybe actor could not do Italian accent? But they can find so many Italian sounding actors for Sopranos.

The accent is anything but Russian bro and he is supposed to be a sword fight instructor with a unique style which resembles fencing with an Asian sword play touch, both favoring agility and small builds so he is a very good choice.

[L’Age d’or]

Loved the episode. Am not at all bothered by the missing or added stuff that is tweaking some people in this thread. I like the added depth of JL's character and think it would have been a mistake to not include this just for the hope of having a bigger "reveal" in season 4 or 5 or 6 or whenever we might have gotten it in AFFC seasons. Also do not think they ruined CL by not making her completely stupid. And no, I don't think it takes away from Tyrion's skillz. Next season it will be easy to keep CL not stupid but still have Tyrion outsmart her.

Miss the direwolves.

Unreasonably bothered by Arya fighting right handed. Anyone else notice she wasn't holding Needle southpaw?

Worried that there are too many disparate story lines for non-book-readers. Most people will expect them to come together for the finale, but they will not. :unsure:

She fought left handed bro.

[unJon]

She fought left handed bro.

For realz?

[MojoJojo]

Personally I thought he was rather disappointing. Very, very broadly acted with a cartoonish Mario and Luigi accent. I kept wanting him to break out in song about Pizza and Amore, or talk with his hands about what an e-spicy a-meatball he had for lunch. And its not as if they got this guy for his brilliant stage sword acting or his catlike grace. One of my favorite characters in the book, and when he came out I had to face palm through out his first scene.