Rereading Tyrion VI (ADWD)

[Winterfellian]

I'm a first born son :( This clearly isn't our thread :( :(

Just in case... :leaving:

[Uncat]

Lummel, Ragnorak is right. I was refering to the easter cicle, where Christ rises on the third day. This whole chapter has such a positiv vibe. Tyrion Lannister is finaly reborn. He is back on top of his gaim, playing people orchestrating a cunning escape from certain death. And with Ragnoraks refference to Passover it grows even better.

[Blisscraft]

Jesus was also (to quote Harry Potter) "the boy who lived." As with the Passover where the first born sons were murdered, so too, were the "Holy Innocents" after Jesus was born. All of those first born boys destroyed by prophecy. :crying:

Tyrion seems to be "the boy who lived," too, as he was saved at birth like HP, but not his poor mother, who tragically passed, as did HP's mom.

Sorry about all of the HP references. I have indulged my 11 year old daughter and read them all in the last couple of weeks. :read:

Yes, and what a difference three days make. . .

ETA: What is it that MMD says? Oh yes, "only death can pay for life."

[Uncat]

Elba, you are right, he never once asks his question. It is another thing that adds to the positiv feel of this chapter. He stopped to obsess with the past and started to build his futur. On the third day he rose. He defird death and now he will go and ascent to claim his seat to the right of his father (if you want to stick to the biblical reference)

[Ragnorak]

Tyrion XII ADWD

Summary

We reach our end of our time with Tyrion as he finds himself at a new beginning. The chapter opens with Tyrion having reached an agreement to sign on with the Second Sons. After signing promissory notes for officers of the Second Sons he is allowed to join. Afterwards he fetches Penny and takes her to find armor where they meet Jorah. Jorah thinks that the outlook does not favor the Yunkish forces and Tyrion agrees saying that he'll get the Second Sons to switch sides yet again.

Observations

Oaths, debts and loyalty

Here is your ink. From Old Volantis, this. ’Twill last as long as proper maester’s black.

“In Westeros, the word of a Lannister is considered good as gold.”

Inkpots shrugged. “This is not Westeros. On this side of the narrow sea, we put our promises on paper.”

Debts written on the wind tend to be … forgotten, shall we say?

Let him go on thinking that he’s bent me over and fucked me up the arse, and I’ll go on buying steel swords with parchment dragons.

Some contracts are writ in ink and some in blood.

The outsider

“I think not. Some free companies have been known to take women, but … well, they are not Second Daughters, after all.”

“We,” she said. “If you’re one of them, you should say we, not they.

I recall nine coming up other times in Dance. Jon found nine wildlings in the grove and there are at least two other nines I can’t recall.

“Nasty thing, a crossbow. How many men you kill with that?”

“Nine.” His father counted for at least that many, surely. Lord of Casterly Rock, Warden of the West, Shield of Lannisport, Hand of the King, husband, brother, father, father, father.

Slavery

She was not all wrong. Yezzan’s slaves ate better than many peasants back in the Seven Kingdoms and were less like to starve to death come winter. Slaves were chattels, aye. They could be bought and sold, whipped and branded, used for the carnal pleasure of their owners, bred to make more slaves. In that sense they were no more than dogs or horses. But most lords treated their dogs and horses well enough. Proud men might shout that they would sooner die free than live as slaves, but pride was cheap. When the steel struck the flint, such men were rare as dragon’s teeth; elsewise the world would not have been so full of slaves.

Analysis

Optimism and Echoes

Like last chapter there is an upbeat tone to Tyrion despite the circumstances. It reminds me of his initial enthusiasm when he arrived at Kings Landing. We also have references to the ghosts of Tyrion’s past without any of the haunting feel. He recalls Tysha, Jaime, killing Tywin, meets Kem and revisits his battle on the Blackwater and its fallout, Kem brings up his Singer’s Stew and men being sent to the Wall, and more. Previously these were all things that would put Tyrion into a state of emotional navel gazing often accompanied by a certain blindness. Has he finally decided to face his hard truths?

Penny

While Tyrion still shows concern and protectiveness for Penny his prior almost unconditional sheltering has come to an end.

Tyrion slapped her.

It was a soft blow, all in all, a little flick of the wrist, with hardly any force behind it. It did not even leave a mark upon her cheek. But her eyes filled with tears all the same.

“If you want to dream, go back to sleep,” he told her. “When you wake up, we’ll still be escaped slaves in the middle of a siege. Crunch is dead. The pig as well, most like. Now find some armor and put it on, and never mind where it pinches. The mummer show is over. Fight or hide or shit yourself, as you like, but whatever you decide to do, you’ll do it clad in steel.”

Last chapter we discussed if Tyrion was being paternal to Penny or if his being the leader of a pack was the better assessment. The slap reminds me of Tywin and his sharp lessons though Tyrion is considerably gentle in comparison. His desired end state seems to be to get Penny to snap out of her depression and gain sufficient self-awareness to survive the impending battle and I don’t see any of the gratuitous cruelty he has showed in the past. My current take is that he’s adopting Tywin’s lessons in his own way in the spirit of becoming his own Tywin.

Mummery and Identity

Tyrion is too tired of the mummer’s farce to put on a show for Brown Ben. Penny speaks of being mummers and pretending to fight while Tyrion systematically evaluates the array of armor and weapons they have to choose from. He tells Penny no one buys dead mummers. Have we turned a corner on the attitude towards mummery? We’ve also come full circle with Tyrion being called “Imp” like he was when we first met him in GoT but now it holds little sway over him. He has also declared himself Lord of Casterly Rock in blood.

[Isildur's Mane]

I recall nine coming up other times in Dance. Jon found nine wildlings in the grove and there are at least two other nines I can’t recall.

There is also nine weirwoods in that grove

[Isildur's Mane]

My thought about writing in blood, after reading this chapter, is the saying: blood is thicker than water. But then Inkpots goes on to say that blood makes piss- pour ink.

It gives the mixed impression of joining a brotherhood and becomming brothers, but not true brothers, because it only lasts as long as the blood doesn't fade.

But then signing as the lord of Casterly Rock has a no-going-back feel to it.

[Fire Eater]

Nice job Ragnorak.

The Clever Little Tailor

Tyrion's story has come to have the aspects of the Grimm fairy tale above. The fairy tale has an exceedingly proud princess who would have suitors provide a conundrum or riddle, and if he failed he was hunted out of town. Three tailors came to her one day, she presented them the riddle of the two colors of her hair, to which the titular character gets it right with the answer of "gold and silver." The princess then has him spend the night in the stable with a bear, and if he lived she would marry him. The tailor managed to outwit the bear, and survive to marry the princess that morning.

Tyrion sewed bits of clothes together with Septa Lemore, and he had spent much time with Jorah Mormont, frequently referred to as a bear because to his sigil. Dany is a very proud princess( if R+L=J is factored, since Jon is the king that would make her a princess) as evidenced by her frequent mantra of "I am the blood of the dragon." She has the traditional silver-gold hair of the Targaryens. This could hint at Dany and Tyrion's future relationship, or just that Tyrion will attach himself to Dany.

When the steel struck the flint, such men were rare as dragon’s teeth; elsewise the world would not have been so full of slaves.

This could be a reference to a story in Greek mythology of Cadmus sowing the dragon's teeth, which then sprouted into full grown, fully armed warriors. Cadmus threw a precious jewel amongst them to have them kill each other for it until only five remained to help Cadmus build Thebes. From this story came the phrase "to sow dragon's teeth", or doing something that results in fomenting disputes. The dragon's teeth in this case are the slaves who want to be free, or something else I haven't thought of.

Their mammoth master had died on the day of their escape

Tyrion once thought about Illyrio: I am a mouse in a mammoth's lair. Arya is referred to as a mouse in ACoK, and Illyrio mentions that Varys originally called the children "little mice". This might be reaching, but this could foreshadow Illyrio's death, possibly on the day Arya leaves as one of the little mice.

[Ragnorak]

There is also nine weirwoods in that grove

Thank you. I knew there was another nine in that chapter. There was also a reference in that chapter to the six that remain to take their vows. Similar to how Tyrion lists off 6 identities then a trinity of fathers here. I remember being stumped on that nine rereading Jon even though it stood out so it (and Blisscraft's general numeric attentiveness) made it stand out. Varamyr Six Skins died nine times. There are nine Free Cities, a war of the NInepenny Kings, the gods made seven wonders but mortal man made nine, Aemon Targaryen saw nine kings on the throne in his life, Dany has nine men killed by the Harpy in one night, Daario loses nine men but comes out three ahead, Jon sends nine rangers out and three come back dead, there are just a lot of nines in Dance (many with a breakdown of 6 and 3) and it has to make one wonder.

Fire Eater, I saw your Foreshadowing post about contracts signed in blood. Such a great catch. Tyrion has to have played with just about every angle of loyalty throughout the series (many get referenced in this chapter) and with that being such a big aspect in his arc it really stands out to see him sign in blood-- not just any signature, this is the first time he claims to be the actual Lord of Casterly Rock instead of someone who ought to be such.

Is there a paper/parchment theme? We've always had ravens and letters so perhaps I'm reading too much into it. Promises on the wind vs parchment promises, parchment dragons, Tywin's wars won with parchment, and Tyrion signing parchment with his own blood. Jon sends his paper shield to Kings Landing. Ned presenting Cersei with a piece of parchment started this whole thing, or arguably LF's ledgers and we have Tyrion assigned to work on the ledgers which are also parchment. There's the pink letter, Cotter Pyke's letters (which may not be part of any theme but are so cool I included them), Arya's first FM hit she remarks on the papers too iirc. Perhaps a commentary on the written word amidst all these written words?

[Lummel]

paper and parchment seem to be in contrast with blood or personal oaths. Brienne and the Reeds swear an oath and the assumption is that this is solemn and binding, whereas my reading of Tyrion here is that he seems to be perfectly content in his mind that the paper won't bind him or cause him problems down the road back in Westeros, and why should it? As Lord of Casterly Rock in theory he could call out his bannermen and have the second sons hanged for their impertinence for not respecting the word of a Lannister, particularly and Plumm is Westerman and in theory bound to be loyal to his lord.

The whole signing scene to my mind needs to be read with Tyrion's words to Mormont in mind "You'll get the meal you bargained for, but it won't be sauced with gratitude, and in the end it will not nourish you." p351

I suppose what I am driving at is that paper and parchment are judged to be by our POVs inferior substitutes for the kinds of personal bonds that have the mountain clans clambering over the snow to rescue The Ned's girl. The contractual, intellectual bond on paper can be weaselled out of, but there is a sense of certain types of bonds that one does not violate. :dunno:

ETA I'll return to lurk mood mode now until I've reread the chapter :laugh:

[Lummel]

Interesting chapter...

Well seeing as Blisscraft hasn't dropped by yet I suppose I can point out that nine is three threes...

Then I was thinking about Tyrion, Penny and Mormont. We talked about them as a pack, but reading this chapter I wondered if Tyrion was reconstructing his old family, swapping brother for Mormont and sister for Penny. Again he has a brother who can fight for him, but this time a brother whose own dark non-secrets don't have the potential to undermine Tyrion's sense of self and with Penny doesn't the slap say it all? He can revisit his brother-sister relationship but this time as the slapper and not the slapped. His slap stands as answer to Cersei slapping him back in ACOK?

But then alternatively the slap, which on rereading you could see coming, could be harking back to the Shae slap in ACOK. Tyrion, we've noticed, is prepared to use violence on people weaker than him and Penny is now in his power.

"For most men there was no cost to joining a company, but he was not most men" p860 no, he's a Lannister. Tywin would approve of the pile of paper dragons he has to sign for. It's like the golden dragon he paid to Tysha. Tyrion is worth more as a Lannister and has to pay extra. The family dynamic pushed in our face again with the drooling cousins kept in oubliettes under/within Casterly Rock and since The Second Sons are becoming Tyrion's brothers they should beware. Their lower intelligence is repeatedly contrasted with Tyrion's (at least relatively) higher intelligence. They are the butt of his jokes - shot from his crossbow like wit. They are the people he will persuade and win round. They think they have tricked Tyrion but we are aware quite how a Lannister always pays their debts!

The last book in the story so far a counterpoint to Jaime's white book - perhaps a commentary on ASOIAF too - will this book tell the full story?

A contract signed in blood takes back to Tyrion II ADWD...Faust signs his pact in his own blood too, but this contract doesn't feel quite so portentous, leastwise not to me :dunno:

I've got a timeline problem with Kem - if he was at the battle of blackwater how does he get to join the second sons? The Second sons were in the service of Yunkai in ASOS, surely somebody leaving westeros would end up with the golden company or the tattered lord, why would they travel all the way to slavers bay to join the second sons? Weird.

Hammer and Nail, Groat and Penny. Tyrion's thought that there has never been a slave you did not chose to be a slave p870. Tyrion, despite his journey through the underworld still doesn't have much in the way of sympathy, empathy or compassion. He is now free and so feels safe to condemn all other slaves for not doing the same. Tyrion has his mind forg'd manacles too, but doesn't see them.

The ending? Upbeat? The whole chapter seems to belong to Tyrion the trickster, descendent of Lann the Clever.

[The Sleeper]

Hammer and Nail, Groat and Penny. Tyrion's thought that there has never been a slave you did not chose to be a slave p870. Tyrion, despite his journey through the underworld still doesn't have much in the way of sympathy, empathy or compassion. He is now free and so feels safe to condemn all other slaves for not doing the same. Tyrion has his mind forg'd manacles too, but doesn't see them.

Tyrion's next thought is that he didn't exempt himself. He admits that he himself preferred to be slave and keep his mouth shut rather than be whipped. While this does not mean that your statement is untrue per se it would indicate that he doesn't have much sympathy, empathy or compassion for himself as well, which is often consistent with the view he has of himself.

It is a harsh opinion, but I've always felt there is truth to it. While you can't blame anyone for wanting to live or to not suffer violence, there is always the choice of not allowing to be dominated. It is often a very crappy choice, yet it is there.

[ShadowCat Rivers]

Things that I read differently...

Then I was thinking about Tyrion, Penny and Mormont. We talked about them as a pack, but reading this chapter I wondered if Tyrion was reconstructing his old family, swapping brother for Mormont and sister for Penny. Again he has a brother who can fight for him, but this time a brother whose own dark non-secrets don't have the potential to undermine Tyrion's sense of self and with Penny doesn't the slap say it all? He can revisit his brother-sister relationship but this time as the slapper and not the slapped. His slap stands as answer to Cersei slapping him back in ACOK?

I think here Tyrion makes two decisions with similar outcome but different motive. Taking Mormont is being pragmatic: a strong fighter can always be useful. On the other hand, his decision to take Penny is a sentimental one. He has grown an attachment to her, a relationship (maybe his only one except Jaime) that is not based on benefit. The later does has a family feeling but certainly different from the Lannister family dynamics.

But then alternatively the slap, which on rereading you could see coming, could be harking back to the Shae slap in ACOK. Tyrion, we've noticed, is prepared to use violence on people weaker than him and Penny is now in his power.

Alternatively, a slap can be used to bring someone back from anaesthesia. There is no time to bring her back to her senses gently. If she doesn't wake up, she will die. The slap here doesn't function as a punishement. If he didn't care about her, he would just leave her alone.

"For most men there was no cost to joining a company, but he was not most men" p860 no, he's a Lannister. Tywin would approve of the pile of paper dragons he has to sign for. It's like the golden dragon he paid to Tysha. Tyrion is worth more as a Lannister and has to pay extra. The family dynamic pushed in our face again with the drooling cousins kept in oubliettes under/within Casterly Rock and since The Second Sons are becoming Tyrion's brothers they should beware. Their lower intelligence is repeatedly contrasted with Tyrion's (at least relatively) higher intelligence. They are the butt of his jokes - shot from his crossbow like wit. They are the people he will persuade and win round. They think they have tricked Tyrion but we are aware quite how a Lannister always pays their debts!

Objectively, he is not most men. His head (separated from his body) has a much higher value than most mens'. He is a Lannister (meaning here an access to gold, one way or an other), a runaway slave and a wanted -preferably dead- man, in the hands of a sellsword company. Varys' riddle plays a part here but as a gamble. What's the gain/risk proportion? It goes both ways. The Second Sons choosing between Tyrion and Cersei and Tyrion between keeping his head and paying the debt. For both parties, many things can go wrong in the meantime and lose it all.

Hammer and Nail, Groat and Penny. Tyrion's thought that there has never been a slave you did not chose to be a slave p870. Tyrion, despite his journey through the underworld still doesn't have much in the way of sympathy, empathy or compassion. He is now free and so feels safe to condemn all other slaves for not doing the same. Tyrion has his mind forg'd manacles too, but doesn't see them.

I think you're wrong here. From the first chapters, his attitude is to take what is given to him... As he says, "pride is cheap". He chose to be a slave than dead as life is full of possibilities. He's more of condemning Mormont for stupidity, for chosing to resist when he had no chances. He really does include himself in this.

I also disagree that he doesn't have much in the way of sympathy, empathy or compassion. He does (always had, IMO) but rarely allows such feelings to guide his actions. His (very strong) cynisism prevails most of the times.

[1234567]

I think here Tyrion makes two decisions with similar outcome but different motive. Taking Mormont is being pragmatic: a strong fighter can always be useful. On the other hand, his decision to take Penny is a sentimental one. He has grown an attachment to her, a relationship (maybe his only one except Jaime) that is not based on benefit. The later does has a family feeling but certainly different from the Lannister family dynamics.

I do think he wanted to take Mormont because he didn't want to leave him to die, either being sold on the auction block or leaving the Yellow Whale. It's one of Tyrion's most altruistic acts, because unlike Penny he had no reason to like Mormont. True Mormont potentially gave him an "in" with Dany, but that didn't come up in his reasoning. I think he genuinely wanted to save the man.

Alternatively, a slap can be used to bring someone back from anaesthesia. There is no time to bring her back to her senses gently. If she doesn't wake up, she will die. The slap here doesn't function as a punishement. If he didn't care about her, he would just leave her alone.

I disagree. They were not in immediate danger and rather than tell her the truth gently, he had been overprotective (similarly when he tried to ensure Sansa didn't hear about Robb and Cat being mutilated). He is taking a paternal role to Penny.

Then when she talked about her brother it seemed to be a sad reminiscence on what she'd lost, but also one that made him feel guilty because of his indirect causation of her brother's death. The slap seemed more akin to the one he gave Shae, which was almost a "I don't want to hear this".

[Woman of War]

I think the slap from Tyrion to Penny is a mixture and a condensation of all kinds of Tyrion's emotions. and it was only a slap "like bringing someone back from anaesthesia" and not at all violence against a woman since a young boy with the same illusions would have got just the same slap.

It is a slap of someone who sees his own emotions as weakness, like the slap some less pedagogically competent but not less loving parents may give to their child when the kid has crossed a main road without looking: God I am so glad you made it (hug of relief) but do never do that again (slap)! Meaning: Do not ever make me so afraid again since I feel helpless, dependent and weak if I have to worry about someone. Tyrion hates to be weak.

Tyrion does not make a big fuss about his own physical pain and downplays the humiliation component in physical abuse being inflicted upon him since anything else would make him weak. And the abused becomes abusive as negation of his own suffering (gross exaggeration here about a minor slap, but a tendency)

Next emotion: you, Penny, are what I could be, you are trusting and naive and maybe happier that way. I cannot be like you anymore, it was stolen from me when I was a kid but part of me would love to have that back. I begrudge you what I could never have: slap!

But at the same time I know that your balanced state of mind, i.e. your trusting naivety will endanger us both, I do not want to leave you behind since I feel responsible but I do not want to die because of you: slap! instead of a patient and longer explication. Why?

......because of the problem known from people with far above average intelligence and, say, untrained social competence: Other people are slow and I run out of patience! Please take up speed and start thinking the way I do: slap! as short circuit reaction. Well, the highly gifted people I know do not slap the normalos around but then they get recognition for their special competence and are not ridiculed and despised.

Maybe I left out one or other interpretation. But you see this little slap, like so many minor things in the books, tells so very much about the characters concerned. And the interpretation may be benevolent or malevolent, of course we all are totally objective and no one would draw his or her conclusions based on sympathy or antipathy for the character :) .

[Lummel]

...Maybe I left out one or other interpretation. But you see this little slap, like so many minor things in the books, tells so very much about the characters concerned. And the interpretation may be benevolent or malevolent, of course we all are totally objective and no one would draw his or her conclusions based on sympathy or antipathy for the character :) .

Heavens forbid! The very thought that we might be less than objective! :laugh:

I think the seeing emotions as a weakness is particularly interesting, it would fit with his odd reaction to having positive feelings that we've seen in a couple of other chapters. Running out of patience is an idea I like too, that fits for me with the "he was sick of mummery" p863 line. He's tired of playing games - at least in his own mind, because his kindness to Penny, awareness of her feelings and the desire to spare them seemed genuine enough, so now it is slap time instead.

I do think he wanted to take Mormont because he didn't want to leave him to die, either being sold on the auction block or leaving the Yellow Whale. It's one of Tyrion's most altruistic acts, because unlike Penny he had no reason to like Mormont. True Mormont potentially gave him an "in" with Dany, but that didn't come up in his reasoning. I think he genuinely wanted to save the man.

I disagree. They were not in immediate danger and rather than tell her the truth gently, he had been overprotective (similarly when he tried to ensure Sansa didn't hear about Robb and Cat being mutilated). He is taking a paternal role to Penny.

Then when she talked about her brother it seemed to be a sad reminiscence on what she'd lost, but also one that made him feel guilty because of his indirect causation of her brother's death. The slap seemed more akin to the one he gave Shae, which was almost a "I don't want to hear this".

Yes Mormont is interesting, there are practical reasons to saving him and impractical or emotional reasons. On the practical side he can fight, he might be an in with Daenerys (or a distraction, why be angry with Tyrion when she can be angry with Mormont instead?) on the emotional side there is the role reversal and power play - you thought you were taking me to Daenerys as a gift but now I'm in charge and am taking you with a bow as a present for the dragon queen, also the rebuilding a family or forming a pack idea which appeals to me because of the shy maid being full of orphans notion that we discussed earlier.

Tyrion's next thought is that he didn't exempt himself. He admits that he himself preferred to be slave and keep his mouth shut rather than be whipped. While this does not mean that your statement is untrue per se it would indicate that he doesn't have much sympathy, empathy or compassion for himself as well, which is often consistent with the view he has of himself...

No that seems to fair to say, and it fits in with what Woman of war was saying about seeing emotion as weakness.

...Alternatively, a slap can be used to bring someone back from anaesthesia. There is no time to bring her back to her senses gently. If she doesn't wake up, she will die. The slap here doesn't function as a punishement. If he didn't care about her, he would just leave her alone.

The problem here is that Penny hasn't changed but Tyrion is now behaving very differently towards her. Previously he even encouraged her optimism and spared her dreams. What's changed?

The situation now if anything is much less dangerous for Penny and Tyrion than it was on board ship or as slaves. The difference is that Tyrion is now Tyrion of House Lannister, Lord of Casterly Rock and he's showing her who is in charge. As lord of casterly rock he's suddenly much less inclined to pander towards emotions than he was when he was Hugor Hill and as vulnerable as she was and perhaps in need of someone to care for? Does it really matter if Penny lives in a dream world at this point?

ETA and of course Tyrion having responsibility for the Casterly Rock sewers deserves a mention in the Lannister scatology ledger!

[ShadowCat Rivers]

The problem here is that Penny hasn't changed but Tyrion is now behaving very differently towards her. Previously he even encouraged her optimism and spared her dreams. What's changed?

The situation now if anything is much less dangerous for Penny and Tyrion than it was on board ship or as slaves. The difference is that Tyrion is now Tyrion of House Lannister, Lord of Casterly Rock and he's showing her who is in charge. As lord of casterly rock he's suddenly much less inclined to pander towards emotions than he was when he was Hugor Hill and as vulnerable as she was and perhaps in need of someone to care for? Does it really matter if Penny lives in a dream world at this point?

The bolded part is my main disagreement. As escaped slaves they are much more in danger - they have been shown what would come to them if they get caught. It is very-very important for their safety to pass as boys-squires instead of dwarfs ad to have their face hidden all the time. Furthermore, a battle is about to happen anytime. Their life is in grater danger than before, only now they have an actual chance to survive if they don't screw up.

Penny could keep her illusions before, as her ensuing actions were in accordance with what they needed to do to survive (entertain the sailors and later their master). Tyrion had to adjust, and he did. Now it's the opposite. Penny has to change, and quickly.

(I have been in a quite dangerous situation a few times when I was younger -not life or death or such, but still stressfull-, together with my sister who has the bad habit of getting a panic attack at the worst moment. Obviously, she is one of the persons I care the most and neither of us is "in charge", but I did shouted to her "shut the f*ck up and do as I say" in these cases. As we all do, some of my thoughts on the characters derive from personal experiences so they are, naturally, subjective.)

[Lummel]

Yes we do disagree.

OK they are in danger as escaped slaves but there's no reason to connect them with the Second Sons and they are going to be low on the list of priorities for the heirs to the yellow whale what with the war and the plague and all. Two missing slaves, possibly dead of the plague themselves somewhere, just aren't all that important.

On the other hand on board the ship after it had been damaged in the storm the dwarves had the very tasty looking pig and dog while the ship was running out of food plus the sailors thought that having a woman on board was bringing them bad luck and they all knew where to find Penny and Tyrion would would have been unable to escape.

That's why for me the key change is in Tyrion's attitude and his state of mind. Now he's in control of the situation. He doesn't need to be nice to Penny, he can just slap her instead. If Penny dreamt her dreams where's the harm or risk to Tyrion? Does he really need to slap her to persuade her to put on armour for her own safety? Why not be nice to her, what does that cost him, or how does that shift their relationship that slapping her is what Tyrion prefers to do? That's why I see it as dominance behaviour - this is my pack and I am the top dog (or lion I suppose) isn't that what he signals with the slap?

[1234567]

That's why I see it as dominance behaviour - this is my pack and I am the top dog (or lion I suppose) isn't that what he signals with the slap?

His Pride. :) As a Lion and all.

[Ragnorak]

The slap. Slaps are part of the Lannister family dynamic. Tyrion and Cersei in particular share a fondness for slapping and Jaime even resorts to it on occasion iirc. While Tywin doesn't physically strike his children that we see he does resort to verbal slaps which all three of his children share a penchant for as well. It does beg the question of where they learned this particular behavior. Was it daddy? Was it mommy? Were they just never reprimanded as children and as Lannisters were free to go around slapping people and never had to learn impulse control?

Tyrion both physically and verbally slaps Penny, but he also holds back considerably on both counts relative to his past behavior and current thoughts and impulses. I'm glad Rapsie noted the paternal role too. I don't think the pack or pride is inaccurate, but there is an element of a paternal role Tyrion takes with Penny and I think the slap is mostly a paternal incident. Tyrion is delivering a "sharp lesson" to a childlike Penny but unlike Tywin he is choosing to soften the edges of the lesson rather than trying to make them cut as deeply as possible. I think it falls under the umbrella of Tyrion becoming his own Tywin that was brought up earlier.

Tyrion/Jorah/Penny does create a parallel family unit to Tyrion/Jaime/Cersei. Nothing immediately jumps out at me but there may be some interesting insights to looking at that angle.