Do you believe that Loras was actually wounded?

[BloodyGoatHoat]

The story of Loras's wounds at Dragonstone is corroborated by a few different characters, but there is no objective confirmation. Could the Tyrells be playing a trick? I think it is ambiguous, and thus the truth is unattainable at this point, but what do you currently believe?

[Whitering]

Margaery is a great actress, that much is obvious, but there is some, at least minor danger, in lying about this obviously verifiable fact. Now, they can later claim it was a mistake, but it just seems a weird thing to lie about. It would be fitting from GRRMs writing to have one of the most handsome dudes in the realm disfigured.

On balance I say yes, but I would not be shocked to be wrong.

[Stannis Eats No Peaches]

No, I think that he's just fine.

[Tumnas the Torpid]

I never really questioned it until late in ADwD, where, at some point, someone does a sort-of double take when Cersei mentions him. That could mean there is something we don't know yet.

[WinterKing]

No, I believe that he found something in Dragonstone and is trying to sneak away with it.

[Bo Bice]

There's no mention of Stannis losing Dragonstone in ADwD, and that would definitely be something worth mentioning. In the epilogue Kevan says that Loras explored Dragonstone himself. By thinking that Loras was wounded Cersei went forward with her plot. Lying about it led to her downfall.

[Fire Eater]

I think Loras was wounded. What would the Tyrells expect to gain from lying about his condition? Their goal is to keep Tommen in power, and have him live long enough to have children with Margaery.

[BeWareOfMyHouse]

Lying about a grievious wound to Ser Loras would be in the Tyrells' nature of being sneaky, traitorous gits. Like WinterKing mentioned, he could have found something on or near Dragonstone. He could also be on his way to Dorne or The Vale to negotiate another secret alliance in preparation for the Tyrells to switch sides. I think this last theory is probably the least likely, since the Tyrells already enjoy large public approval in King's Landing, and are already very close to having ultimate power as Cersei is on her way out of the picture.

But, they could also foresee the changing of the tide as the Lannisters keep dropping like flies. They might want to switch sides again. Who knows.

[Bo Bice]

I think Loras was wounded. What would the Tyrells expect to gain from lying about his condition? Their goal is to keep Tommen in power, and have him live long enough to have children with Margaery.

Yes but they dont want Cersei to be the Queen regent. By lying Cersei hatched her plot against Margery, which led to her own undoing. At this point it seems as though Margery wont have much trouble with her fathers army coming in hot to Kings Landing.

[Whitering]

Yes but they dont want Cersei to be the Queen regent. By lying Cersei hatched her plot against Margery, which led to her own undoing. At this point it seems as though Margery wont have much trouble with her fathers army coming in hot to Kings Landing.

This series is littered with the bodies of those who had such expectations.

[Fire Eater]

Yes but they dont want Cersei to be the Queen regent. By lying Cersei hatched her plot against Margery, which led to her own undoing. At this point it seems as though Margery wont have much trouble with her fathers army coming in hot to Kings Landing.

You're reading too much into it. They wouldn't have wanted nor expected Cersei to hatch her plot against Margaery. The plan you describe is too full of uncertainties.

[Bo Bice]

You're reading too much into it. They wouldn't have wanted nor expected Cersei to hatch her plot against Margaery. The plan you describe is too full of uncertainties.

Unless they knew about the plot the whole time, knew how fast it would fall apart. There is 0 mention anywhere else in the book besides Cersei's chapters that talk about Dragonstone falling (aside from Kevan, but he would be deceived as well). Thats a pretty big event, why would Stannis or anyone else not comment on it?

[maarsen]

Loras the pretty boy is injured and people cannot keep their stories straight as to what happened to him. So one must surmise that what ever it was disfigured him and is not something you want to be known as it would make him shunned. Me, I think he contracted grey scale.

[Florina Laufeyson]

Nah. At least not as grievously as it is said.

[Lord Ben]

Loras "injured" and gone and all the ships missing too. I think they're just both waiting out the Tyrell dominance and will return when the Lannisters have been dealt with.

[Quincunx]

I could believe that the Tyrells (QoT) wanted Loras to disappear on some kind of "secret mission" that they wanted to hide from Cersei. By this time Varys is no longer the official Master of Whisperers so they may very well believe Cersei unable or unwilling to dig deeper. But I have a hard time believing in that Loras stumbled across some kind of secret hidden on Dragonstone that Stannis never rooted out. Possibly there could be something to damage Stannis' campaign, but if that was the case there would be no need to hide from the Lannisters in the first place.

[Fire Eater]

Unless they knew about the plot the whole time, knew how fast it would fall apart. There is 0 mention anywhere else in the book besides Cersei's chapters that talk about Dragonstone falling (aside from Kevan, but he would be deceived as well). Thats a pretty big event, why would Stannis or anyone else not comment on it?

I think that is unlikely. Having Margaery accused of debauchery and treason wouldn't be worth the damage to bring down Cersei. How could they have know about Cersei's plans with Qyburn keeping tabs on the ears and the Red Keep, and I don't think Varys displays any loyalty to the Tyrells.

[tbc]

I think Loras was wounded. What would the Tyrells expect to gain from lying about his condition? Their goal is to keep Tommen in power, and have him live long enough to have children with Margaery.

By the end of ADwD, Aegon, Jon Connington and the GC have landed and taken most of the Stormlands. Storms End has falled by the Arianna II chapted revealed for TWoW. For a house that is itself generally a Targaryen loyalist, the arrival and success of a Targaryen near the Reach, allied to Euron's raids, changes their situation fundamentally. They can't afford to focus their attention and armies north if the Reach is under threat from east and west, and cann't afford to prop up the Lannisters if a better option is available.

Does nobody else wonder whether Varys is advising the Tyrells in KL? Tyrell support, allied to Dorne, the GC, and what remains of the Stormlands, would almost guarantee Aegon the throne. As a likely architect of the Aegon restoration, and given he's definitely in KL, it would make sense were he manouevring the largest army in Westeros, and one of the least war damaged, behind his conspiracy.

[Ragnorak]

I think Loras was wounded. What would the Tyrells expect to gain from lying about his condition? Their goal is to keep Tommen in power, and have him live long enough to have children with Margaery.

If there is in fact something going on I don't think it is aimed at Tommen but rather at Cersei. Aurane Waters reports that many men were lost including a large number of nobles.

“I never saw a braver knight,” Waters said, “but he turned what could have been a bloodless victory into a slaughter. A thousand men are dead, or near enough to make no matter. Most of them our own. And not just common men, Your Grace, but knights and young lords, the best and the bravest.”

My understanding is that these are Lannister men. A large number of knights and young lords from among Lannister vassals strikes me as quite a valuable set of hostages for someone who was interested in undermining the Lannister half of this royal marriage.

There are some possible hints. Aurane Waters was dancing with one of Margaery's cousins. Cersei noticed that he was awake when Margaery brought the news of the Ironborn invasion. Waters used to serve Stannis so there are possibilities there (not that I can make any sense of them.) I can't remember who Stannis left holding Dragonstone. I also can't put the pieces together into a comprehensive theory that doesn't have big holes or questions in it. Still I'm open to the possibility that the Tyrells intentionally took lots of Lannister vassals hostage to shift the balance of power in KL from Casterly Rock to Highgarden. Even if the hostage part is true that doesn't rule out the assault and Loras being injured. It could just be those men were all taken to fight the Ironborn after storming Dragonstone so the Tyrells have future hostages if they need them. Something seems a bit off with the entire situation and the potential hostages are what set off the loudest alarms for me.

[ckal]

Sounds like a game of Westeros-telephone where what we hear in King's Landing is nothing like the truth that happened at Dragonstone. It is morphed in the mouths of many on the way to Lannister ears.

That, or there is just something else, as suggested above.