[BOOK SPOILERS] What Does the Future Hold for Shae?

[Minsc]

Lets be honest most of the show characters have been whitewashed. Cersei, Shae, Tyrion, Tywin, and Cat are better characters because of it. I think it's a good thing for TV. I don't understand the particular need to make Tyrion's character dark.

The issue is that Tyrion is not even a tiny bit grey within the series. Simply, he is flat out a good guy and hero that holds absolutely no flaws to the degree that he is better then Ned Stark in how he is also intelligent enough to effectively play the game.

There is a difference between greying up some characters that are primarily portrayed as solely dark and unlikable(Cersei and Tywin) and whitewashing any form of darkness from a grey character who is already treated sympathetically.

Quite frankly, TV Tyrion bores me to the death with how HBO is blatantly trying to invoke how "awesome" and "great" Tyrion is and how everyone should love him.

[Pinkie Baelish]

I'm still waiting for them to grey up Tyrion. If that happens, then he may kill her otherwise I think you are right and it will be someone else. Considering the recent Pod scene, I am less and less convinced that they will make Tyrion a more grey character. He's the new Ned.

I felt his attitude during the scene with Pod was somewhat of a return to book Tyrion. He seemed courteous and even chivalrous at times last year, and I thought the scene helped him return to his whoremonging ways.

The issue is that Tyrion is not even a tiny bit grey within the series. Simply, he is flat out a good guy and hero that holds absolutely no flaws to the degree that he is better then Ned Stark in how he is also intelligent enough to effectively play the game.

There is a difference between greying up some characters that are primarily portrayed as solely dark and unlikable(Cersei and Tywin) and whitewashing any form of darkness from a grey character who is already treated sympathetically.

Quite frankly, TV Tyrion bores me to the death with how HBO is blatantly trying to invoke how "awesome" and "great" Tyrion is and how everyone should love him.

I don't think that he's been completely whitewashed, but a lot of his greyness has been left out, sadly. But in the show, he still has done things, that although might sit well with viewers, are somewhat morally questionable:

-He insults Theon at his visit to Winterfell for no particular reason

-He exiles Janos not because of Janos' killing of the bastards, but because Janos was Cersei's man, and Tyrion needed to consolidate his power.

-He threatens to throw Varys into the sea if the truth about Shae was revealed. "Ned Stark was a man of honour" "And I am not. Threaten me again and I shall have you thrown into the sea" Not that far from the Symon Silvertongue incident.

-He has Pycelle, an old man, arrested, beaten and thrown into the Black Cells for being Cersei's spy. He even threatens to castrate Pycelle.

-He blackmails his own cousin and threatens him with death

So he's not on Ned levels of goodness. But yes, there is a lot of room for them to darken his character. The viewers need to see that Tyrion has more of Tywin in him than either Jaime or Cersei. Fingers crossed that we still get the Symon Silvertongue incident in the future, although it's unlikely.

I don't know why the show runners are so reluctant to darken Tyrion. Dinklage has the charisma and ability to remain likable, even when his character is being a dick, and the show should really utilise his talents to their full effects. Characters that are morally questionable are generally a lot more likable if they are as witty and funny as Tyrion.

[Minsc]

I don't think that he's been completely whitewashed, but a lot of his greyness has been left out, sadly. But in the show, he still has done things, that although might sit well with viewers, are somewhat morally questionable:

The issue is the bold, as all those activities are written in a way so they come of as another "awesome" moment by Tyrion not anything that is going to stop the viewers in their tracks and think "what the hell man."

[Sun]

In Tyrion's arc next season one transformative revelation is the catalyst to all that follows: Jaime's confession to Tyrion that he'd lied about Tysha being a whore.

There has been no emphasis whatsoever on the Tysha incident, or its importance in both Tyrion and Jaime's lives in the show, so why would Jaime feel the need to confess anything to Tyrion? Without that confession, why would Tyrion lead his brother to believe that he killed Joffery? Why would he detour from his escape to climbing into Tywin's rooms?

I can see the show using Shae as the impetus for Tyrion killing his father - either because Tywin slept with her, raped her, or even killed her - but what will they serve as a cause for Tyrion's anger at Jaime?

ETA:

Is my post too far out of the topic of discussion? I can't decide. But if so, I apologise to the OP.

[Woman of War]

I felt his attitude during the scene with Pod was somewhat of a return to book Tyrion. He seemed courteous and even chivalrous at times last year, and I thought the scene helped him return to his whoremonging ways.

I don't think that he's been completely whitewashed, but a lot of his greyness has been left out, sadly. But in the show, he still has done things, that although might sit well with viewers, are somewhat morally questionable:

I don't know why the show runners are so reluctant to darken Tyrion. Dinklage has the charisma and ability to remain likable, even when his character is being a dick, and the show should really utilise his talents to their full effects. Characters that are morally questionable are generally a lot more likable if they are as witty and funny as Tyrion.

:agree:

Tyrion is the most interesting character in the story exacly due to his many facets , the most human and the most fascinating read. And thanks to Dinklage's charisma he is the most compelling character in rhe series as well. The actor could easily transport all that complexity on screen, viewers will hold their breath and root for him even if the character gets difficult to digest.

I guess this out of proportion Tyrion dislike here is a phenomenon limited to these forums and has nothing to do with the reception of the character by a broader book and series fanbase.

[Skeksi]

I did wonder if perhaps, since the TV medium allows for scenes between non-POV characters, if they might end Shae's arc as they do in the books, but have some scenes where perhaps, since Tyrion's fate looks so bleak, Shae attempts to intervene with his father on his behalf, and Tywin convinces her that if she gives evidence enough to convict him, Tywin will make sure he gets sent to the Wall and kept alive? I think that might make it doubly tragic for the viewer- in the books, we only see Shae through Tyrion's eyes, but in the show she has been built up more as a character in her own right, and her relationship with Tyrion as more loving. To have Tyrion believe that she has lied to and betrayed him, and murder her because of it, when we know that she has not, that might be what the showrunners want to go for?

Of course, they could show Shae becoming jealous of Tyrion and Sansa, or perhaps condemning Tyrion to free Sansa from the marriage?

It'll be interesting to see how it plays out, but I think Tyrion killing Shae darkens him a good deal more than killing his father in the books, and he spends the next book, for the most part, as a much darker character because of it, IMO. If Shae dies and Tyrion kills his father for revenge for Shae and Tysha, rather than killing Shae, perhaps this will change Tyrion's later scenes, too.

[TheAwesomeVargoHoat]

I think the story will play out exactly the same way as the books. They can't get in Tyrions head to show how much he cared for Tysha and they're not going to have him talk about to Shae or Varys.

Once Jaime gets to King's Landing, and Tyrion tells him the truth about Tysha, there is no reason for the scene to play out any differently.

If they don't want him to strangle her, just have him shoot her with the cross bow as well.

[The Anti-Targ]

I want it to play out as in the books: Shae testifies against Tyrion in his trial, Tyrion finds her a bit drugged / drunk in Tywin's bed, Tyrion strangles her before heading off to find out whether Tywin shits gold.

I think Tyrion killing Shae is important, it's pretty much her main role in the story, to keep Tyrion on the downward emotional and psychological spiral that begins with his attempted murder on the Blackwater.

[Valar Morghulis Not Today]

I really hope they keep it as Tyrion killing her. To me that was unexpected, even though I'd read her as a whore in the books it was a twist to me that Tyrion found her in Tywin's bed. I'd assumed that she'd been pressured into giving evidence against him in some way. I think it'd shock most of the TV audience and is crucial to his development.

I thought their conversation regarding Sansa being attractive was setting the scene for this. Although I agree Tysha has hardly been mentioned, I doubt my NBR friends remember the story at all, so I can't see it playing out like it does in the books, which hopefully might mean we don't get Tyrion asking everyone who he comes in contact with where whores go!

I like the idea of linking her to the Dornish and the Red Viper, might make TV viewers more sympathetic to him which would be good as they'll all expect Tyrion to win another trial by battle.

[you snow muffin poncho]

I am shocked, and a bit a flabbergasted, at how many people think it would be an *improvement* if Tywin kills Shae. It's a crucial development for Tyrion! And Tywin as well - the hypocrisy of a guy who admonishes his son as a whore mongerer every chance he gets - in bed with his son's whore! Change these details and you may as well have Tyrion fly out of King's Landing on a dragon.

I think the angle they'll play is this - Shae is, in fact, the perfect actress, who is actually selling out Sansa and Tyrion both to Littlefinger - who the show has done much to set up as the end boss. Look at her face when Ros talks to her about Sansa and LF in ep 1 - looks kind of "scheme"-y. They will hint at this again ever-so-slightly before the trial and then it will hit everyone like a ton of bricks - and that will make her death easier for the audience to handle, because they will want Shae to die so badly.

[YTDN]

A thing I think will drive a wedge between Tyrion and Shae is when Tyrion is informed he will marry Sansa, and keeps it secret not just from Sansa, but from Shae too. Shae has already made it clear she doesn't like the idea of men messing with Sansa, so if she were to know about the marriage, she would immediatly tell Sansa. So she would be as much in the dark as Sansa was until the day of the wedding, and I can see her being furious at Tyrion for keeping it from her. This will lead to her accusing Tyrion of caring more about his personal power and family name than her, and put her on the road to sell him out at his trial. She might even suspect that Tyrion did murder Joffrey, since all the evidence points to him, and she already saw him marry an unwilling girl in a play for power, so why not murder?

This works in two ways: one, it gives Shae a reason to turn against Tyrion while still within her 'new' character, and it also darkens Tyrion, since it would be an actual betrayal: he knows that Shae is protective of Sansa and doesn't want any men messing with her (see her angry reaction when she thought Tyrion was interested in 'this child'), but married Sansa anyway and deceived Shae about it.

[Faithmemory]

death !!!

[Fey]

I think it's pretty clear how they'll handle Shae and her eventual death. The show has already shown that Tyrion finds Sansa somewhat attractive, which we saw greatly bother Shae. Now he'll marry Sansa, and Shae will then bear resentment towards them both. She'll hate Tyrion, and likely won't believe him if he says that the marriage wasn't his idea because she knows that Tyrion thinks Sansa is beautiful. And she'll likely grow colder towards Sansa simply for being the object of Tyrion's affections (or, as someone earlier said, because she believes both Tyrion and Sansa were in on the marriage and didn't tell her).

And: Sansa will ditch King's Landing without informing Shae, so Shae will lose her relatively high position as Sansa's handmaiden PLUS Tyrion (being jailed) can no longer offer her golds and other riches (whereas Cersei can). There will be many reasons for Shae to eventually betray both Tyrion and Sansa.

[Woftis]

It has the potential to be a lot more powerful than in the books, since we kind of expected it from book Shae. TV Shae though? That's gonna come as a massive shock to any series-only fans......hell, it'll come as a big shock to me too.

[Rhaegarsjoy]

I just hope when the time comes they don't turn her betrayal as some sort of 'hell hath no fury..' As appose to pure greed of the whore she is.

[Woftis]

I just hope when the time comes they don't turn her betrayal as some sort of 'hell hath no fury..' As appose to pure greed of the whore she is.

I think they may have to if they decide to stick with her betraying Tyrion.

I don't think it will come down to greed, they've changed her character far too much for that.

It'll definitely be interesting to see it play out - am I right in saying this should be next season?

[The Anti-Targ]

Only death. I think too that something would be lost if they have her die by any other hand than Tyrion's. What will be interesting is to see whether Shae looks drugged or just sleepy, given the conspiracy theory surrounding this, and in light of what happens at the end of DwD in King's Landing.

[Newstar]

It should be interesting. I think we might have a closer idea by the end of Season 3.

I think it's safe to say that she won't have some miraculous escape, and that she will indeed die. The only question is how.

[Mordos_Kull]

This series is renowned for shocking it's readers/audiences. I don't know why people can't see this part of Tyrion's arc playing out, just because they aren't leaving a trail of breadcrumbs.

Tywin uses the line: "Next whore I catch in your bed, I will hang." in the book, so I don't see why people want to use that as a hint. If anything, people reading the book at that point, have/had every reason to suspect Tywin was going to kill Shae, but he didn't. That's what makes the climax so great.

What other shit storm could you use in episode 9 to top the Red Wedding or Ned's Beheading?

C'mon people. This is A Story of Ice & Fire (or Game of Thrones for TV audiences), it's MEANT to be a shock. Let's just see how the episode where Shae finds out about Tyrion & Sansa's wedding plays before we jump to conclusions.

[The Anti-Targ]

I think they may have to if they decide to stick with her betraying Tyrion.

I don't think it will come down to greed, they've changed her character far too much for that.

It'll definitely be interesting to see it play out - am I right in saying this should be next season?

Yes, end of next season I think, E8 or 9. Perhaps one of the final scenes in E10 might be Tyrion puking over the side of a Pentosi Cheese monger's ship.