Most Precise ASOIAF Timeline in Existence

[Faint]

We honestly do not need additional evidence unless someone wants to argue that Ramsay or someone else wrote the letter immediately after Theon escaped and the crow traveled backward in time to get to the Wall before Stannis strung up Theon.

[Lost Melnibonean]

We honestly do not need additional evidence unless someone wants to argue that Ramsay or someone else wrote the letter immediately after Theon escaped and the crow traveled backward in time to get to the Wall before Stannis strung up Theon.

:)

[Jon Weirgaryen]

all we have is that it was sent seven days after battle between Stannis and Ramsay.

Where is that piece of information coming from?

[Lost Melnibonean]

Where is that piece of information coming from?

Your false king is dead, bastard. He and all his host were smashed in seven days of battle. I have his magic sword. Tell his red whore. Your false king' s friends are dead. Their heads upon the walls of Winterfell. Come see them, bastard. Your false king lied, and so did you. You told the world you burned the King-Beyond-the-Wall. Instead you sent him to Winterfell to steal my bride from me.

I will have my bride back. If you want Mance Rayder back, come and get him. I have him in a cage for all the north to see, proof of your lies. The cage is cold, but I have made him a warm cloak from the skins of the six whores who came with him to Winterfell.

I want my bride back. I want the false king' s queen. I want his daughter and his red witch. I want his wildling princess. I want his little prince, the wildling babe. And I want my Reek. Send them to me, bastard, and I will not trouble you or your black crows. Keep them from me, and I will cut out your bastard' s heart and eat it. It was signed,

Ramsay Bolton,

Trueborn Lord of Winterfell.

Jon XIII, Dance

[Jon Weirgaryen]

You should not take that for granted.
Do you really believe there would be seven days of battle?
Think about it, I find it doubly ridiculous.
Starting with taking information from the letter for fact, but not ending there.

[Lost Melnibonean]

You should not take that for granted.

Do you really believe there would be seven days of battle?

Think about it, I find it doubly ridiculous.

Starting with taking information from the letter for fact, but not ending there.

Mors Umber was outside the gates. We learned in Theon I, Winds that Aenys Frey was killed when Freys fell into a trap. However, we al learn that Hosteen survived. Stannis noted that Mors's green boys would not be able to hold Bolton's expeditionary force. And we know Stannis's camp was three days from Winterfell. So, you have an initial battle outside the gates on Day 1, folowed by 2 more days of skirmishes as Mors's boys fall back to the crofter's village, and Stannis's outriders fight Bolton's vanguard. Then a big battle on Day 4. The return to Winterfell would account for the remaining three days. Perhaps Ramsay was exaggerating a"battle" a bit, or perhaps his force was jarried on the way back.

[Jon Weirgaryen]

I had never even given a thought toward the battle of the ice having already begun. I had thought, that would still be a while and confined to the shaky flaky "grounds" of the crofter's village and considered the letter to be no more than a roose.

I get your point pretty well though.

eta: Do you think Ramsey has anything to do with the pink letter?

[Lord Godric]

Martin likes to play with contemporaneous events, but for me that's a bit of stretch to think that Ramsey has not only fought Stannis, defeated him, returned, written a letter, and the letter reached Jon all before we get a next chapter showing Stannis doing fine.

[Lost Melnibonean]

Martin likes to play with contemporaneous events, but for me that's a bit of stretch to think that Ramsey has not only fought Stannis, defeated him, returned, written a letter, and the letter reached Jon all before we get a next chapter showing Stannis doing fine.

The George loves the cliffhanger above all I think. Taking what woulda been Theon II, Dance out and making it Theon I, Winds added to the cliffhanger that was Jon XIII, Dance. Not only are we led to believe that Jon is dead but also Stannis.

[Lost Melnibonean]

I had never even given a thought toward the battle of the ice having already begun. I had thought, that would still be a while and confined to the shaky flaky "grounds" of the crofter's village and considered the letter to be no more than a roose.

I get your point pretty well though.

eta: Do you think Ramsey has anything to do with the pink letter?

I do believe he wrote it, and I do believe he wrote what he believed.

[user1]

First time posting...

For giggles I took this timeline and the one at http://awoiaf.westeros.org/index.php/Timeline_of_major_events and created a web page timeline.

Not the prettiest but another way to view it.

Can see it here: http://asofaitimeline.altervista.org/

Page can be viewed in a mobile browser as well...if you make your desktop browser half width it will move all the event entries to one side.

Have fun

[Ser Fingerbones]

I completely agree that Jon's chapter needs to be pushed forward (or Theon I pushed back.) No matter how you view the Pink Letter, it has to take place after Theon I. If it's true, then Stannis should be dead, though he is quite notably present in Theon I. If Ramsay is operating under false information, he obviously hasn't had an opportunity to receive it yet (as I imagine it's fake info given to him by Stannis.) I know the timeline can't operate based on theories, but no likely situation can have the assassination take place before Theon I in TWOW.

The question is whether the Night's Watch story be pushed forward or Stannis and Winterfell's pushed back. Or a mixture of both. I imagine Jon's chapters will be a bit more malleable. There's a lot of specifics given in those Asha's chapters, which aren't present in Jon's (to the best of my knowledge.) Actually on closer inspection.. It seems unlikely that there's nearly a month between Theon and Jeyne's escape, and Theon and Asha's meeting, as stated on the timeline, though I haven't read those chapters in a while. Perhaps that could be changed around a bit?

Small, unrelated note: The dates of 7/1 and 7/2 in the year 300 are currently placed before 6/30 (Asha II.)

[Jon Weirgaryen]

Hmm, hmm. Stannis' death won't be shown in a letter - we've been with him for 3 books. When it happens we'll see it in a POV.

Stannis' death does not further the story in any way, and may or may not ever.
His arc - some people don't see one at all - is not at an end either, he is slowly progressing.

The letter is written in at-the-wall and north-of-the-wall language.

It is written with knowledge about Mance.

It may be written without any Winterfell knowledge.

My conclusion: no way it helps us with any of the timeline, since it was neither sent from anywhere nor does it contain any narrative at all of things that have actually happened, (except from the bride-stealing - and that one may well be meant as a lie). It is such a big lie, written at the wall* with the sole intention of harming the lord commander Jon Snow.

[Lost Melnibonean]

Hmm, hmm. Stannis' death won't be shown in a letter - we've been with him for 3 books. When it happens we'll see it in a POV.

Stannis' death does not further the story in any way, and may or may not ever.

His arc - some people don't see one at all - is not at an end either, he is slowly progressing.

The letter is written in at-the-wall and north-of-the-wall language.

It is written with knowledge about Mance.

It may be written without any Winterfell knowledge.

My conclusion: no way it helps us with any of the timeline, since it was neither sent from anywhere nor does it contain any narrative at all of things that have actually happened, (except from the bride-stealing - and that one may well be meant as a lie). It is such a big lie, written at the wall* with the sole intention of harming the lord commander Jon Snow.

You've read the Thron spoiler chapter, right? Stannis suggests to Justin that he's going to fake his death as part of a ruse. That plays perfectly into what Ramsay writes in the pink letter.

[Mithras]

You've read the Thron spoiler chapter, right? Stannis suggests to Justin that he's going to fake his death as part of a ruse. That plays perfectly into what Ramsay writes in the pink letter.

Or Ramsay does not know anything about Stannis and Stannis himself writes about his death, impersonating Ramsay.

[Ser Fingerbones]

At present the likeliest theory doesn't matter. The timeline can only be based on the info given in the books. We have to take the Pink Letter at face value until shown otherwise.

In Theon I Stannis is alive, yet the Pink Letter claims he is dead. Ergo Jon's assassination has to take place after that chapter.

[Lost Melnibonean]

Or Ramsay does not know anything about Stannis and Stannis himself writes about his death, impersonating Ramsay.

That's an interesting theory, so is the one by the Mance. But without a little more to go on, I think the timeline should assume the pink letter was aithored by Ramsay.

[Jon Weirgaryen]

You've read the Thron spoiler chapter, right? Stannis suggests to Justin that he's going to fake his death as part of a ruse. That plays perfectly into what Ramsay writes in the pink letter.

Nah, I read it: (eta for TWoW Theon spoilers!)

"It may be that we shall lose this battle," the king said grimly. "In Braavos you may hear that I am dead. It may even be true. You shall find my sellswords nonetheless."

But I am not understanding what you did there: He is not faking his death, he is thinking aloud that he may lose the battle, his death be rumored or actually die in battle.

Or was there something I overlooked?

Or Ramsay does not know anything about Stannis and Stannis himself writes about his death, impersonating Ramsay.

Nice thought.

[Lost Melnibonean]

Nah, I read it: (eta for TWoW Theon spoilers!)

But I am not understanding what you did there: He is not faking his death, he is thinking aloud that he may lose the battle, his death be rumored or actually die in battle.

Or was there something I overlooked?

Nice thought.

He is sending Justin off to Braavos to gather swords. But if Justin hears that Stannis is dead Justin won't complete his task. If Stannis is planning a ruse in which he will pretend to have been defeated, he needs to make sure that Justin will complete the task. So he tells Justin even if he hears that his liege is dead he should carry and place Stannis's heir on the iron throne. Then we have the pink letter in which, presumably, Ramsay believes that Stannis has been defeated and that Stannis is dead. And there's this...

Patchface jumped up. I will lead it! His bells rang merrily. We will march into the sea and out again. Under the waves we will ride seahorses, and mermaids will blow seashells to announce our coming, oh, oh, oh.

Jon XIII, Dance

[Lost Melnibonean]

Aha! Theon I, Winds comes before Jon XIII, Dance...

Dec. 28th, 2011 at 4:46 PM

As a Christmas gift to all my loyal fans and readers, I've just replaced the (long published) sample chapters from A DANCE WITH DRAGONS on my website with an unpublished sample chapter from THE WINDS OF WINTER.

Go ye to "Ice & Fire Sample" on my website and enjoy.

(The chronology, as usual, is tricky. This chapter will be found eventually at the beginning of WINDS, but as you will be able to tell from context, it actually takes place before some of the chapters at the end of DANCE).

Love it or hate it, please do NOT discuss it here. Any such posts will be deleted. There are plenty of great places on the net for such discussions, so take your thoughts, comments, and analysis to Westeros or the Tower of the Hand or the Podcast of Ice and Fire, or your favorite foreign language site.

(FYI, there will be a different sample chapter from WINDS OF WINTER included at the end of the paperback edition of A DANCE WITH DRAGONS when that is published next July).

Happy holidays, all. Keep reading.

http://grrm.livejournal.com/257002.html