Jon restricted to the Wall....annoying?

[~DarkHorse~]

As much as I love Jon's story, his NW vows take away the possibility of good character development and plot opportunities.

Am I the only one who wants Jon to get away from the Wall after he is resurrected (hopefully)?

[Mladen]

No, you aren`t the only one, but I have doubts Jon will abandon NW due to technicality.

edit: spelling

[Nictarion]

I just don't see Jon leaving the wall. We have to hav a pov from the wall and Sam is not there. I don't think Mel will be our pov from the wall and I don't think there will be any new povs. As long as the NW exists I think that's where Jon will be.

[Rheagar Prime]

nope i think so too would love for him and aegon to interact hell even dany but i doubt they will meet so sad.

[Frey Pentos]

As much as I love Jon's story, his NW vows take away the possibility of good character development and plot opportunities.

Am I the only one who wants Jon to get away from the Wall after he is resurrected (hopefully)?

I've always found Jon's storyline to be pretty boring so yes, it would be good to see him leave the wall and develop a bit as a character.

[Dicer]

I think Jon is a well developed and interesting character. I have no issues with his development or plot but it would have been interesting to see how he dealt with characters south of the wall.

As much as readers get annoyed with Dany stuck in Essos, Jon is stuck at the wall as well. I get the feeling that we will never see him south of the neck. His story will most probably begin and end at the wall. Along with Bran.

I think that Jon and Bran are the only major characters who travel the very least in the books. They went from Winterfell to the Wall. And that's about it. Except for some undercover operations beyond the wall. Even Dany has travelled quite a bit in Essos

As opposed to someone like Tyrion who has been all over the place. He travels from KL to WF, takes a trip to the Wall, is taken to the Vale by Cat, makes it back to KL and then travels to Pentos etc. I think Catelyn and Arya have also moved around quite a bit.

[Starfell]

I have always found Jon a bit boring as a character but that doesn't really bother me very much, I like having a Wall PoV because interesting stuff happens there.

Besides which, I'm very much of the opinion that desertion should mean death just as much for protagonists as it does for minor characters so now that he's there and he's taken his vows, I'd be very angry to see him let off to go and do other stuff.

[Jon's Queen Consort]

i agree and I think that he will get out of here after the reforge

[Dicer]

Besides which, I'm very much of the opinion that desertion should mean death just as much for protagonists as it does for minor characters so now that he's there and he's taken his vows, I'd be very angry to see him let off to go and do other stuff.

Well, we do have Mance going off and doing stuff despite being a deserter...

[Arya Targaryen]

I just don't see Jon leaving the wall. We have to hav a pov from the wall and Sam is not there. I don't think Mel will be our pov from the wall and I don't think there will be any new povs. As long as the NW exists I think that's where Jon will be.

In ACOK Jon was north of the Wall (so not AT the Wall), and we didn't have a POV there either. It wasn't that much of a problem. And now we have Bran, who is a POV and can see practically anything. If GRRM wants to show us something, he still can show it through Bran's eyes. And the NW (at least what is left of them after the cliffhanger in ADWD) can go with Jon. If the Others break through (I hope they will), Jon must leave the Wall. Or he can get kicked out.

[Ice Turtle]

For some reason I would really like Jon to go to Harrenhall, but Wnterfell is probably the most south he will go as long as the Wall stands. And even that may be only as Ghost or in a dream.

I don't find Jon being at the Wall annoying. The thing is that even if he is going nowhere people are going to him, Mance and Stannis are only first two I think, many other including probably Ramsay will follow.

[RedDeadWedding]

I have always found Jon a bit boring as a character but that doesn't really bother me very much, I like having a Wall PoV because interesting stuff happens there.

Besides which, I'm very much of the opinion that desertion should mean death just as much for protagonists as it does for minor characters so now that he's there and he's taken his vows, I'd be very angry to see him let off to go and do other stuff.

Agreed. I'd be really really pissed if Jon deserts the wall, he's too good for that. It would kind of be heartbreaking for me if Jon, who I believe is very honorable, to forsake his vows. I think if he did he should be executed just like all the other deserters. We may not like it as readers, but the vows of the wall are made that way because they work.

[Winterfellian]

As much as I love Jon's story, his NW vows take away the possibility of good character development and plot opportunities.

Am I the only one who wants Jon to get away from the Wall after he is resurrected (hopefully)?

I agree and disagree with you. Jon do seems very restricted by his vows and responsabilities to the NW to act to the full of his potential, but I don't think his presence there hinders his character development one bit.

His experiences at the wall (where he was told very early on that a man gets what he deserves after arriving too full of himself) under the influence of such people as Tyrion, Mormont, Maester Aemon, Donal Noye, Qhorin Halfhand, Mance Rayder, Ygrtitte and even Dalla as well as Jon's own experiences among two cultures that are very similar but prejudiced with one another has helped to shape him up into the person he has become by ADWD.

Jon started the story as a kid too prone to feel sorry for himself and with a chip on his shoulder on account of being a bastard. At the NW this notions were shattered by the conditions of the place as well as Donal Noye's lecture. Donall made him realize he was just a bully an that others have it so much worse than him. All of the people I mentioned above left their influence on Jon.Tyrion taught him to make his bastard status his own, Maester Aemon speech about choosing is a recurring theme in Jon's story, Qhorin taught him that honor means nothing in comparison to duty- protecting the realm, Mance taught him a style of leadership where the "man" is more important than power trappings or floppy ears, Dalla's lesson about magic being a sword without a hilt has kept Jon from taking the easy road where Melissandre and her powers are concerned, etc.

Jon is no longer the entitled kid he was in AGOT and this is due to his experiences at the Wall and the people he met along the way.

[Lord of Handle]

I do think (and hope) Jon will get to leave the wall.

But I don't feel like his character has been wasted on the Wall storyline. It's fun to imagine what could have been if he'd stayed in WF – the possibilities are really endless, but the storyline of the Wall and imminent Other invasion is essential to the plot so we need a POV up there.

And it's not like Jon hasn't had any character development at the Wall.

[Penguin king]

What is it about the Night's watch that precludes character development? Do you not think that Jon has grown as a character since AGOT? His vow is part of his character. It restricts him, but in dealing with those restrictions he changes and grows.

The Nights Watch as a setting has also presented Jon with plenty of action and drama, fighting wights in mormonts quarters, ranging beyond the wall, having to play the deserter with the wildlings, having to betray ygritte to save castle black, defending the wall from mances host, dealing with all the responsibilites and demands of being leader. getting stabbed.. Looks like a pretty busy plotline to me.

I'm really not sure what people are complaining about.

[bemused]

I don't think Jon will need either ... A: resurrecting or B: to remain at the wall.. One of the things that's beginning to come through more and more clearly ( and not just with the NW) is that the old rules don't fit the new situation , and will have to be restructured . Stripped down to basics , Old Nan's , so long as the men of the NW stay true ( that's , true to their purpose of opposing the Others ) sums up the essence of the NW vows ( which by the way , say "I am the watcher on the WALLS ", not just wall ). I can see no reason why some NW can't be in other locations , still being vigilant and working against the others without breaking the spirit or intention of the vow ,or their commitment to it.

A new understanding on the part of the NW is needed .. or a return to the old , original understanding. The question is not whether desertion deserves execution , but what truly constitutes desertion.. It's the same question we've already seen raised when Jon defected to Mance.

The vow, with it's added on political stipulations and traditions does not work any longer. The additions and amendments were failing badly at the beginning of the story. The pact with the 7 Kingdoms was not being lived up to on it's part ...before the Others appeared , and before the 7 Kingdoms dissolved into chaos. Now , those stipulations are pretty meaningless. It's time to get back to basics.

[Kahl Trollo]

I'm really not sure what people are complaining about.

I think it gets in the way of him stealing south, retaking Winterfell, becoming King of the North, riding a Dragon, and discovering his parentage then sitting the Iron Throne before riding off into a rainbow littered sunset.

(sorry Jon, but it looks like Rick might get the Unicorns)

[Penguin king]

I think it gets in the way of him stealing south, retaking Winterfell, becoming King of the North, riding a Dragon, and discovering his parentage then sitting the Iron Throne before riding off into a rainbow littered sunset.

(sorry Jon, but it looks like Rick might get the Unicorns)

I think you might be on to something.

[caravaggio]

No, you aren`t the only one, but I have doubts Jon will abandon NW due to technicality.

edit: spelling

I just don't see Jon leaving the wall. We have to hav a pov from the wall and Sam is not there. I don't think Mel will be our pov from the wall and I don't think there will be any new povs. As long as the NW exists I think that's where Jon will be.

I agree with both of these ideas. However...

Many readers believe Jon being stabbed happens in order for Jon to have a way out of the NW. I agree this might feel cheap to the reader and out of character for Jon.

If the stabbing only happens to remove Jon from play when The Others attack The Wall and it is destroyed (at least enough for them to go south) I think it makes more sense. There doesn't need to be a Wall POV anymore because there is no Wall or it is in ruins. The Night's Watch would likely be decimated, possibly eliminated, disbanded, or otherwise no longer in existence. Jon might wake up (or be resurrected up) and no longer be Lord Commander not because he betrays his vows, but because the Night's Watch is no longer around. Alternatively, he could still go on believing himself Lord Commander and go south to rally Northmen to defeat the Others or form a new Night's Watch/recruit people into the NW wit hWinterfell (or some other location) as a base of operations.

[Rhaenar]

I think it was a shame that Jon rejected stannis' offer to be legitimized and become the new Lord Stark in WF (plus marrying Val). It would have been interesting to perhaps see the northern lords rallying to him and perhaps leading part of stannis' army, get some vengeance for the RW.

On the other hand though.. the wall needs a strong POV character for the imminent attack of the Others and I really can't see anyone else doing it (Mel dosn't really fit). There's perhaps the potential for Mance though, if he somehow escapes Ramsay's clutches...