Scott Lynch’s The Republic of Thieves.. SPOILERS

[unJon]

My apologies. :dunce:

See now look what you went and did Plesz.

[Alytha]

Pless and UnJon! Long time no see, guys! :grouphug:

[unJon]

Hey Aly!

[Arthmail]

There is zero reason to keep this series going for 7 books.

[Ser Scot A Ellison]

Arthmail,

Too soon to say. If the first three books were to give backstory to the mainstory we will not know that until after ToE.

[Werthead]

Does that mean that he has The Thorn of Emberlain already written? ;)

Mostly. Gollancz have already provisionally scheduled it for October 2014, in a 'this date may change' kind of way.

AFAIK, Scott actually partially wrote ToE before deciding to do the backstory, and then wrote a very large chunk of the final version whilst editing Republic of Thieves, so I wouldn't be surprised if we got it relatively quickly. I wouldn't be too surprised if the books afterwards fell back to a novel every 18 months or so, all assuming, of course, that Scott's illness does not recur.

From my understanding, Gollancz, Lynch's British publisher, holds first rights to the books and does the major edits. Del Rey purchases those edits from Gollancz. Perhaps Wert can shed some light on this?

Gollance are the primary publishers and do the legwork on the editing (actually, two editors at Gollancz work on Scott's books, which was some interesting news from last night). The US publishers then also have a say as well, but they are not the first people to get hold of it. The situation is reversed for Pat Rothfuss (where his US publishers do the legwork on editing and then Gollancz have a say later in the process).

There is zero reason to keep this series going for 7 books.

Good thing it's a 14-book series, then ;) (sort of)

Even as of where I am now (p. 310 of RoT), it's clear why there has to be at least a few more. In fact, I found it fascinating that the titles of several of the future books books in the series (The Thorn of Emberlain, The Ministry of Necessity, The Mage and the Master Spy and Inherit the Night) kept coming up.

The 'Thorn of Emberlain' is a reference to Locke becoming a master criminal and spy in Emberlain, one of the cities of the Kingdom of the Seven Marrows. His nickname in Camorr was of course the 'Thorn of Camorr'. Locke's destiny seems to be to basically become the Glokta of Emberlain as war breaks out between it and the other cantons. The 'Ministry of Necessity' appears to be the secret police of Emberlain or at least that region. 'The Mage and the Master Spy' may be a reference to the Falconer (or Patience) and Locke. 'Inherit the Night' is the final intonation of the religious ritual where Locke joined the priesthood in Camorr, which indicates that the religious side of things may be critical.

I also get the impression that this initial series is about Locke's rise from street urchin to spymaster and possible subsequent fall against the backdrop of civil war. Republic suggests a metaplot where the Bondsmagi confront whatever force it was that destroyed the Eldren, but I suspect that might make more sense being held back for the sequel series.

[Alytha]

Mostly. Gollancz have already provisionally scheduled it for October 2014, in a 'this date may change' kind of way.

AFAIK, Scott actually partially wrote ToE before deciding to do the backstory, and then wrote a very large chunk of the final version whilst editing Republic of Thieves, so I wouldn't be surprised if we got it relatively quickly. I wouldn't be too surprised if the books afterwards fell back to a novel every 18 months or so, all assuming, of course, that Scott's illness does not recur.

That would be nice.

On the other hand, if George kills a Stark everytime somebody asks when the next book is out, what does Scott do? ;)

[Werthead]

On the other hand, if George kills a Stark everytime somebody asks when the next book is out, what does Scott do?

Torture Locke more? ;)

[Arthmail]

Arthmail,

Too soon to say. If the first three books were to give backstory to the mainstory we will not know that until after ToE.

Fair enough. I will be the first to admit, I've never entirely been a fan of the series. The first book was pretty good, though I felt it had some problems. The second book I bought because the cover was pretty, despite not being entirely convinced that I enjoy this series. I've yet to finish, or even really get past the first couple of chapters. Now, I have been known to put books down for several years and then pick them up again when I'm in a different place.

But I guess, how much is too much? Wert says its maybe a 14 book series - really? Even 7 is far too much with one character. I always liken it to a really great TV series. Generally, 5 seasons seems to be about the best in terms of plot and character development. Ideally, I just think fantasy should be able to deal with whatever it needs to within 1-6 books. At the most. At least with the same group of characters.

And I don't find Locke engaging enough to stick around for 7-14 books. Plus, I have problems these days committing to authors that can't commit to their work if they are intending massive epics. Now I know that Lynch had problems with depression. I come from a family that suffers from it pretty bad. That being said, I am just not interested in waiting for 2-5 years spans between books.

[Snowborn]

I think the second series of seven books will be set a generation or two after the first series, with new characters, but in the same world.

[Arthmail]

I think the second series of seven books will be set a generation or two after the first series, with new characters, but in the same world.

I can digest that fairly easily. I like that idea. But I can only stick with the same group of people for so long.

[Guy Kilmore]

I think the second series of seven books will be set a generation or two after the first series, with new characters, but in the same world.

That could be kind of amusing, with Locke being the new Chains.....desperate for a family and a legacy.

[Werthead]

Yeah, the plan is that the first 7-book series is about Locke (hence why it's called The Gentleman Bastard, singular) and the sequel will be about something else, but 20-odd years later. Scott hasn't said - fairly obviously - if Locke will be involved in the later books. However, I think it's also unclear how much time the first series by itself will span.

[henderson]

Wert,

This is the first I have read about a second 7 book series by Scott Lynch. When did he mention this and in what context?

Thanks.

[kuenjato]

Wert,

This is the first I have read about a second 7 book series by Scott Lynch. When did he mention this and in what context?

Thanks.

I can't link it exact, but it has been stated in multiple interviews going back to the first few after TLoLL that two series were planned.

I recall Lynch once stating that he planned on writing a book every eight months, too...

[Altherion]

This is the first I have read about a second 7 book series by Scott Lynch. When did he mention this and in what context?

It's mentioned in a few places. Here is one:

I have firm plans for the Gentleman Bastard sequence. Assuming that it continues to be commercially successful enough that my publishers will give me carte blanche to keep going, I would like to follow it with a further seven books, set about 20 years after the end of Inherit the Night, book seven of the current sequence. Picking up generationally from what has happened before, while some old characters will return, a largely new cast would have to deal with the consequences of what happened in the first seven books.

[henderson]

Altherion,

Thanks for the link for the interview with Scott Lynch.

[Dunedane]

Greetings,

I'm brand new to this forum. LoLL is one of my absolutely favorite books and I enjoyed RSORS, although I admit it wasn't as good. RoT falls far short in my opinion mainly because of the lack of a high stakes gambit, which has been said before.

The reason I found this forum was because I was searching for help in understanding exactly why Sabetha left. I must say that I am very happy with the ideas that have been put forward to explain her reaction to the painting. I would like to share a couple of thoughts which are a bit wide ranging, as so much has been said. Please don't take me to task too much for grammar either. :bowdown:

First, I do not think that Scott Lynch would include incest, even the reincarnated kind. I find the concept of Sabetha as the reborn wife and Locke as the bondmage in the stolen body as much more plausible (although I hope not true). This would also seem to make sense when applied to why she fled. She has repeatedly demonstrated that she hates the idea of destiny or fate, she doesn't like being trapped. Many folks on here also complained about how the love story between Locke and Sabetha as adults seemed to be too much like teenagers. I think it's important to note that we're dealing with 2 extremely emotionally damaged people and that often people deeply in love will act like teenagers.

I think the idea of Sabetha as the daughter makes a bit more sense to me, but it's hard to predict where Lynch will take things. I also prefer this because I like as little magic use as possible in my books (why I love earlier ASOIAF more) and reincarnation does not interest me.

On the complaints about the play, I have to agree with the idea that it would have been better off as a novella. I think it was great information to have, it was great to learn more about Sabetha, but it did interrupt the main storyline and was too long. I think a novella for each of the minor or supporting characters would be greeted warmly (especially the twins). The fact that the play story was so long makes me think that we are supposed to read more into those events then we seem to be and increases the odds that our Locke and Sabetha's fate is foreshadowed there, as someone on here suggested.

I really think we will see more about Locke as agent of the 13th, not just a priest, but an instrument of his will. I prefer seeing Locke more deeply connected to the religion of the book than the magic.

I will continue to read this series and expect a much better follow up to RoT, but if Jean winds up dying as some suggest I might throw it down right there. God he's awesome.

Thanks for letting me in!

[Werthead]

RoT falls far short in my opinion mainly because of the lack of a high stakes gambit

I think this is a problematic attitude to take into a book. Just because there's been such a gambit in past volumes does not mean there will be one (or ones) in future ones. This series was never meant to be 'Locke and Jean Ripping People Off' with slight variations each time, and it's limiting to read a book going in with such preconceptions. I think the author has every right to change things up and take the next book in a different direction to the previous ones. I'm enjoying it a lot more than Red Seas partially because of the lack of such a gambit, and it allows Lynch to do different things with the characters and narrative.

I agree that the flashback chapters are too long and the structure doesn't entirely support it (in fact, I'm wondering if reading the flashback chapters in one go and then the present-day text in one might improve the book), but I'm very relieved it's not just Fantasy Ocean's Eleven III.

[Migey]

Thanks for letting me in!

Who say's we let you in? Maybe we don't want you. Have you even sacrificed a virgin goat yet? No? Didn't think so.