45 replies to this topic

[Ser Dermett Corbray]

So what did everyone think of this? I understand the need to cut out minor characters (of which Jacelyn Bywater is probably classed) but it seemed a bit odd how Bronn went from scruffy mercenary to arguably one of the cities most key figures instantly. Hard to imagine that the city watch would accept Bronn as their leader like that.

It was his gradual rise from Tyrion's bodyguard to de facto captain of his band of guards to knight to minor lord (just finished AFFC) in the book that made Bronn such a cool character. They've pretty much catapulted him to the top of a tree without much reasoning.

Ironhand Bywater was an astute choice because not only did Tyrion give himself one more key friend within the city but it showed that it wasn't all about making allies; Bywater was a city watch veteran and had earned the respect of his colleagues. In the book, Tyrion was showing that he could be a fair and just leader and not like his sister in promoting only his friends and lickspittles.

Of all the changes so far, this minor one bothers me the most.

[boojam]

I wondered will Bronn get a new uniform?
How long will he stay commander of the City Watch?

Anyone else note the disappointment on Tyrion's face for the answer Bronn gave to the question posed to him?

[Greywolf2375]

boojam, on 12 April 2012 - 07:06 AM, said:

Anyone else note the disappointment on Tyrion's face for the answer Bronn gave to the question posed to him?

I think that is the first inkling he gets that Bronn is really all about Bronn.  Previously he knew he was a merc of course, but there were some lines he thought wouldn't be crossed.  This is the first time he sees a Bronn in the light that ends up (bookwise) poorly for Tyrion.  Who knows what will happen here.

It would be rather odd for Tyrion to ask Bronn now to fight for him later on.

[sarah.jenice]

It honestly didn't bother me at all. I really like the actor that plays Bronn, and I think it was a very reasonable decision to not have to introduce a new actor for that role. People I know that haven't read the books are having trouble following all of the new faces as is.

[Mr. E]

Greywolf2375, on 12 April 2012 - 07:08 AM, said:

I think that is the first inkling he gets that Bronn is really all about Bronn.  Previously he knew he was a merc of course, but there were some lines he thought wouldn't be crossed.  This is the first time he sees a Bronn in the light that ends up (bookwise) poorly for Tyrion.  Who knows what will happen here.

It would be rather odd for Tyrion to ask Bronn now to fight for him later on.

I agree, I really like that scene, and as someone pointed out in another thread, it really shows Tyrion's hypocrisy. He acts like he's taking some moral stance but at the end of the scene it's like he realizes that he's replaced a baby-killer with a slightly gruffer baby-killer who has the marked difference of being on Tyrion's side.

[Victaerys Ironfist]

Seeing how Jacelyn was got rid of after Blackwater (can't remember if he fled or was killed) I expect when Tywin comes back in Season 3, one of his first actions will be getting rid of Bronn as Commander, so I don't see this change disrupting or changingthe big picture to much.

[Lord Varys]

Bywater was killed by his own men during the Battle of the Blackwater. I guess Tywin will fire Bronn while Tyrion is between life and death, just as Tywin got rid of all of Tyrion's people during this time in the books. Since they decided to cut Ser Jacelyn, making Bronn the Lord Commander of the City Watch was the logical decision. I've no problem with that.

[Jamie Lannister]

I thought it was logical too. Tyrion wanted to get rid of Slynt and put one of his own creatures in charge, and who better than perhaps the most loyal (ostensibly) person in your direct employ to take up the mantle?

For Bronn, it probably comes off as "knowing the right people." Serving as the top enforcer to the King's Hand certainly helped move him up the ladder.

[Ser Sweets]

One of the changes the adaptation made which I like, though it does call question to the differentiation between book Tyrion and show Tyrion's natures.

[Jojen]

Greywolf2375, on 12 April 2012 - 07:08 AM, said:

I think that is the first inkling he gets that Bronn is really all about Bronn.

But Tryion's supposed to be a good judge of character. You'd think he'd have known Bronn's answer without needing to ask him first. Unless the point of the scene was to take Tyrion's confidence down a peg and show that even he, one of the most intelligent men in the series, can make mistakes.

Edited by Jojen, 12 April 2012 - 12:53 PM.

[boojam]

Mr. E, on 12 April 2012 - 09:25 AM, said:

I agree, I really like that scene, and as someone pointed out in another thread, it really shows Tyrion's hypocrisy. He acts like he's taking some moral stance but at the end of the scene it's like he realizes that he's replaced a baby-killer with a slightly gruffer baby-killer who has the marked difference of being on Tyrion's side.

Hypocrisy!? Doesn't it show Tyrion's disappointment in trying find some human decency and having his hopes dashed?

Edited by boojam, 12 April 2012 - 01:07 PM.

[Iron Captain]

I didn't like the change either, only because I think it takes away from the moves made by Bronn in the book.  He went from sellsword, to sworn (sell)sword of an important lord, to knight, to husband of a noble lady, to minor lord himself.

In a way Bronn played his own game of thrones quite well, and this upjump to commander of the city watch doesn't fit into the sequence of how things happened in the books (I don't think him getting knighted to "Ser Bronn of the Blackwater" will mean as much now).

And most importantly, i'm quite worried he will take Ser Bywater's place on the blackwater, and they will kill his character during the battle.  Bronn still has his part to play in the books, but I could see the TV show cutting it out (as it isn't central to the story).  I don't want the TV show to kill him off, which I think is a realistic possibility.

Edited by Iron Captain, 12 April 2012 - 01:18 PM.

[Buckwheat]

I thought it was a good change, also it amused me greatly. The look on Tyrion's face after Bronn answers him is also very good.

[Ferrum Aeternum]

I found it to be a nice unexpected coup de grace to a very entertaining and well-played scene.  The logistics should work themselves out one way or another.  He'll still end up being Ser Bronn of the Blackwater.  I don't see the logic in Bronn's story overlapping with Ser Jacelyn's either.  Wouldn't make much sense to kill him off at this point, as his interactions with Tyrion in ASOS will make for great TV.

[Hear Us Roar]

i was fine with it. The less redundant characters the better

[Ser Dermett Corbray]

Iron Captain, on 12 April 2012 - 01:17 PM, said:

I didn't like the change either, only because I think it takes away from the moves made by Bronn in the book.  He went from sellsword, to sworn (sell)sword of an important lord, to knight, to husband of a noble lady, to minor lord himself.

In a way Bronn played his own game of thrones quite well, and this upjump to commander of the city watch doesn't fit into the sequence of how things happened in the books (I don't think him getting knighted to "Ser Bronn of the Blackwater" will mean as much now).

And most importantly, i'm quite worried he will take Ser Bywater's place on the blackwater, and they will kill his character during the battle.  Bronn still has his part to play in the books, but I could see the TV show cutting it out (as it isn't central to the story).  I don't want the TV show to kill him off, which I think is a realistic possibility.

Good points, that last one was interesting. Could be the first instance of the TV show killing off a character who wasn't killed in the book. Let's be honest, the only worthwhile thing that came out of his marriage to Lollys was him naming the kid Tyrion to piss off Cersei

[LuisDantas]

Mr. E, on 12 April 2012 - 09:25 AM, said:

I agree, I really like that scene, and as someone pointed out in another thread, it really shows Tyrion's hypocrisy. He acts like he's taking some moral stance but at the end of the scene it's like he realizes that he's replaced a baby-killer with a slightly gruffer baby-killer who has the marked difference of being on Tyrion's side.

How is that hypocrisy?  More like taking charge (and therefore, responsibility).

For all his flaws, Tyrion isn't likely to order the killing of babies.

[Ser Reptitious]

Lord Ashford, on 12 April 2012 - 05:27 PM, said:

Could be the first instance of the TV show killing off a character who wasn't killed in the book.

Not really. Drogo already killed one of his bloodriders (name escapes me at the moment) in the first season who remained very much alive in the books. Also, Rakharo just got himself killed this past episode and he's still around in the books.

[Iron Captain]

Ser Reptitious, on 12 April 2012 - 05:54 PM, said:

Not really. Drogo already killed one of his bloodriders (name escapes me at the moment) in the first season who remained very much alive in the books. Also, Rakharo just got himself killed this past episode and he's still around in the books.

I think those deaths are a little different.  Drogo killed Mago, a ko not a bloodrider.

And 'Rakharo' was pretty much Jhogo from the books, although the death is different I read that they cast somebody else to play the all-rolled-into-one bloodrider that 'Rakharo' played in the first season.  You're technically right in that it's a change from the books, but those were more or less throwaway characters (in the way they used them in the first season), Bronn isn't.

[Lord of Brewtown]

I'm fine with how they merged Bywater into Bronn for the show.  Gives Bronn more to do/reason to be on screen, and is a sensible cut.  For me that doesn't affect much.  Also fine with how they seem to be merging Davos's son into several characters.  What I don't like is how they seem to be getting rid of Shireen, and possibly Jojen & Meera.  That's not necessary.  Even if you don't show Shireen, just mention her.  That changes the story too much for me.