Herr Fick Posted January 9, 2011 Share Posted January 9, 2011 We talked quite a lot about possible flashbacks in the R+L=J thread and in the comments of winter-is-coming's respective weblog posts. There were different opinions: Many view flashbacks like the Tower of Joy, the duel at the Trident or Jaime on the Iron Throne as integral to the story and thus necessary for the series. Others, while giving credit to the scenes' power, voiced concerns regarding their cost or their potential to further complicate an already intricate story. As always, some are against flashbacks in contemporary film or television productions, because they tend to be a clumsy excuse for well-written dialogue. Most posters, however, seem to have loved the scenes in the novels and would like to watch them on screen.But because nobody knew if Mr Benioff and Mr Weiss would include flashbacks at all and because (with the exception of Jon Arryn) no officially announced casting indicated such scenes, the discussion revolved around a big IF.Since Winter's superb coverage of the TCA event in Los Angeles, we know more. Winter wrote:So anyway, about the roundtables this afternoon... We know everyone's main question was about flashbacks... David & Dan did say that they would be using scenes that happened prior to the beginning of the books to help flesh out the back story At which point, FaB mentioned the scene of Brandon being tortured in the throne room... ...David gave a start and said, "How did you know about that?" So I think we can take that as a confirmation. ;) GRRM provided further clarification when he stated that have cast the Mad King! So flashbacks are in folks! David & Dan seemed like they wanted to keep some of these surprises, so we will just have to wait and see whether Tower of the Joy or the Battle of the Trident makes it into the show... ...although David gave an example of how they needed to reveal past events via dialogue with a new scene that was filmed of King Robert getting drunk and sharing old battle stories with Barristan Selmy.I think that's great news!Now we know for sure that there will be flashbacks (other than those featuring Jon Arryn) and we have confirmation that this is one. Since Aerys II has been cast and could appear in several scenes, I think we can hope for at least one other moment of Jaime-Lannister-badassery. And if they show Brandon's torture (which could very well be left out and covered in dialogue), why would they not show the Tower of Joy or the duel at the Trident?... :)Thanks again to the people of winter-is-coming for their effort! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ser_not_appearing_yet Posted January 9, 2011 Share Posted January 9, 2011 Well, its not me to say I told you so... but <.< Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Padraig Posted January 9, 2011 Share Posted January 9, 2011 Cool. :) I wonder who is playing Brandon then? And how they are going to introduce that scene. In the books they don't show it until Jaime's chat with Catelyn in aCoK. In that way, it would be a curious choice if it (and Jon Arryn) are the only flashbacks. Actually, showing it earlier will detract from Jaime's revelations. Although, maybe he will focus on something else.Somebody has mentioned that there is a scene where Ned meets Jaime sitting on the steps to the throne (in the present day). Given what it echoes, not sure does it make it more or less likely that we'll have a flashback to their previous encounter in the throne room. In many ways it is easier to flash back to scenes with Brandon and Aerys since they are dead. You don't have to worry about making them look 17 years younger. Might be easier to do the ToJ since its all dreamy anyhow.I still think the Trident by far is the simplest thing to cover with dialogue. But its a nice image.And amusing that they forgot that the scene was in the preview. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZombieWife Posted January 9, 2011 Share Posted January 9, 2011 I think flashbacks are imperative. Dialogue can be weighed down by explanatory exposition. It's far more powerful to see the action "in scene" then it is to be told what happens. Isn't that the whole "showing versus telling" thing? Haha.I prefer flashbacks. Though, I'm confused by the R+L=J thing. (I'm new, sorry.) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Padraig Posted January 9, 2011 Share Posted January 9, 2011 I think flashbacks are imperative. Dialogue can be weighed down by explanatory exposition. It's far more powerful to see the action "in scene" then it is to be told what happens. Isn't that the whole "showing versus telling" thing? Haha.I prefer flashbacks. Though, I'm confused by the R+L=J thing. (I'm new, sorry.)Welcome to the site. :)To me, show don't tell is fine if the scene is essential. That's where the arguing comes in though. What is essential and what can be avoided? And of course, if you are trying to keep a secret, showing a scene important to that secet will make that task a lot more difficult. E.g. Lyanna dieing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Angalin Posted January 9, 2011 Share Posted January 9, 2011 Though, I'm confused by the R+L=J thing. (I'm new, sorry.)Rhaegar + Lyanna = Jon. The latest thread discussing it should be stickied at the top of the General forum.Nice to see you here. :) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZombieWife Posted January 9, 2011 Share Posted January 9, 2011 Oh! That sheds a bit of light. Thank you, Angalin. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aimlessgun Posted January 9, 2011 Share Posted January 9, 2011 Good news. I was one of the people who wondered if they would be in, but I'm glad to be wrong in this case :) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gertrude Posted January 9, 2011 Share Posted January 9, 2011 I was one arguing that they weren't 'essential' per se, but I am glad to see some of them will be in :)Cool. :) I wonder who is playing Brandon then? I thought some of the confusion about that pic in the preview was because we thought it was Bean tied up and tortured (and then argued if it he was portraying Ned or Brandon). It's not like they would have to cast a good actor to be Brandon if all we see is him screaming and frothing at the mouth (and if there is more to Brandon, then it is even more confusing to have Bean play him) They just needed to find someone with the right look. So I guess I will have to wait and see how it plays out, but that particular bit of casting seems odd to me right now. Also, Padraig touched on this, but who is remembering this? Jaime is the only candidate I think, and season 1 is an odd time for him to be thinking about it. I know, I know - wait and see how they brilliantly bring this all together. But what else are we all supposed to do until April? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lady Winter Rose Posted January 9, 2011 Share Posted January 9, 2011 FaB mentioned the scene of Brandon being tortured in the throne room......David gave a start and said, "How did you know about that?"So I think we can take that as a confirmation. ;)Errr.....How sure it is confirmation? He didn't told "How did you know that we are filming that scene?" Maybe they discouse about alternative approach to give audience clue what happend. :dunno: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Mance Posted January 9, 2011 Share Posted January 9, 2011 season 1 is an odd time for him to be thinking about itMaybe they're moving some character exposition up to more quickly invest new viewers? I wouldn't be surprised if they tie it in to the new and "improved" Ned/Jaime rivalry as well, perhaps even having Ned flash on his strangling brother when he looks at Jaime. And yes, I know Ned wasn't there to "remember" the scene, but he could easily have developed a picture in his mind's eye from what he's heard about the event. Actually, I kind of like this idea. It's another look at Ned's perspective of The Kingslayer to be juxtaposed in season 3 when we get to hear Jaime's side of things. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Padraig Posted January 9, 2011 Share Posted January 9, 2011 I wouldn't be surprised if they tie it in to the new and "improved" Ned/Jaime rivalry as well, perhaps even having Ned flash on his strangling brother when he looks at Jaime. I don't think Ned would think of his brother when he looks at Jaime but given how they trade insults most of the time, I could see Jaime making a comment about how Ned's brother was a good fighter at least. And then commenting how it didn't do him much good when it came to Aerys. (I think that would be suitably barbed). Cue flashback. So it will be more a Jaime flashback than a Ned flashback.Lady Lyanna, they have also said that Aerys is cast. So I think its a pretty safe assumption to make. :) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phantom Posted January 10, 2011 Share Posted January 10, 2011 I knew it. Wonder what episode they'll have the flashback in since if I remember correctly, in the books Jaime only revealed the details to Catelyn the details in ACoK. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Godric Posted January 10, 2011 Share Posted January 10, 2011 So happy about this. I really did think the throne room scene from the trailer was Brandon and not Ned. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Padraig Posted January 10, 2011 Share Posted January 10, 2011 They certainly got somebody that looks like Bean. And he seems aged up compared to the book (where he is early 20s IIRC). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Halfhand Posted January 10, 2011 Share Posted January 10, 2011 Errr.....How sure it is confirmation? He didn't told "How did you know that we are filming that scene?" Maybe they discouse about alternative approach to give audience clue what happend. :dunno:Just wanted to clarify that David did, after FaB/About Yea High explained how we knew about that scene, he did confirm that it was in. And, of course, GRRM confirmed that Aerys was cast. And he said he thinks they cast someone as Brandon, but he wasn't 100% positive. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
evanesco75 Posted January 12, 2011 Share Posted January 12, 2011 I'm dreading this one, almost as much as I'm anticipating it. Jaime's memory of the Starks/Aerys always made such an impression on me. So horrific, so sad. I'm really excited about this, and just the idea of some FBs (of course, we're not talking LOST style FBs either). But yes, a few pertinent memories would do wonders in explaining motivations, history, and general exposition. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
So1ar Posted January 12, 2011 Share Posted January 12, 2011 i'm concerned how this particular flashback with aerys will play out. after a clash of kings it made me look at jaime in a slightly different light. my worry is it might take away from his character. again though, i'll have to wait and see how it plays out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
evanesco75 Posted January 12, 2011 Share Posted January 12, 2011 Yes, the memory is meant to cast a new light on Jaime by acquainting us with his remorse 'he went away inside', as well as justification for Aerys' murder.Sorry, a touch confused: what exactly do you mean by 'it might take away from his character'? Do you think it'll make him less diabolical? Or more? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MirriMaz Posted January 12, 2011 Share Posted January 12, 2011 i'm concerned how this particular flashback with aerys will play out. after a clash of kings it made me look at jaime in a slightly different light. my worry is it might take away from his character. again though, i'll have to wait and see how it plays out.The flashback doesn't have to be told through Jaime (at least not the part about Ned's family), so they can show the torture and death this season along with Lyanna's death simply by showing Ned dreaming and then next season Jaime can tell Catelyn about his history with Arys. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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