GOODKIND IX - Killer Queen

[Moosicus]

I have a feeling if Goodkind wrote an entire novel from the perspective of a mentally ill dullard it would make alot more sense.

Alright, maybe not. Dude just can't write. Go easy on the animal metaphors, Terry.

Based on the last few novels particularly, I'd suggest that the were written by a mentally ill dullard, and they still don't make that much sense.

-whump!

[Bazzlebane]

A true king should serve. That's probably one of the very few sensible things in the whole of that bloody book.

Okay. I concede on the king/servant point. But I still maintain that this sentence is a truly horribly written description of events:

She dropped like a sack of grain pushed out of the loft – whump.

[Myrddin]

I haven't stepped into a TG thread in over a year, but the rate of new threads on the subject is becoming... disturbing.

[niamh]

Oba also teaches us that its good to learn new things.

Oba makes an awful lot of sense, obviously. That's why he's a bloodthirsty murdering jackass, as we must all be according to The Cult ©

[Watcher]

Wow, fratricide seems fairly common in the Terryverse. I think a good clue if he spent the money his mom give him would be if he had a coin or medicine. If he didn’t have either then I think it would be pretty obvious that he spent it drinking or whoring.

I’m also confused on another point. Is Oba a good or bad guy? Normally person murders his mother = bad. However this is from Terry (BBHN), where bad and good is determined by why you do something, not by your actions.

So is killing your mother who is a horrible person and stifles your individualism a good or bad deed?

Reasons he might be a bad guy:

Killing his mother = 3 point

He is a Rahl = 1 point (expection, Richard gets good points for this)

He’s not Richard = 5 points

Reasons that indicted he’s a good guy:

He didn’t rape the corpse = 4 points

She had it coming for being a conniving bitch = 2 points

He expressed his individuality by breaking with authority figures = 3 points

The score is tied at 9 points. The tiebreaker is if Richard kills him. Then he must be evil

He was a new man. A man who pursued intellectual interests when they arose.

Is this anything like when a “thing†rise?

[Bazzlebane]

W/o ever having read the book, and only knowing of the character's existence because of the QotD, I think I'd bet money that Richard killed him.

[The Wolf Maid]

“Oba the oaf,†said his mother as she strode into the barn. “Standing around, doing nothing, thinking nothing, worth nothing. That’s you, isn’t it? Oba the oaf?â€

She glided to a stop, her mean little mouth all puckered up as she peered down her nose at him.

She strode, then she glided. What the hell? How can you glide to a stop after striding?

[VigoTheCarpathian]

Ahhhh, I had meetings all day and could not enjoy the new car smell of a new and awesome TG thread.

I don't believe Oba was killed by Richard: I think it has something to do with Oba having a bunch of rocks falling on him, and then Richard and Kahlan having the moral clarity to sit and watch while the slowly collapsing rubble crushes him to death.

My whole take on Oba is that he is Richard without a Yeard. He only had the "Psycho"-esque dominating mother stereotype to learn from, and didn't have Zedd to guide him. So, he ends up a murdering sociopath, who does not have a Sword/philosophy loosely based on Objectivism/Yeard to aid him, and absolve him of his crimes.

Now, I'm going to hazard an outrageous theory: Jensen is Kahlan without her slutty nature. See, growing up all impoverished, with only a goat for a friend (albeit, a very noble one), she has a crazy inherent power (negation of magic), but was easily swayed by evil, since she did not have the Truth that is Richard around. I'm reaching back into my memory, but I even think that Jensen only had consentual sex, even though it was with an evil man.

So, my book report in summation:

Pillars of Creation was all about showing the flaws of not having moral clarity on your side. No Yeard = Hannibal Lecter. No sluttiness + no Yeard in your life/heart = only goats will be your friend. If you are a woman, you can be saved by having a Yeard in your life. If you are a man, the best thing you can hope for is to have a Yearded One watch you die a painfully slow death.

ETA: The Queen Richard (Long live the Queen!) pics gave me a boner. Damn you both, Maid Sansa, and MinDonner.

[Jaxom 1974]

The conniving bitch. She didn’t even trust her own son. What kind of mother was she, anyway?

What proof did she have other than a missing, tiny scratch on the edge of a coin? None. The woman was a lunatic.

I swear to god I thought you'd added this part and forgot to put it in red, MM.

For good measure, he whacked her three more times, quick as he could,

Nothing says "good fantasy writing" like the Batman-esque use of the word "Whack"...

[Snowbeat]

These threads are getting boring. We need Mystar to come in here and spice things up.

[Jaxom 1974]

These threads are getting boring. We need Mystar to come in here and spice things up.

I can't disagree more. We don't need someone else to come in here and tell us how to discuss our likes and silikes of what TG stands for with his writing. Frikken spoilsport is what mystar is. Let him have his little corner of the internet and leave us ours. Besides, even if he did show up, he'd simply make broad statements with no evidence to back it up and then tell us that we have no lives.

I don't need mystar to tell me that. I can do that well enough on my own.

Viva Le QotD!

[MeanMrMustard]

Ayn Rand QOTD (2) from The Fountainhead

Altruism is the doctrine which demands that man live for others and place others above self.

No man can live for another. He cannot share his spirit just as he cannot share his body. But the second-hander has used altruism as a weapon of exploitation and reversed the base of mankind's moral principles. Men have been taught every precept that destroys the creator. Men have been taught dependence as a virtue.

The man who attempts to live for others is a dependent. He is a parasite in motive and makes parasites of those he serves. The relationship produces nothing but mutual corruption. It is impossible in concept. The nearest approach to it in reality--the man who lives to serve others--is the slave. If physical slavery is repulsive, how much more repulsive is the concept of servility of the spirit? The conquered slave has a vestige of honor. He has the merit of having resisted and of considering his condition of evil. But the man who enslaves himself voluntarily in the name of love is the basest of creatures. He degrades the dignity of man and he degrades the concept of love. But this is the essence of altruism.

Men have been taught that the highest virtue is not to achieve, but to give. Yet one cannot give that which has not been created. Creation comes before distribution--or there will be nothing to distribute. The need of the creator comes before the need of any possible beneficiary. Yet we are taught to admire the second-hander who dispenses gifts he has not produced above the man who made the gifts possible. We praise an act of charity. We shrug at an act of achievement.

Men have been taught that their first concern is to relieve the suffering of others. But suffering is a disease. Should one come upon it, one tries to give relief an assistance. To make that the highest test of virtue is to make suffering the most important part of life. The man must wish to see others suffer--in order that he may be virtuous. Such is the nature of altruism. The creator is not concerned with disease, but with life. Yet the work of the creators has eliminated one form of disease after another, in man's body and spirit, and brought more relief from suffering than any altruist could ever conceive.

[Snowbeat]

I can't disagree more. We don't need someone else to come in here and tell us how to discuss our likes and silikes of what TG stands for with his writing. Frikken spoilsport is what mystar is. Let him have his little corner of the internet and leave us ours. Besides, even if he did show up, he'd simply make broad statements with no evidence to back it up and then tell us that we have no lives.

I don't need mystar to tell me that. I can do that well enough on my own.

Viva Le QotD!

Ah, but do you admit that we have a great time while ridiculing him and having it go right over his head?

[VigoTheCarpathian]

Yes, mystar is a most amusing personification, but to wish him back is ridding ones self of crab lice, and then having regrets about that scratching motion that you had grown so used to...

Opinion follows:

I myself think of all the "Goodkind can do no wrong" sort of people as jokes. Sure, there are people behind these voices on the Internet, but seriously...you pick up a fantasy book (Hey, guess what, it's published by Tor! That in itself makes it a fantasy book!) and suddenly you must defend what you consider to be this unassailable fount of Truth.

To turn the sword back on that sort of logic, does Richard sit there and follow everything Zedd has to say? Does he get all up in the Westlanders' faces, like "Zedd has sold over 50 million books! Zedd has invented Formula One racing, and has practiced it! You are all dumasses, LOL!"

[Knight of the Wineskin]

What I'm getting to is that Kahlan and Richard constitute a very specific archetype; they're the Heroes. As such, the embody the finest aspects of what it is to be human. They are the human spirit, incarnate. Symbolically, Kahlan getting raped would be the violation of Integrity itself. This is not an impossibility in itself - in fact, integrity is constantly in danger of violation, as symbolised by Kahlan's constant run-ins with horny and unscrupolous men. But Goodkind has, so far, shied back from this the very worst of possibilities.

Torturing your enemies for fun is the finest aspect of humanity? Obliterating the will of those you touch and making them your slaves is? Goodkind seems to revel in the degradation of humanity, complete with rape.

EDIT: ATTENTION ALL. Today I saw a Yearded woman. Can the Apocalypse be far behind?

[Mme Erzulie]

Jesus H. Christ, this guy is full of shit. I'm horrified that this senseless drivel actually passes for literature.

I mean,

She held it between her thumb and first finger, not simply to convey the coin itself, but its importance.

Convey the coin? What. The. Fuck.

Her hot glare was murderous, but her voice was arrestingly cool and collected

Whatever. Why not "hot glare" and "cool voice"? Arrestingly cool and collected? What does that shit mean?

Oba’s eyes turned up. He was right, she had him fixed in her deadly glare.

More of the same. How tall is this woman?

Her eyes were frightening. He could hardly breathe under their blistering scrutiny.

Organs in general have a very powerful impact on this series. Blistering scrutiny? Someone has been using their new thesaurus.

She looked so broad and powerful standing there before him, like an avenging spirit in the flesh come to speak for the dead.

This sentence is just so jam-packed with information. She looked so broad? What, like fat? I like the idea of an avenging spirit's spokesperson, though.

Oba stood frozen, his mind in a wild state of turmoil, like a rat with a foot on his tail.

Ok, I'm late for work now, thanks a lot, but yeah, the metaphors, baby. A wild state of turmoil like a rat with a foot on his tail? WTF? Try to picture a rat with foot on its tail (does that even happen?). Are the words you'd use to describe that image "wild state of turmoil"? Didn't think so. Myself, I'd use "calm state of tranquility".

[whelp]

Ok, this QotD was less disturbing than the previous ones, but still...

Quick as a fox, Oba whipped the shovel around, putting all his weight and strength behind the swing. The steel shovel rang like a bell against her skull.

Steel makes ringing noise when it hits bone? Hmm...

She dropped like a sack of grain pushed out of the loft – whump.

Holy whump, Batman! What's next?

The ring of steel on skull hung in the otherwise still air of the barn, slowly, slowly, slowly dying away. Silence, like a heavy shroud, settled around him.

Boy, he must have hit her hard, since it again rang - though I would imagine such a blow would rather shatter the skull, but maybe I read too much fantasy...

Her face looked different. She had an odd expression. He tiptoed closer for a look. Her skull was all misshapen, like a ripe melon broken on the ground.

This was so new that he couldn’t gather his thoughts.

Mama, her melon head, all broke open.

Hmm, after hitting it several times with a steel shovel? A wonder that she had any skull left...

A man who pursued intellectual interests when they arose.

Ok, so when did this retard-like guy learn words like intellectual interests?

[Johari]

God, these threads are so funny!

My dad has a copy of Wizard's first Rule in his office, you guys are making me seriously consider picking it up and reading it, or at least skimming through. Same thing with Big Rigs(widely considered to be the worst game ever made), you don't wanna support the kinda people who make this garbage, but sometimes you cant resist after reading some of the reviews. Kudos to your hilarious criticism, fellow Martin fans, and Mad Moose... YOU are my Richard

[Jaxom 1974]

Yo! Mad Moose. Was in Borders today and I actually found the Jagangbang/Kahlan scene you posted with only one flip through! People looked at me funny when I started laughing. I could only hold up Phantom and shrug. Then they smiled like the people do in those Mentos commercials. It was pleasant.

[KAH]

MM;

Kahlan carries one of the worst STD's imaginable. If you fuck her, and you aren't 100% madly in love with her, beyond a doubt no room for error, your mind is destroyed and you become a puppet.

Yeah, I can see why that would be tempting for Jagang. All this emperor stuff has become terribly stressful, deep inside he just want curl up in Kahlan's lap and be her little mindless S&M puppy dog.

For good measure, he whacked her three more times, quick as he could, then retreated to a safe distance, shovel at the ready, should she suddenly spring up to start yelling at him.

I see that Terry need to include master sentence builder on his resume. Just below Formula 1 driver.