Khal Jhaqo will be dragon food… what a nonsense!

[The Basilisk]

dany's plot is shit let's all just hope she dies, but it won't happen, the dothraki are all just going to turn on their Khal and go over to Dany because A: that's what always happens with Dany, B: lazy writing & plot dragon armor

[HexMachina]

dany's plot is shit let's all just hope she dies, but it won't happen, the dothraki are all just going to turn on their Khal and go over to Dany because A: that's what always happens with Dany, B: lazy writing & plot dragon armor

Thank you for this insightful comment. I'll sleep easier tonight now that you have made it.

[Reek Da Villain]

Daenerys finally has her horde of Dothraki screamers. They'll take her to Meereen.

[The Basilisk]

Remember when Robb failed to act like a king, and instead the teenage boy he was, for a moment? Jeez, it's a good thing consequences don't apply to Dany. I mean sure, you just got caught out alone by a fucking Khalasar, but whatever, Dragons.

What fascinating and creative writing.

[HexMachina]

Remember when Robb failed to act like a king, and instead the teenage boy he was, for a moment? Jeez, it's a good thing consequences don't apply to Dany. I mean sure, you just got caught out alone by a fucking Khalasar, but whatever, Dragons.

What fascinating and creative writing.

No one is making you read the series. Can you not clog up this discussion with irrelevant posts telling us you do not like Dany? Thank you

[House Ross]

Maybe Dany should have been executed at her wedding. Would have made for a much better story.

[House Ross]

I think Jhago burns, Dany has the remaining Doths lead her to the actual Khalasar to rally them behind her. Apparently we'll be spending quite some time with the Dothraki next book. Could be her rallying ALL of the Khalasars.

[Fire Eater]

Jhaqo emerges from the smoke which is drifting from the "grasses around them", and he finds her like "that". What is "that", exactly?

Well, GRRM makes it quite clear as far as I'm concerned. The narrative states that Daenerys goes and stands beside her dragon, who we can infer is within very close proximity to her (how far apart could they possibly be if they're both within reach of the same horse?). Afterwards, Jhaqo and his mounted warriors find her.

It says she goes to stand beside her dragon, it doesn't mention if she succeeds/

If GRRM wanted Dany to be caught off guard, why not just have them show up whilst she's still eating the horse?

Finally, there's no indication whatsoever that Drogon has flown away. That would be a HUGE omission. Hell, what would GRRM even write in the next chapter? "Drogon had flown away before the warriors arrived, without her even realising." ????

Honestly, I can't believe this discussion is even taking place.

Because, GRRM leaves things on cliffhangers. Drogon flying is still possibility, however slim you might think it to be.

Maybe Dany should have been executed at her wedding. Would have made for a much better story.

Except then what was the point of her arc if it didn't impact the storyline in Westeros?

Remember when Robb failed to act like a king, and instead the teenage boy he was, for a moment? Jeez, it's a good thing consequences don't apply to Dany. I mean sure, you just got caught out alone by a fucking Khalasar, but whatever, Dragons.

What fascinating and creative writing.

Hey, try not to sound be so snarky, and this isn't a hate thread.

[PatrickStormborn]

It says she goes to stand beside her dragon, it doesn't mention if she succeeds/

Because, GRRM leaves things on cliffhangers. Drogon flying is still possibility, however slim you might think it to be.

It does end on a cliffhanger - we don't know what's going to happen! He would not omit a fact as significant as Drogon flying away before the chapter ends. Why would he do that, when having Drogon fly away would actually lead to a better cliffhanger??

It says she goes to stand beside her dragon. "Dany ... went to stand beside her dragon." She went to do it. We can assume it was completed, considering that the narration was told in past-tense, and especially considering that Drogon is no more than a few feet away from her (evidence: they were both within reach of the horse).

After this happens, Jhaqo arrives.

If GRRM wanted us to think that Drogon had flown away and that Dany was caught before she managed to go back to Jhaqo, he would have given us some kind of indication. As it stands, he tells us that Jhaqo found her after she went to stand beside Drogon.

[Fire Eater]

It does end on a cliffhanger - we don't know what's going to happen! He would not omit a fact as significant as Drogon flying away before the chapter ends. Why would he do that, when having Drogon fly away would actually lead to a better cliffhanger??

It says she goes to stand beside her dragon. "Dany ... went to stand beside her dragon." She went to do it. We can assume it was completed, considering that the narration was told in past-tense, and especially considering that Drogon is no more than a few feet away from her (evidence: they were both within reach of the horse).

After this happens, Jhaqo arrives.

If GRRM wanted us to think that Drogon had flown away and that Dany was caught before she managed to go back to Jhaqo, he would have given us some kind of indication. As it stands, he tells us that Jhaqo found her after she went to stand beside Drogon.

It was past tense, but it still is not mentioned if she made it to Drogon. I think he passage was meant to be vague, and keep the reader guessing what happened/happens next.

[FireAndBlood.]

It was past tense, but it still is not mentioned if she made it to Drogon. I think he passage was meant to be vague, and keep the reader guessing what happened/happens next.

Ok, what gives? First you argue that Dany only flew Drogon once despite people showing you that it's actually spelled out in the text that she flew him many times. Now you're trying to argue she didn't even make it to Drogon in the three seconds it would have taken her to walk, what, 3 feet and that he might have flown away? Not everything has to be laid out in big, bright neon lights. Sometimes it's, you know, OK to infer these things.

[Dany Girl]

It was past tense, but it still is not mentioned if she made it to Drogon. I think he passage was meant to be vague, and keep the reader guessing what happened/happens next.

Do you realize how loud 50 horses are? I live next to 2 horses, they're half an acre away from my house, but if my windows are open I can hear them. The time from when I hear them to when they could reach my house would be more than enough time to walk around a dead horse. 50 horses would be way louder than my 2 neighbor horses, so unless they were in a full gallop she'd have easily enough time to reach Drogon. Even if they were at a full gallop she'd have enough time. Horses are big and loud! They make a lot of noise walking, especially a large group of them.

[cade]

It doesn't say she stood beside her dragon, but that she went to stand beside him. It doesn't say she made it or that Jhaqo caught her before she managed to make it.

She couldn't see that half a hundred had come up because of the smoke

She heard them coming: "she heard the sound of approaching horses. Dany rose, wiped her hands on her ragged undertunic, and went to stand beside her dragon. That was how Khal Jhaqo found her, when half a hundred mounted warriors emerged from the drifting smoke."

Deny it all you like. I'm not even trying to convince you, because it's become quite obvious that's an insane task, but it's plain as day that Jhaqo found her after she was standing by Drogon.

[Queen‍‍‍‍‍‍ Alysanne‍‍™]

I honestly don't know. It is just a theory of mine amongst others.

:dunno: If it's a theory then you have to explain the ground for it, you can't "not know", or it means you are just arguing for arguing sake.

[Mithras]

This I think is the most important line of your whole post. Failing to acknowledge any other scenario leaves no room for discussion. You have your opinion, is that not good enough for you? Apparently not otherwise this line wouldn't exist in your post.

Some people...

I didnot fail to acknowledge any other scenario. I started this debate to present my idea and urge people to refute it. So far, I am not convinced otherwise but if you can come up with a new argument which might convince me, I am listening.

[Fire Eater]

:dunno: If it's a theory then you have to explain the ground for it, you can't "not know", or it means you are just arguing for arguing sake.

I thought I already did explain the grounds for the theory. They are all theories here. I was referring to the distance between Dany and Drogon.

[frensj]

I did not say anything like that. I say that Jhaqo can easily kill Dany if she does something foolish but he won’t kill Dany because she won’t act like a fool. She is not in a position to command Jhaqo anything. At best, she could convince him to take her to VD. She will not risk Drogon or her own neck against 50 Dothraki warriors. She will send Drogon away.

Stormcloud was a young dragon never ridden before by 9 year old Aegon. I think he was around the same age with Drogon.

The tale reached Dragonstone only when Prince Aegon arrived desperately clinging to the neck of his dragon, Stormcloud. The boy was white with terror, shaking like a leaf and stinking of piss. Only nine, he had never flown before … and would never fly again, for Stormcloud had been terribly wounded as he fled, arriving with the stubs of countless arrows embedded in his belly and a scorpion bolt through his neck. He died within the hour, hissing as the hot blood gushed black and smoking from his wounds.

Note that the Triarchy was not trying to kill the princes; instead they tried to take them as hostages. Otherwise, they could have easily slain Aegon too. Aegon barely escaped and Stormcloud's first instinct was definitely to run the hell out of that place.

Dragons can be killed. The younger they are, the easier the job. Dragons are subject to disease and infection too. Sunfyre’s wounds were festered and rotting before he died.

Oh fucking hell, twice I typed this message and twice it got lost somehow. Third time good time; here goes.

Stormcloud was an even younger, smaller dragon. He could barely carry a 9yr old kid, weighing roughly 30kg. Drogon can carry Dany with ease it seems, she would be at least around 55kg.

Stormcloud died because he had a fucking scorpion bolt THROUGH his neck. Then still he flew for quite some distance with a heavy weight (for him) on his back. The Dothraki do not HAVE scorpions, they have puny normal bows... Also how Stormcloud got away shows me again how difficult it is to kill a big dragon. They can survive for hours even when they are exhausting themselves while there is a huge arrow sticking through their neck. Put a small arrow through your neck and you will likely die within the minute. Mind you that the people Stormcloud was facing had experience fighting dragons.

The better chance seems to be that either they have a master marksman (but I don't think anyone can be THAT accurate from horseback, lucky is possible of course) And they put an arrow in his eye. Or the Dothraki go down from their horses (do they ever do that in battle? I'm not so sure) And use their arrakhs to bluntly kill him. We saw that it took one big guy 7 blows right on the head to finish off a dragon, a bigger one yes but still.

[Mithras]

Oh fucking hell, twice I typed this message and twice it got lost somehow. Third time good time; here goes.

Stormcloud was an even younger, smaller dragon. He could barely carry a 9yr old kid, weighing roughly 30kg. Drogon can carry Dany with ease it seems, she would be at least around 55kg.

Stormcloud died because he had a fucking scorpion bolt THROUGH his neck. Then still he flew for quite some distance with a heavy weight (for him) on his back. The Dothraki do not HAVE scorpions, they have puny normal bows... Also how Stormcloud got away shows me again how difficult it is to kill a big dragon. They can survive for hours even when they are exhausting themselves while there is a huge arrow sticking through their neck. Put a small arrow through your neck and you will likely die within the minute. Mind you that the people Stormcloud was facing had experience fighting dragons.

The better chance seems to be that either they have a master marksman (but I don't think anyone can be THAT accurate from horseback, lucky is possible of course) And they put an arrow in his eye. Or the Dothraki go down from their horses (do they ever do that in battle? I'm not so sure) And use their arrakhs to bluntly kill him. We saw that it took one big guy 7 blows right on the head to finish off a dragon, a bigger one yes but still.

I don’t think Aegon did not ride Stormcloud because the dragon was not big enough to carry him. On the contrary, I think Aegon was not old enough to be allowed to ride his dragon. Since Stormcloud was able to carry him across the Narrow Sea with a bellyful of arrows and a scorpion bolt in the neck, I think it is quite possible that he was as large as Drogon, maybe even larger than him.

Stormcloud died from his wounds. That is plural, which means he did not die only from the wound at his neck. A belly full of arrows should kill a dragon slowly IMO.

The Dothraki start shooting arrows from horseback since they are 4 years old. I think they are quite capable of shooting Drogon where they like from that close range. Even if their horses go mad, they can always jump from their horses.

The arakhs of the Dothraki can do serious damage to his wings.

It is hard to slay a dragon without using a dragon but it is possible and they did it several times. Drogon is not Balerion. He might be lethally wounded by 50 Dothraki even if he manages to kill them all. Who better knows the Dothraki and Drogon better than Dany? I don’t think she will risk a fight.

[frensj]

I don’t think Aegon did not ride Stormcloud because the dragon was not big enough to carry him. On the contrary, I think Aegon was not old enough to be allowed to ride his dragon. Since Stormcloud was able to carry him across the Narrow Sea with a bellyful of arrows and a scorpion bolt in the neck, I think it is quite possible that he was as large as Drogon, maybe even larger than him.

Stormcloud died from his wounds. That is plural, which means he did not die only from the wound at his neck. A belly full of arrows should kill a dragon slowly IMO.

The Dothraki start shooting arrows from horseback since they are 4 years old. I think they are quite capable of shooting Drogon where they like from that close range. Even if their horses go mad, they can always jump from their horses.

The arakhs of the Dothraki can do serious damage to his wings.

It is hard to slay a dragon without using a dragon but it is possible and they did it several times. Drogon is not Balerion. He might be lethally wounded by 50 Dothraki even if he manages to kill them all. Who better knows the Dothraki and Drogon better than Dany? I don’t think she will risk a fight.

His size; could be. We might know more with future books about birth dates of Dragons, although I doubt it. I tried to find ages of Dragonriders but was not very successful in my attempt :P

To be fair, it does not say he died from his wounds: "... for Stormcloud had been terribly wounded as he fled, arriving with the stubs of countless arrows embedded in his belly and a scorpion bolt through his neck. He died within the hour, hissing as the hot blood gushed black and smoking from his wounds."

We can never know for sure that he would die from the arrows in his belly alone, but I'm quite confident that the scorpion bolt through his neck was the main factor at least. If he would have just the arrows, perhaps they could heal him. I don't remember that they mentioned some sort of dragon veterinarian, but stopping many small wounds is easier than stopping one very large wound obviously.

I agree that the Dothraki would be very skilled in shooting arrows from horseback. But I don't think ever they can be as good as a very skilled marksmen on foot. With their whole idea that men on foot are inferior, I don't know if they would fight like that.

They could do serious damage to the wings with whatever they have, no doubt, but that would leave them very vulnerable for the flames and claws. Better jump on top and start hacking away no? :)

But we can surely agree that Dany would normally not be so stupid as to attack them, tactics and chances of winning aside ;)

[IRON BANK]

Fire Eater,

When Drogon gets Dany from the pit, that is the first time the fly and the end of the chapter. When the next chapter begins on Dragonstone it is at least a week later. Since the first time she rode on him she rode on him several more times.

"She would have sooner returned to Meereen on dragon's wings, to be sure. But that was a desire Drogon did not seem to share. ........MOunted on Drogon's back, she oft felt as if she were learning to ride all over again.......Sometimes it did not seem to matter where she struck him, though; sometimes he went where he would and took her with him. Neither whip nor words could turn Drogon if he did not wish to be turned.......A few aches, an empty belly, chills by night..what does it matter when you can fly?"

Then the clencher;

"Was that first flight a thousand years ago? Sometimes it seemed as if it must be."

So yes, it is very clearly spelled out that she had several flights on Drogon between fleeing the pit and the beginning of the chapter. She says she 'oft' felt, meaning she flew often. She says 'sometimes' meaning more than once. Then she says 'was the first flight a thousand years ago', meaning there have been many flights since the first one.

Exactly: Dany has control of drogon, these people need to re read. Also The dragon flight will speed her story along.