GRRM: Some fans "have correctly predicted the ending"

[J. Stargaryen]

I think that is just par for the course in journalism today. Reporters are uninformed and lazy. All they care about is getting people to read the article.

Yes, this. And it's easier to mine reddit for theories since they have a ranking system for posts.

[Game Of Thrones]

Someone quoted GRRM supposedly saying that? I didn't hear that one before.

GRRM said 'despite everything, Stannis is a righteous man.'

[Ferocious Veldt Roarer]

Someone quoted GRRM supposedly saying that? I didn't hear that one before.

Yes, it makes an appearance every now and then. Google 'Stannis "closest thing to a hero"', you'll get multiple hits. People swear by it, George supposedly said those exact words, but no link is ever given. Nobody knows where this meme originated. Some suggest it's a creative interpretation of that Amazon interview, but how do you make a jump from "in spite of everything he is a righteous man, and not just a version of Henry VII, Tiberius or Louis XI" to "closest thing to a hero" eludes me. The leap that fruited in this very thread, "fans predicted the ending!", looks a little bit similar to me.

[UnmaskedLurker]

Yes, it makes an appearance every now and then. Google 'Stannis "closest thing to a hero"', you'll get multiple hits. People swear by it, George supposedly said those exact words, but no link is ever given. Nobody knows where this meme originated. Some suggest it's a creative interpretation of that Amazon interview, but how do you make a jump from "in spite of everything he is a righteous man, and not just a version of Henry VII, Tiberius or Louis XI" to "closest thing to a hero" eludes me. The leap that fruited in this very thread, "fans predicted the ending!", looks a little bit similar to me.

Well, we knew where that mistake was made--it was in the article headline. The writer seemed to think that "the right solution" meant the same thing as "predicted the ending." So with such a headline, others were bound to make the same mistake.

[J. Stargaryen]

Well, we knew where that mistake was made--it was in the article headline. The writer seemed to think that "the right solution" meant the same thing as "predicted the ending." So with such a headline, others were bound to make the same mistake.

I wonder if this answer wasn't in response to someone asking him if anyone has figured out the ending. I know there was a thread a little while back where someone linked to another author's story about GRRM freaking out because someone on a message board had figured out his ending. I'll look for it and edit in the link if/when I find it.

[Marcus Agrippa]

I feel bad because I made one of these and I didn't do my research. It sucks. Still I like the fact somebody has figured out a solution. It shows that vastly skilled readers put together theories in these books. I do believe they deserve congrats for their hardwork. However I will read these stories for the characters. The ending as long is it isn't generic will make me happy. Also no cliffhangers like Stannis disappearing or littlefinger going off to live in essos. Hopefully he inspires a better genre of fiction.

[J. Stargaryen]

Here is the thread I mentioned in my last post. - Link

Back in 99 I flew over to visit NYC and was put up by Anne and her friend Jamie Levine, both editors at different houses. George had turned in the first half of Clash - it was this giant manuscript on her desk at work. I got to read parts of it long before it came into print, but the best thing I got to see during the whole trip was the five page outline letter he'd written to say what was going to happen - and the fact that GoT only covered events in the first paragraph of it. She told me about the constant back and forth about the length and George insisting it was a trilogy when she was adamantly saying 'nope, it's seven books' - though at the time she feared it was more likely to run 10 given the depth of the outline (and remember one book was actually divided into two, so her it's seven books is already 8 in terms of what she'd originally suspected). I was also there for a moment of abject panic when he called in in an absolute mess because some fan on the Westeros board had nailed the entire plot right to the end in a post there, 100% right, and he was arguing that he was going to have to ditch his entire plan and come up with a new story resolution because he couldn't have the plot there on his own boards, and couldn't delete it because then fans would know it was right...

- Link Posted under an account named StevenSavile, which happens to be the name of a UK author. (Scroll down a bit.)

[Marcus Agrippa]

Here is the thread I mentioned in my last post. - Link

- Link Posted under an account named StevenSavile, which happens to be the name of a UK author. (Scroll down a bit.)

:bowdown:

[UnmaskedLurker]

Here is the thread I mentioned in my last post. - Link

- Link Posted under an account named StevenSavile, which happens to be the name of a UK author. (Scroll down a bit.)

Do we know if this report is really legit?

[JonSnow4President]

Yes, it makes an appearance every now and then. Google 'Stannis "closest thing to a hero"', you'll get multiple hits. People swear by it, George supposedly said those exact words, but no link is ever given. Nobody knows where this meme originated. Some suggest it's a creative interpretation of that Amazon interview, but how do you make a jump from "in spite of everything he is a righteous man, and not just a version of Henry VII, Tiberius or Louis XI" to "closest thing to a hero" eludes me. The leap that fruited in this very thread, "fans predicted the ending!", looks a little bit similar to me.

IIRC, didn't Martin say in a video interview (talking about favorite characters, if late night memory serves) that Jon is one of the hero characters?

[J. Stargaryen]

Do we know if this report is really legit?

No, but it does seem to fit with some of the stuff GRRM has said over the years, including just recently.

[JagLover]

how could you "guess" the ending before even the third book was published? you would need to write long thesis anyawy

this is probably about jon's parentage

In the first two books we have Old Nans stories, the house of the undying visions and a number of Bran's visions.

I would suggest (don't know for certain of course) that far more clues as to the end game are in those two books than in the next three.

[Mithras]

In the first two books we have Old Nans stories, the house of the undying visions and a number of Bran's visions.

I would suggest (don't know for certain of course) that far more clues as to the end game are in those two books than in the next three.

Agreed. I think the ending for Sansa-Arya-Sandor-Gregor-Jaime arcs lies in Bran's vision.

The HotU visions are also very important but GRRM made them extremely vague and I don't trust in any simple interpretation of them.

[Shinjuku Thief]

No, but it does seem to fit with some of the stuff GRRM has said over the years, including just recently.

I have a recollection of it from several years ago, though was unsuccessful in finding a link.

[Woofless]

Actually, I think the only reasonable interpretation of the critical words are that at that time--in the late 90s--a small number of people got it right. Again, the critical sentence is: "At least one or two readers had put together the extremely subtle and obscure clues that I'd planted in the books and came to the right solution." So he is talking about readers at that time, which basically would have been only after book 1 and maybe book 2. The question become the "right solution" to what? To the biggest "secret" i.e., R+L=J? I think most likely that is what is referencing. Jon being on the IT is a separate issue and not necessary to R+L=J. I think GRRM expected that some readers would figure that out solely form GoT--which is why he used it as a test for D&D. So when GRRM says "the right solution" he means the right solution to the issue for which he put in "subtle and obscure clues" which would be most likely R+L=J.

This is my thinking as well.

[Neumond]

Agreed. I think the ending for Sansa-Arya-Sandor-Gregor-Jaime arcs lies in Bran's vision.

You just destroyed my illusion of Arya being found frozen could mean something different than her death... Just kidding somehow it seems like a logical thing.

I have to read Bran`s visions again. I can`t remember the implications for these people.

[UnmaskedLurker]

No, but it does seem to fit with some of the stuff GRRM has said over the years, including just recently.

It goes way beyond what GRRM said recently. In fact, the difference between that quote and the quote in the article is the difference between the headline being 100% correct and the headline being entirely misleading. If by "the right solution" GRRM meant that someone had laid out "the entire plot right to the end" then the headline is correct that fans correctly predicted the ending. If by "the right solution" GRRM was only referring to something pivotal, like R+L=J, then that is not the same thing and the headline is misleading. So knowing whether the quote about readers on GRRM's own message board in 1999 predicting correctly "the entire plot right to the end," then that would add credence to the posts dealing with predictions about the ultimate conclusion, such as Jon brokering peace with the Others and agreeing to stay at the wall to keep the separation enforced. What we need are screen shots of that message board from 1999.

[A guy]

R+L does not = J: E ( Eddard )+A ( Ashara )=J. In ADWD, Barristan said:" And if I had been a better knight, would she have looked to me instead of Stark?" so we definitely know that one of the Starks had a relationship with Ashara. Lyanna could've made Ned promise her anything, and even if Jon is her son, that doesn't explain the part about Azor Ahai being reborn amidst Smoke and Salt. I mean, how?

GRRM writes another series: A Game of Thrones 2. It's 2000 AC and the Ghiscari Union of Socialist Republics invades Westeros. Everybody dies.

[Mithras]

R+L does not = J: E ( Eddard )+A ( Ashara )=J. In ADWD, Barristan said:" And if I had been a better knight, would she have looked to me instead of Stark?" so we definitely know that one of the Starks had a relationship with Ashara. Lyanna could've made Ned promise her anything, and even if Jon is her son, that doesn't explain the part about Azor Ahai being reborn amidst Smoke and Salt. I mean, how?

GRRM writes another series: A Game of Thrones 2. It's 2000 AC and the Ghiscari Union of Socialist Republics invades Westeros. Everybody dies.

Barristan might be completely wrong about Ashara. After all, he knows nothing about women.

[Xray the Enforcer]

[mod] Please keep the discussion on Jon Snow's parentage to the proper thread. Thank you. [/mod]