Lord_Tyrell Posted November 24, 2014 Share Posted November 24, 2014 Such a troll post. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Annara Snow Posted November 24, 2014 Share Posted November 24, 2014 If Alys Karstark suddenly starts to murder wildlings because of her forced marriage to sigorn, keeping in mind what happened prior to her marriage would that be justified? What are you talking about?! Alys escaped a forced marriage, that to her uncle. She was very willing to marry Sigorn, found it to be a neat idea that would secure her inheritance and protect her from similar attempts in the future, and was pretty happy about it, dancing and flirting with Sigorn and joking with Jon about it. That couldn't possibly be clearer in the book. She was more obviously into it and more relaxed about it than Sigorn was. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Annara Snow Posted November 24, 2014 Share Posted November 24, 2014 He could have married Sansa off to, for example, Daven, and let Tyrion marry a Frey. That he "took the power back" is natural, because he was hand all the time. The Starks already where destroyed, and he gave Tyrion credit for his chain and the alliance with Dorne. That Tyrion doesn't feel like getting enough credit doesn't mean he got none. He wouldn't marry Sansa off to Daven because Daven is not his son, which means that Winterfell does not get to belong to his grandchildren, i.e. it would not enhance his own power and glory. Tywin doesn't give a shit about Tyrion, he only cares about "family pride", i.e. his own. The "credit" he gave Tyrion was reluctant, mixed with anger and insults, and given only when Tyrion explicitly asked for it. Are you seriously arguing that Tywin wanted Tyrion to marry Sansa because he cared for Tyrion and wanted his happiness? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Doe Posted November 25, 2014 Share Posted November 25, 2014 Are you seriously arguing that Tywin wanted Tyrion to marry Sansa because he cared for Tyrion and wanted his happiness? No. But he did care for his children in his own way. He wasn't a good father, but people like Randyll Tarley are much worse. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Batbob45 Posted November 25, 2014 Share Posted November 25, 2014 Tywin was one of worst father of westeros, almost on par with Craster in term of abusive parenting. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thelittledragonthatcould Posted November 25, 2014 Share Posted November 25, 2014 And he did all that out of love for Tyrion and the goodness of his heart, right? The main responsibility of a father, especially in the world they live in, is to provide for their children. Tywin went above and beyond in this aspect. The idea that he is a bad father because he didn't show enough affection is ridiculous. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
H.P. Posted November 25, 2014 Share Posted November 25, 2014 The main responsibility of a father, especially in the world they live in, is to provide for their children. Tywin went above and beyond in this aspect. The idea that he is a bad father because he didn't show enough affection is ridiculous. What? A father who shows too little affection is definitely a bad father. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thelittledragonthatcould Posted November 25, 2014 Share Posted November 25, 2014 What? A father who shows too little affection is definitely a bad father. No. A father who provides nothing and shows no affection is a bad father. Being a father is a lot more than hugging a 27 year old child. http://www.ultimatehistoryproject.com/medieval-childhood-the-life-of-william-marshal.html Gives a good account of the parent child relations in the middle ages Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Doe Posted November 25, 2014 Share Posted November 25, 2014 No. A father who provides nothing and shows no affection is a bad father. Being a father or is a lot more than hugging a 27 year old child. :agree: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Selig Posted November 25, 2014 Share Posted November 25, 2014 The main responsibility of a father, especially in the world they live in, is to provide for their children. Tywin went above and beyond in this aspect. Above and beyond as in "spent less than 0.1% of his income on them"? Man, that must've been quite the sacrifice for him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Doe Posted November 25, 2014 Share Posted November 25, 2014 Above and beyond as in "spent less than 0.1% of his income on them"? Man, that must've been quite the sacrifice for him. For example marrying Sansa to Tyrion and Lysa to Jaime (had he not joined the KG). Making Tyrion warden of the North and Cersei queen. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thelittledragonthatcould Posted November 25, 2014 Share Posted November 25, 2014 Above and beyond as in "spent less than 0.1% of his income on them"? Man, that must've been quite the sacrifice for him. His made his daughter the Queen of Westeros and his two sons sat on the Small Council. He married Tyrion to a daughter of the Lord of the North and had arranged a marriage for Jaime to the daughter of the Lord of the Riverlands. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Selig Posted November 25, 2014 Share Posted November 25, 2014 For example marrying Sansa to Tyrion and Lysa to Jaime (had he not joined the KG). Making Tyrion warden of the North and Cersei queen. So your examples are 3 marriage, 2 of which made the ones involved in them miserable and the other one is the one Jaime gave up his inheritance to avoid it? Oh, and Tyrion the Warden of the North only on paper and everyone knew he'd never survive for long if he tries to enforce that claim. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Doe Posted November 25, 2014 Share Posted November 25, 2014 and the other one is the one Jaime gave up his inheritance to avoid it? He gave up his inheritance to be near Cersei, not to avoid being married to Lysa Tully. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Sapna Posted November 25, 2014 Share Posted November 25, 2014 Tywin was a terrible father if only for the Tysha incident. Otherwise, I think he cared about Tyrion in his own strange way. Not much, as he was an embarrassment to Tywin. However some of the arguments being put forward I think are more flaws of Tyrion's character. Despite whatever his father thinks of him, Tyrion's still an entitled brat. He never had to work a day in his life and never worried about money, as shown with the jailor at the Vale and his general lifestyle. "Wahh Daddy didn't let me take his money and go and travel round the free cities whoring and drinking." Well why should any parent pay for a kids gap year. Tywin still let Tyrion live off his money and arranged noble marriages for him. I mean he could have just married Tyrion off young to one of his bannermen just in the hope to get rid of him and that he would produce Lannister sons. Even though Tyrion was found guilty of regicide, I think Tyrion would have been sent to the wall still. I doubt anybody but Tywin's son's could get away with murdering Joffery. Conclusion: Terrible father, but Tyrion never needed anything because of his father. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Selig Posted November 25, 2014 Share Posted November 25, 2014 He gave up his inheritance to be near Cersei, not to avoid being married to Lysa Tully. Point is he didn't want any of it, so how is it an example of great parenting? besides, all of the marriage arrangement for Tywin's children were mostly for his benefit. He didn't want Cersei as a queen to make her happy, he wanted the extra power and influence this gave him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Doe Posted November 25, 2014 Share Posted November 25, 2014 Point is he didn't want any of it, so how is it an example of great parenting? The point is, he did take of his children. In a medieval setting, Jaime is a bad son because he refused to be Tywin's heir, not the other way around. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thelittledragonthatcould Posted November 25, 2014 Share Posted November 25, 2014 Point is he didn't want any of it, so how is it an example of great parenting? besides, all of the marriage arrangement for Tywin's children were mostly for his benefit. He didn't want Cersei as a queen to make her happy, he wanted the extra power and influence this gave him. What extra power and influence? He had far more of that in the 20 years before they were married then he received after. Making his daughter the most powerful woman in Westeros is not a mark against his fatherhood. It is reaching to suggest it is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ramsay Gimp Posted November 25, 2014 Share Posted November 25, 2014 Oh, and Tyrion the Warden of the North only on paper and everyone knew he'd never survive for long if he tries to enforce that claim. I agree that Roose would have probably found a way to remove Tyrion/Sansa, but I don't think this was Tywin's plan. Why wouldn't he want a Lannister running the North? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Doe Posted November 25, 2014 Share Posted November 25, 2014 I agree that Roose would have probably found a way to remove Tyrion/Sansa, but I don't think this was Tywin's plan. Why wouldn't he want a Lannister running the North? I think he would have revealed Bolton's participation in the RW and helped the other Northern lords getting rid of him. Afterwards, when they are all exhausted because of the fighting, Tywin could have made the half- Stark- boy warden of the North. He said as much afaik. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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