Why i think Stannis wrote the Pink Letter

[The Mother of The Others]

Why would Ramsay think that Jon had Reek?

Drunken rage, assuming the worst, seeing collusion where there was none

[Monctonvike]

I think most of the characters involved with the battle of WF are doomed. With one exception, Theon...it looks like he is about to die soon, which tells me he will likely live for awhile. When things start going well for people I expect them to die suddenly in this series.

....ps I know I know TV talk is a bit of a no no.....do you think the pink letter will be spoiled, revealed or even a factor on the TV screen?

[Clegane'sPup]

Ramsey is in a drunken rage after he defeats Stannis, can't find his Reek, thinks Jon has him and talk radio has spoilers. :cool4:

[bemused]

If Ramsey wrote the pink/bastard letter it means that Stannis has been defeated.

Done.

There will be no battle for WF. Boltons won.

End.

BUT if Ramsey won, why did Ramsey not find Reek in Stannis' camp and why does he assume that Jon has Reek? Why would Ramsey think that Jon had ReeK?

I am asking.

Some people just assume he's lying about Stannis, or that Stannis had the maester send a letter to WF claiming his death and Ramsay (and Roose?!?) believed it and wrote to Jon. I can't buy this , because I don't think they'd be waiting to hear how the battle went before setting out after "Arya" and "Reek". they are both needed to support the Boltons false claim. I think Theon is correct - Ramsay would have been out the gate ASAP. ( But after the Frey and Manderly men .. Roose would still want to use/loose the trouble makers first. Let them suffer the losses.)

But if Stannis' strategy worked, Ramsay could get to the battlefield (where it appears that Stannis has lost) only to find that Stannis sent "Arya" and "Reek" to Jon hours ,or a day before. In this case he'd just take off after them, thinking everything else was under control.

In the Theon chapter,

Stannis wanted "Arya's" party to leave very soon , but they hadn't left yet. And I think he

will take Theon to the tree, where something will happen to have Stannis decide to send Theon on as well.

Of course,I don't think Ramsay wrote it ,anyway.

[Kevoncox]

Who has the most to gain by Jon leaving the Wall with a force of Wildings?
Stannis? More men to fight but more mouths to feed.
Mance? At this point likely captured and is being held or flayed as we speak
The bastard? Wants his bride back but his Father is still running the show. Would a man as smart as Roose want to give Stannis additional help in their way against the king? Unlikely.

When you think about it it's Mance.
Mance knows Jon would never bring the innoncent in exchange/ Stannis would not ask for his daughter ro wife to be brought.
Mance knows Jon would try to save his sister from the terrible winter storm or recapture by the Boltons

Stannis would demand it frm Jon as he is the one true king. Havinf Jon abandon the wall makes no sense. He already has Jon's answer. Lastly, Stannis doesnt deal in straight lies. Maybe some trickery but he is not a liar.

When you look at it only Mance could have written it. The crow line is simply kicker. We have never heard anyone call them Crows but a wildling. What was Mance's plan to get out? Also look at the time that they Raven was sent. It's recieved before any battle has taken place. The best bet is Mance, who would have had to send it prior to him getting caught, maybe as the plan was going off.

[Clegane'sPup]

Some people just assume he's lying about Stannis, or that Stannis had the maester send a letter to WF claiming his death and Ramsay (and Roose?!?) believed it and wrote to Jon. I can't buy this , because I don't think they'd be waiting to hear how the battle went before setting out after "Arya" and "Reek". they are both needed to support the Boltons false claim. I think Theon is correct - Ramsay would have been out the gate ASAP. ( But after the Frey and Manderly men .. Roose would still want to use/loose the trouble makers first. Let them suffer the losses.)

But if Stannis' strategy worked, Ramsay could get to the battlefield (where it appears that Stannis has lost) only to find that Stannis sent "Arya" and "Reek" to Jon hours ,or a day before. In this case he'd just take off after them, thinking everything else was under control.

In the Theon chapter,

Stannis wanted "Arya's" party to leave very soon , but they hadn't left yet. And I think he

will take Theon to the tree, where something will happen to have Stannis decide to send Theon on as well.

Of course,I don't think Ramsay wrote it ,anyway.

Bemused I enjoy reading your posts. Thank you for your answer. :thumbsup: I am not asking you personally but the forum in general:

If Ramsey wrote the letter and I really don't wish to cut, copy and paste it, it would mean that Stannis lost the battle at the crofter's village & there will be no battle at WF because Stannis is dead. Therefore no big battle coming in WOW.

"You will escort the Braavosi banker back to the Wall. Choose six good men and take twelve horses."

The king was not amused. "I want you gone before midday.

"The black brothers will accompany you as far as Castle Black," the king went on.

Lady Arya should have a female companion as well. Take Alysane Mormont."

Theon was still chained to the wall. Since the POV's are out of order in ASOIAF anything is possible.

Why would Ramsey, if he wrote the letter, think that Jon had Reek? If Ramsey won the battle why did he not find his Reek there at the crofter's village?

[The Drunkard]

If Ramsey wrote the letter and I really don't wish to cut, copy and paste it, it would mean that Stannis lost the battle at the crofter's village & there will be no battle at WF because Stannis is dead. Therefore no big battle coming in WOW.

Not necessarily.

Maester Rhodry stood beside him, a raven on his arm. The bird's black plumage shone like coal oil in the torchlight. Wet, Theon realized. And in his lordship' s hand, a parchment. That will be wet as well. Dark wings, dark words. "Rather than use our swords upon each other, you might try them on Lord Stannis." Lord Bolton unrolled the parchment. "His host lies not three days' ride from here, snowbound and starving..."

Roose received a raven from somewhere, bringing with it a document that details Stannis' position. Roose uses this received information to organize an attack on Stannis; he trusts it.

"Godry, how many cages did you find?"

"Three, Your Grace," said the big knight in the silvered breastplate. "One was empty."

-

"I will ask you once again. What was in the message you sent to Winterfell?"

The maester quivered. "A m-map, Your Grace."

In the sample chapter we find out where the raven came from: the maester working for Arnolf within Stannis' camp.

Now that Stannis has another two ravens in his possession, knows that Roose expects information to come via them, and has gained all this without alerting Roose, he is capable of having the terrified maester write false reports with which he can feed Winterfell misinformation. Such as a seven day battle, his defeat, the capture of his sword, etc.

[chrisdaw]

....ps I know I know TV talk is a bit of a no no.....do you think the pink letter will be spoiled, revealed or even a factor on the TV screen?

Yes, because it's not supposed to be a question or a cliff hanger in the first place. It's been manufactured into one by a weird fanbase peculiarity.

The pink letter is a great bit of writing, Ramsay's villainous nature just oozes off page in a profoundly hateable way, anyone else having written it lessens Ramsay as the villain of the piece. And very importantly it directly pits the hero Jon against Ramsay.

[Muggle]

Im a huge believer that Stannis wrote the pink letter and here's why....

well say the Theon Sample chapter is before the end of Dance

Stannis would have all the info about Mance and the spearwives from Theon, he has FArya,

He has his "magic sword", He knows about Val (wildling princess)

He has the wax from the Dreadfort Maesters and the Maester himself

Stannis has shown before he can adapt as a king the battle at the wall is a good example of it

instead of continuing the fight from Dragonstone he basically abandoned it and went for the wall to defend the realm plus all the men of different religion in his army so writing the letter wouldn't be out of his comfort zone.

He wanted Jon to come south to be Lord of Winterfell so getting Jon angry and getting him to ride south to fight Ramsay and breaking his vows so the Watch wouldnt take him any more leaves him open to be forgiven by Stannis and take the name Stark because there's no other place for Jon to be the watch won't take him anymore. He knows about the up coming battle against the Freys and Manderlys because of Theon so saying there wasn't a battle isnt a lie.

The letter should of done the opposite. The letter says Arya is missing, if she is missing why would Jon ride to Winterfel to recuse her. When the letter clearly says she is not in Winterfel. It seems most likley that Jon went south to found a brother hood with out banners type of group. He is smart enough to know he cant assault Winterfel directly. He knows Wildlings would be crushed in conventional war fair. He is looking to do guerrilla hit and run crap.

The letter intent is most likley to create a divide in the watch. Its the watches biggest fear and this letter make that fear true. Having the IT come down on the watch.

[foreign675]

All in all, IMHO, only two explanations are possible:

1) Sent by Mance (most likely)

2) Some watch conspirators forged it after receiving another original letter from Stannis/Ramsay

To me it makes little sense for the letter to directly come from Stannis or Ramsay.

[AerionBrightflameII]

I can't see Stannis writing the letter and sending it to Jon. It just seems so out of character. The most likely candidate is Ramsey though i pray it is just some ruse of his.

[Muggle]

I do think Stannis is going to send a letter to Winterfel pretending to be the Freys or some other Pro Bolton force claiming a victory over Stannis. And that Stannis is dead.

So word on the street would be Stannis is in fact dead. But this is a ploy so Stannis can march on Winterfel under Frey banners and get the gate open for free. Or so thats the plan.

[Clegane'sPup]

Muggle, in my opinion, as to avatars, you are running neck and neck with Florina Laufeyson as my favorite.

Seriously though, general forum, if Ramsey defeated Stannis and sent the letter to Jon, why would Ramsey think that Jon had "his Reek?

The pink/bastard letter is an obsession <jokingly so> of mine. To me it seems that no matter how I spin it there is still that question about Reek.

[TheOne-EyedHound]

I think Stannis is just too dutiful to have wrote it. I fail to see any benefit for Stannis in doing this, to put his heir,wife and Mel in danger just would baffle me to no end. Stannis writing TPL just seems out of place to me as well, he just sent the Braavosi banker down that path, plus fArya to Jon Snow.

[TheOne-EyedHound]

Who has the most to gain by Jon leaving the Wall with a force of Wildings?

Stannis? More men to fight but more mouths to feed.

Mance? At this point likely captured and is being held or flayed as we speak

The bastard? Wants his bride back but his Father is still running the show. Would a man as smart as Roose want to give Stannis additional help in their way against the king? Unlikely.

When you think about it it's Mance.

Mance knows Jon would never bring the innoncent in exchange/ Stannis would not ask for his daughter ro wife to be brought.

Mance knows Jon would try to save his sister from the terrible winter storm or recapture by the Boltons

Stannis would demand it frm Jon as he is the one true king. Havinf Jon abandon the wall makes no sense. He already has Jon's answer. Lastly, Stannis doesnt deal in straight lies. Maybe some trickery but he is not a liar.

When you look at it only Mance could have written it. The crow line is simply kicker. We have never heard anyone call them Crows but a wildling. What was Mance's plan to get out? Also look at the time that they Raven was sent. It's recieved before any battle has taken place. The best bet is Mance, who would have had to send it prior to him getting caught, maybe as the plan was going off.

I believe it is Mance, or someone within castle black. Hell Patchface seems more likely than Stannis to me.

[bemused]

When you look at it only Mance could have written it. The crow line is simply kicker. We have never heard anyone call them Crows but a wildling. What was Mance's plan to get out? Also look at the time that they Raven was sent. It's recieved before any battle has taken place. The best bet is Mance, who would have had to send it prior to him getting caught, maybe as the plan was going off.

The following are quotes from ACoK, alone ..and only those examples not spoken by wildlings.. I know here are more , but can't take time to search all 5 books tonight.. (I've done it before)

They’d come in last night with Conwy, one of the wandering crows who roamed the Seven Kingdoms collecting men for the Wall. .. Jon observing Satin's group of recruits

Robb will rule, you will serve. Men will call you a crow. .. Mormont to Jon ..Men, not just wildlings.

And these next two take place very far from the wall..

“It’s sweetcorn, better’n a stinking old black bird like you deserves,” one of them answered roughly. “You get out of our field now, and take these sneaks and stabbers with you, or we’ll stake you up in the corn to scare the other crows away.” ... fieldhand to Yoren

Yoren was chewing sourleaf. “Told you, no one here but us. You got my word on that.”

The knight in the spiked helm laughed. “The crow gives us his word.”

[Lord Lannister]

Yeah, I just can't buy Stannis as the author. It's just too outside the box for him and it's not like he has someone like Littlefinger in his court whispering such suggestions in his ear. I don't even think he'd tolerate someone like that being around anyways. It's possible someone could've done it on his behalf, I suppose.

[haemonculus]

Can't see Stannis calling himself "false king" under any circumstances whatsoever.

[The Drunkard]

Can't see Stannis calling himself "false king" under any circumstances whatsoever.

Artist's rendition.

[Señor de la Tormenta]

Stannis wouldnt ever gamble with his only heir. How the hell would he know Jon Snow is still in charge, and not ranging or visiting an other fort, and the black crow in charge just handles the girl to Ramsey?

Read Theon AWOW chapter and see the value Shireen has for him.