Stannis' Reaction to (F?)Aegon and Dany?

[Nyrhex]

If the "Baratheons" lost the throne such as fAegon taking the throne from Tommen would you consider Dany having a better claim than Stannis then? Or other way aroundI think that fAegon has a good change of taking the throne considering that GRRM has said multiple people will take the throne and all the trouble in King´s Landing. I have never seen this point argued which seem strange since I though many think fAegon will get the throne in Winds of Winter and many think Dany is younger more beautiful Queen

Physically, or like continent wide acceptance of fAegon as having toppled the Baratheons? I can see Martin having fAegon and others take the physical throne, but that alone does not make a king, it makes for a temporary gain in a war. Just holding the city and the physical IT means jack. Any schmuck can take the city, it does'nt mean he is king. Trystane Truefyre held the city for a few months, it does not make him king. Joffrey sitting on the IT means jack, he is illegitimate and using authority not legally his. With Robert there was no confusion over what happened - he took the IT by right of conquest, and the lords gave him homage after the Targs were ousted. If fAegon takes the IT, and wins the support of the continent, that is different. Though currently Stannis is on the cusp of gaining nearly half the continent with the North, so it is unlikely that fAegon will win universal support. Remember that Right of Conquest only works in retrospect, after the victory. If Aegon wins all but the North, the war is still not over, same as Robert was not king after his Gulltown or after Stoney Sept. For fAegon, landing in the Stormlands and starting a war was the single most important day of his life.

For Stannis, it was a tuesday.

[Nictarion]

I personally can't wait for Stannis (and Mel) to find out that Dany has dragons. I expect a lot of teeth grinding/sulking. :D

[A spoon of knife and fork]

I trhink it's ridiculous that supposed Stannis "fans" think he wouldn't give a crap about the Targaryen claims. Do they not read his chapters and or respect his words on the matter? Its' like they are so desperate for him to "win" that they transform a character they supposedly like into some kind of robot with no resemblance to the real man.

"It is," he said, calmer. "And I would have it speak the truth. Though the truth is a bitter draught at times. Aerys? If you only knew . . . that was a hard choosing. My blood or my liege. My brother or my king." He grimaced. "Have you ever seen the Iron Throne? The barbs along the back, the ribbons of twisted steel, the jagged ends of swords and knives all tangled up and melted? It is not a comfortable seat, ser. Aerys cut himself so often men took to calling him King Scab, and Maegor the Cruel was murdered in that chair. By that chair, to hear some tell it. It is not a seat where a man can rest at ease. Ofttimes I wonder why my brothers wanted it so desperately."

... - Stannis Baratheon

AKA even to this Day Stannis is troubled by the decision he made. This is a person who is very often quite thoughtful about what he does and WHY. He is not going to reject out of hand the right of a (trueborn) child or sibling of Rhaegar to inherit. To say otherwise is to completely ignore Stannis' character due to wishful thinking. Now, I'm not saying he's going to roll over and die, but he's not going to dismiss them as usurpers either. Since, of course, they are not. The various weird ways people claim that no one with Aerys blood can possibly have a claim are completely ridiculous and have no basis in the law. Stannis would say the same. The very reason it hasn't come up is because GRRM wants Stannis to keep fighting - he believes he is the only rightful heir who is pursuing the throne. As far as he knows, Viserys and Daenerys are both dead, and word of Faegon hasn't reached him.

Any TRUE FAN of the Mannis would understand these things... :fencing:

P.S. I think he might very well dismiss Faegon, but only because he quite correctly wont' believe he is who he says he is, not because the Targaryens/Aerys' line lost all claim or w/e.

[Nyrhex]

I personally can't wait for Stannis (and Mel) to find out that Dany has dragons. I expect a lot of teeth grinding/sulking. :D

Three feral dragons, barely 2-3 years old? Not much to worry about. Especially considering that they are already facing countless Others, giant ice spiders, and a horde of the undead by that time...

Any TRUE FAN of the Mannis would understand these things... :fencing:

Any TRUE fan would realise that Stannis had already made his choice. It's why that bit is in the past tense. It's why, even though Stannis, as a member of the Small Council, was present for countless reports of Dany's location and doings, he did not give a shit while Robert lived that they exist, and why he pressed his own claim when realising that Robert has no trueborn heirs.

Honestly, some people manage to miss the forest because of all the trees...

[OldGimletEye]

I trhink it's ridiculous that supposed Stannis "fans" think he wouldn't give a crap about the Targaryen claims. Do they not read his chapters and or respect his words on the matter? Its' like they are so desperate for him to "win" that they transform a character they supposedly like into some kind of robot with no resemblance to the real man.

AKA even to this Day Stannis is troubled by the decision he made. This is a person who is very often quite thoughtful about what he does and WHY. He is not going to reject out of hand the right of a (trueborn) child or sibling of Rhaegar to inherit. To say otherwise is to completely ignore Stannis' character due to wishful thinking. Now, I'm not saying he's going to roll over and die, but he's not going to dismiss them as usurpers either. Since, of course, they are not. The various weird ways people claim that no one with Aerys blood can possibly have a claim are completely ridiculous and have no basis in the law. Stannis would say the same. The very reason it hasn't come up is because GRRM wants Stannis to keep fighting - he believes he is the only rightful heir who is pursuing the throne. As far as he knows, Viserys and Daenerys are both dead, and word of Faegon hasn't reached him.

So House Stark, House Arryn, House Tully and their bannermen should see Dany as their rightful queen because of why exactly?

[bb1180]

AKA even to this Day Stannis is troubled by the decision he made. This is a person who is very often quite thoughtful about what he does and WHY. He is not going to reject out of hand the right of a (trueborn) child or sibling of Rhaegar to inherit. To say otherwise is to completely ignore Stannis' character due to wishful thinking. Now, I'm not saying he's going to roll over and die, but he's not going to dismiss them as usurpers either. Since, of course, they are not. The various weird ways people claim that no one with Aerys blood can possibly have a claim are completely ridiculous and have no basis in the law. Stannis would say the same. The very reason it hasn't come up is because GRRM wants Stannis to keep fighting - he believes he is the only rightful heir who is pursuing the throne. As far as he knows, Viserys and Daenerys are both dead, and word of Faegon hasn't reached him.

Any TRUE FAN of the Mannis would understand these things... :fencing:

I think you still run into the same problems. In the end, whatever reservations he had, Stannis did, in fact, side with his brother. Along with that, its all but a certainty that he accepted Robert's legitimacy as King. Once you arrive at that point, there's no turning back. Stannis would almost assuredly believe that Robert's heir would inherit upon his death.

And as to whether Stannis knew Viserys and Daenerys were alive (which he probably did; it doesn't seem to have been any secret among Robert's council), it really doesn't matter in light of the above. He might recognize that they had a claim, which they did, but not the strongest claim, which again, would belong to Robert's heir.

[Nictarion]

Three feral dragons, barely 2-3 years old? Not much to worry about. Especially considering that they are already facing countless Others, giant ice spiders, and a horde of the undead by that time..

I was thinking more along the lines of jealousy. Stannis remarks that a dragon would have turned the tide at the BW, and Mel is pretty much obsessed with waking dragons from stone.

Eta: And Drogon isn't feral. He is now bonded to Dany.

[NotSoSilentSister]

Won't acknowledge their claims, will plan to fight them, won't get to it, because of the Others.

[The Onion Kniggit]

I was thinking more along the lines of jealousy. Stannis remarks that a dragon would have turned the tide at the BW, and Mel is pretty much obsessed with waking dragons from stone.

Eta: And Drogon isn't feral. He is now bonded to Dany.

With his constant references to Aegon I, he was probably thinking of big black Balerion, not the small dragons she has.

He would also probably laugh at her inability to keep the Mereeneese in line despite having said dragons.

[Nictarion]

With his constant references to Aegon I, he was probably thinking of big black Balerion, not the small dragons she has.

He would also probably laugh at her inability to keep the Mereeneese in line despite having said dragons.

Ffs, Stannis would rather have no dragons, instead of "small" dragons? :rolleyes:

StanStans Crack me up.

[A spoon of knife and fork]

So House Stark, House Arryn, House Tully and their bannermen should see Dany as their rightful queen because of why exactly?

Where did I make any such claim? :)

[Señor de la Tormenta]

He always knew daenerys was alive, and gave a f about it.

Now, what he does not know conviently por the plot, is that she has dragons.

[A spoon of knife and fork]

Three feral dragons, barely 2-3 years old? Not much to worry about. Especially considering that they are already facing countless Others, giant ice spiders, and a horde of the undead by that time...

Any TRUE fan would realise that Stannis had already made his choice. It's why that bit is in the past tense. It's why, even though Stannis, as a member of the Small Council, was present for countless reports of Dany's location and doings, he did not give a shit while Robert lived that they exist, and why he pressed his own claim when realising that Robert has no trueborn heirs.

Honestly, some people manage to miss the forest because of all the trees...

The question is what will his reaction be? Everyone calling themselves a Stannid fan has the idea he would say they have no claim at all, not that he only has a better one. Sure he will think he has a better claim and will defend it, but unlike what some here seem to think, he is not an idiot - he will know that they have claims Also, and that is something he will have to deal with - either through force of arms, negotiation, or alliance.

Making the choice to support robert in no way means he cannot recognize that others may have legitimate claims (right now as far as he knows, there is no one else pushing a legitimate claims).

[Señor de la Tormenta]

Ffs, Stannis would rather have no dragons, instead of "small" dragons? :rolleyes:

StanStans Crack me up.

funny enough, stannis is one of the few people who can ride one of those dragons.

Daenerys having dragons might be a huge game changer, in a few years, but you got to agree she can ride one at best.

The other two dragons are more of a danger to her, than an asset. Cause most of the few guys who can ride them are her sworn enemies, or at least have their own agenda.

[OldGimletEye]

Where did I make any such claim? :)

Here:

The various weird ways people claim that no one with Aerys blood can possibly have a claim are completely ridiculous and have no basis in the law.

See, the fact of the matter is that Aerys violated several norms of conduct as they are understood in Westeros. All these houses, to varying extents, have a legitimate gripe against the Targs, and arguably, don't owe House Targaryen anything. What does Dany's "claim" mean exactly?

[OldGimletEye]

funny enough, stannis is one of the few people who can ride one of those dragons.

Daenerys having dragons might be a huge game changer, in a few years, but you got to agree she can ride one at best.

The other two dragons are more of a danger to her, than an asset. Cause most of the few guys who can ride them are her sworn enemies, or at least have their own agenda.

Maybe Dany will tell Stannis she is going to "save" him. Stannis would be like,"Please anything but that. Please don't try to save me. I'll do anything. I surrender! I surrender!"

[Nyrhex]

I was thinking more along the lines of jealousy. Stannis remarks that a dragon would have turned the tide at the BW, and Mel is pretty much obsessed with waking dragons from stone.

Eta: And Drogon isn't feral. He is now bonded to Dany.

A dragon is nice and all, if it is big and trained and you know what you are doing. Dany's dragons are not that large compared with the real damage dealers of Aegon I, two are feral and the third is only allowing the very basics to Dany, she has a long way to go before she can control it in anything resembling the basic tactics. Not to mention that she lacks the gear to make sure she does not fall off, freeze to death, get shot, etc.

The question is what will his reaction be? Everyone calling themselves a Stannid fan has the idea he would say they have no claim at all, not that he only has a better one. Sure he will think he has a better claim and will defend it, but unlike what some here seem to think, he is not an idiot - he will know that they have claims Also, and that is something he will have to deal with - either through force of arms, negotiation, or alliance.

Making the choice to support robert in no way means he cannot recognize that others may have legitimate claims (right now as far as he knows, there is no one else pushing a legitimate claims).

Having a claim means jack. Stannis calls it when talking to Davos after the parley with Penrose. People fight for Joffrey because they beleive his claim is legit. Some may even say that the rebel Robb Stark has a case for king in the North. Robb's claim is the same, if not stronger than Dany's - The Starks were kings in the North for 8,000 years before they lost the North 300 years ago in a war of conquest. The Targs lost Westeros and the IT 15 years ago, and are not even a part of Westeros anymore. By the same logic that Robb was a rebel - Dany and fAegon would be no better. The claim that thier house used to control the IT is recognised in the same way that the Starks used to be kings, that the Lannisters used to be kings. Now, they are not, and the "claim" is not superior to Robert's or his heirs' in any way.

[Batbob45]

Stannis might pull a Ned and marry his kid off to Aegon if Aegon is really a Targ, he just tell Dany that he had a hand in her escaping.

[SayGen]

As far as Stannis is concerned, all the Targarian claims are second to his. They lost the throne when the mad king tried to kill everyone.

Line of succession was remade after his Brother took it.

[Nictarion]

funny enough, stannis is one of the few people who can ride one of those dragons.

Daenerys having dragons might be a huge game changer, in a few years, but you got to agree she can ride one at best.

The other two dragons are more of a danger to her, than an asset. Cause most of the few guys who can ride them are her sworn enemies, or at least have their own agenda.

If Stannis rides a dragon I'll eat my hat. :P