SPOILERS - Tyrion reveals himself...shocker or not...you be the judge

[Ted Chang]

Yeah, they really cut that short. She gave a nice menacing glare, but come on, I'm just imagining what my own reaction would be. "Oh really, Lannister? The people who killed my father, my niece, and my nephew, ruined my house, and forced me into exile? Ser Jorah, bring me his head."

And with an attitude like that you'd have been dead in Dothraki country three seasons ago. She only survived because of her ability to show clemency. Sure, I expect her to think about topping Tyrion, but domestic problems and the need for sound advice will shortly collide.

[JagLover]

It could not have been more rushed if it were dying in the back of a speeding ambulance... are you fuckin serious?

Didn't feel rushed to me.

Once you remove all the book elements that either slow down the story or have been deemed not necessary on the show (battle of fire) that was ample time for Tyrion to get to Dany.

Might I suggest that if ADWD had moved at the same pace as the first three books it would have happened in that book as well.

[Qhorin Halfhand and Yoren]

While the Tyrion parts of this episode felt kind of lame, I am really looking forward to seeing Tyrion in Daenerys camp. Such things happening faster in the show than the books, even if I expect the books to do them better, is part of the reason I am watching the show.

I expect Tyrion to be in trouble but use his mouth and give her some advice that makes her think that this sounds reasonable, maybe there is value in keeping him around.

[Ted Chang]

While the Tyrion parts of this episode felt kind of lame, I am really looking forward to seeing Tyrion in Daenerys camp. Such things happening faster in the show than the books, even if I expect the books to do them better, is part of the reason I am watching the show.

I expect Tyrion to be in trouble but use his mouth and give her some advice that makes her think that this sounds reasonable, maybe there is value in keeping him around.

:agree:

For me this is the most important character meeting in the whole of the story to date. Up to now Dany has been a rudderless ship in many senses. To date her advisers have been second rate or over the hill. Without her dragons she would have been dead some time ago. I just hope that they craft Tyrion's 'resurrection' capably and believably.

[Attitude]

For me this is the most important character meeting in the whole of the story to date. Up to now Dany has been a rudderless ship in many senses. To date her advisers have been second rate or over the hill. Without her dragons she would have been dead some time ago. I just hope that they craft Tyrion's 'resurrection' capably and believably.

Barristan wasn't second rate and what does over the hill has to do with it? Being over the hill actually states that you have quite some life experience. Being ex-commander of the kingsguard and being over the hill makes you a fine advisor IMO. Barristan was just to big of a pussy to tell Dany to leave Mereen and go to Westeros.

[grufolo]

she stayed in illyrio's house only for months ...not raised there

she knows about the great houses and some stuffs about westeros her brother thought her

Ok so i may be totally wrong (i do not remember exactly ) but then where was she raised?

And why on earth should she have not been given the knowledge about Westeros that she would need as a highborn lady?

[Attitude]

Ok so i may be totally wrong (i do not remember exactly ) but then where was she raised?

And why on earth should she have not been given the knowledge about Westeros that she would need as a highborn lady?

House with the red door.

She got it from Viserys, but that was information with Viserys' POV. Since he was crazy, not everything was true.

At least, as far as I know this is true ^

[Tywin Smokin a Blunt]

Hey anything is better than being sold to a cock merchant right? I don't think it's that shocking, Tyrion clearly would have done the same in Daznak's pit in the books if there had been an opportunity to do so. The setup though was a bit ham fisted, she just happens to go to the pit that they happen to be fighting at, that was like something straight out of the tv cliche handbook right there.

[Drogonthedread]

Ok so i may be totally wrong (i do not remember exactly ) but then where was she raised?

And why on earth should she have not been given the knowledge about Westeros that she would need as a highborn lady?

i think rather than explaining i will just quote the books here ...you may able to see yourself

Somewhere beyond the sunset, across the narrow sea, lay a land of green hills and flowered plains and great rushing rivers, where towers of dark stone rose amidst magnificent blue-grey mountains, and armored knights rode to battle beneath the banners of their lords. The Dothraki called that land Rhaesh Andahli, the land of the Andals. In the Free Cities, they talked of Westeros and the Sunset Kingdoms. Her brother had a simpler name. “Our land,” he called it. The words were like a prayer with him. If he said them enough, the gods were sure to hear. “Ours by blood right, taken from us by treachery, but ours still, ours forever. You do not steal from the dragon, oh, no. The dragon remembers.” And perhaps the dragon did remember, but Dany could not. She had never seen this land her brother said was theirs, this realm beyond the narrow sea. These places he talked of, Casterly Rock and the Eyrie, Highgarden and the Vale of Arryn, Dorne and the Isle of Faces, they were just words to her. Viserys had been a boy of eight when they fled King’s Landing to escape the advancing armies of the escape the advancing armies of the Usurper, but Daenerys had been only a quickening in their mother’s womb. Yet sometimes Dany would picture the way it had been, so often had her brother told her the stories. The midnight flight to Dragonstone, moonlight shimmering on the ship’s black sails. Her brother Rhaegar battling the Usurper in the bloody waters of the Trident and dying for the woman he loved. The sack of King’s Landing by the ones Viserys called the Usurper’s dogs, the lords Lannister and Stark. Princess Elia of Dorne pleading for mercy as Rhaegar’s heir was ripped from her breast and murdered before her eyes. The polished skulls of the last dragons staring down sightlessly from the walls of the throne room while the Kingslayer opened Father’s throat with a golden sword. She had been born on Dragonstone nine moons after their flight, while a raging summer storm threatened to rip the island fastness apart. They said that storm was terrible. The Targaryen fleet was smashed while it lay at anchor, and huge stone blocks were ripped from the parapets and sent hurtling into the wild waters of the narrow sea. Her mother had died birthing her, and for that her brother Viserys had never forgiven her. She did not remember Dragonstone either. They had run again, just before the Usurper’s brother set sail with his new-built fleet. By then only Dragonstone itself, the ancient seat of their House, had remained of the Seven Kingdoms that had once been theirs. It would not remain for long. The garrison had been prepared to sell them to the Usurper, but one night Ser Willem Darry and four loyal men had broken into the nursery and stolen them both, along with her wet nurse, and set sail under cover of darkness for the safety of the Braavosian coast. She remembered Ser Willem dimly, a great grey bear of a man, half-blind, roaring and bellowing orders from his sickbed. The servants had lived in terror of him, but he had always been kind to Dany. He called her “Little Princess” and sometimes “My Lady,” and his hands were soft as old leather. He never left his bed, though, and the smell of sickness clung to him day and night, a hot, moist, sickly sweet odor. That was when they lived in Braavos, in the big house with the red door. Dany had her own room there, with a lemon tree outside her window. After Ser Willem had died, the servants had stolen what little money they had left, and soon after they had been put out of the big house. Dany had cried when the red door closed behind them forever. They had wandered since then, from Braavos to Myr, from Myr to Tyrosh, and on to Qohor and Volantis and Lys, never staying long in any one place. Her brother would not allow it. The Usurper’s hired knives were close behind them, he insisted, though Dany had never seen one. At first the magisters and archons and merchant princes were pleased to welcome the last Targaryens to their homes and tables, but as the years passed and the Usurper continued to sit upon the Iron Throne, doors closed and their lives grew meaner. Years past they had been forced to sell their last few treasures, and now even the coin they had gotten from Mother’s crown had gone. In the alleys and wine sinks of Pentos, they called her brother “the beggar king.” Dany did not want to know what they called her. “We will have it all back someday, sweet sister,” he would promise her. Sometimes his hands shook when he talked about it. “The jewels and the silks, Dragonstone and King’s Landing, the Iron Throne and the Seven Kingdoms, all they have taken from us, we will have it back.” Viserys lived for that day. All that Daenerys wanted back was the big house with the red door, the lemon tree outside her window, the childhood she had never known.

see they were always on the run ...but she knows many languages if Essos and knows amny cultures

see in the Quote she speaks about the great houses of westeros ...her brother had thought her everything he knew....she even knows the about WALL ...

she asks Quentyn to tell more about the Daenerys who went to dorne ...so she knows her family ..

the only thing about viserys teaching is he has said that his fathers madness was a lie used by the pretenders to usurp him...now after barristan told about it that has gone away too ...

she is not an idiot like most here claims ...look in the chapter when viserys was pleased my Illyrio's words dany have suspicion ...she is the one making all the decision in the battles and in ruling ...she listens to her advisors

tyrion can be helpful with the history of westeros and his current state affairs ..but the final decisions will be made by dany because she knows what to do ..

and this is why i am waiting to see where the show goes with this whole thing because in the books its more about Tyrion proving himself to dany ...but the show has made that dany must prove herself to tyrion...

so i do hope we get to see tyrion finding that she is worth fighting for ..in other words they are going for an ARstan whitebeard way with tyrion

[Et tu Olly?]

Hey anything is better than being sold to a cock merchant right? I don't think it's that shocking, Tyrion clearly would have done the same in Daznak's pit in the books if there had been an opportunity to do so. The setup though was a bit ham fisted, she just happens to go to the pit that they happen to be fighting at, that was like something straight out of the tv cliche handbook right there.

It maybe would have been forgivable if it had only happened this one time but we had Jaime and TeamRocket getting to Myrcella at exactly the same time in E06. Do they assume that viewers don't notice these things?

[PatrickStormborn]

So, Tyrion's meeting with Dany spoils Winds of Winter for us ?

If Tyrion and Dany meet in TWoW, it will be under wildly different circumstances. At the very least, Dany will have flown Drogon and conquered the Dothraki, whilst Tyrion will have played some kind of role in the Battle of Fire. At most, they might not even meet until much later in the book when they're both in Westeros.

[marsyao]

I am so curious to see how Tyrion counsels Dany and how he is going to show his brilliance in politics and governance. The show has really made Tyrion the big hero, next to Jon he is the next character who could do no wrong and has immense wisdom. The audience is torn apart thinking Dany is just a useless ruler, it is almost as if we are waiting for Tyrion's approval, like if in the show Tyrion approves of Dany and stays loyal to her and then she really is worth of all this trouble, I mean I just can't see him supporting Dany if he suspects that she is just as mad as her father.

Don't bet your money on it, now we can pretty much sure that D&D are incapable of developing their own plot, so I would not expect they can dealt with the relationship between Danny and Tyrion

[JonSnowed]

If Tyrion doesn't immediately set her straight on her father being the Mad King and no one in westeros wanting a return of the Targ dynasty which will probably end with her since she can't have children

I'm pretty much officially over Dany's story line

I feel the same, I actually look forward to her invetible death with some anticipation although I am liking the idea of her turning out to be the centre villain of the entire story.

[JonSnowed]

If Tyrion and Dany meet in TWoW, it will be under wildly different circumstances. At the very least, Dany will have flown Drogon and conquered the Dothraki, whilst Tyrion will have played some kind of role in the Battle of Fire. At most, they might not even meet until much later in the book when they're both in Westeros.

GRRM has confirmed that they will meet in Winds, I'm 99.9% sure this is the show writers bringing the plot forward given there is no full on battle of Meeren. LIke you in the books I suspect they meet in Meereen but I can't see them remaining allies, particularly as Tyrion and Jon are on good terms and a Dany v Jon stand off may be a potential end game.

[Attitude]

GRRM has confirmed that they will meet in Winds, I'm 99.9% sure this is the show writers bringing the plot forward given there is no full on battle of Meeren. LIke you in the books I suspect they meet in Meereen but I can't see them remaining allies, particularly as Tyrion and Jon are on good terms and a Dany v Jon stand off may be a potential end game.

No, GRRM has confirmed that they will 'interact' in a way (which could be a flyby from dany on drogo, or a talk through glass candless, or w/e). It doesn't mean they will meet (face to face). If you have other info that tells me different, please fill me in, because I would like to know.

[rocksniffer]

It could not have been more rushed if it were dying in the back of a speeding ambulance... are you fuckin serious?

i was happy, joyful in fact, that the show did in really 2 episodes what books in almost 2000 pages didn't - tyrion and dany coming together and perhaps...i hope...joining forces or at least tyrion getting a dragon...and i am fuckin serious about that

I can't really say that it was a shocker, but I would have expected it to be a few episodes away. The momentum of the show is bizarre, first four seasons moves at a good pace deviating only slightly from the books. Season 5 comes along and compresses SO much material into just a few episodes with so much screentime left over for weird fan fiction and ridiculous sub-plots.

as i said above 2000 pages is a lot to slog through. and frankly so much of those books (feast and dance) is repetitive and wandering...literally wandering either at sea or on the river pole boat or at slavers bay, but also in King's landing the cersei and company fuck fest with kettleblacks and assorted others was overkill, same for the sansa crap in the vale...many times while reading and rereading, (again and again) i wanted to shout just get to the point already...i get it cersei is a matress cover and crazy to boot, margery is a lying pretender who is not only playing slap and tickle with her cousins but every dude she meets, sansa is trying to grow up and failing, And??

...i, for one, am grateful for the "reader's digest condensed version" as for the subplots, fanfic filler...well when published material runs out what are you left with...and honestly i am not as disappointed as many of my fellow book enthusiasts

I'm glad it happened. GRRM has this thing where he builds up tension to a conflict, character goal or dramatic moment but he never brings it to a climax. We've been wanting Dany to get involved with Westeros in a big way for a long time. Bringing Ser Barristan over was nice. A Martell? Well, ok, we'll take him (for now). But it's Tyrion we want to meet Dany, not Victarion or Marwyn.

And it happened. Yay. Everybody dance. Finally

Then... credits. :stillsick:

I'm guessing she holds a council with Tyrion present, he gleefully tells her about the state of Westeros, and that's when we get her speech about breaking the wheel of time. But I swear if the next episode has Tyrion and Jorah locked away somewhere because "reasons" and Dany off doing other stuff for reasons, I'm going to bust a blood vessel.

yeah i wanted more since i have been waiting for this for years...

and hey just a suggestion but better have an EMT on duty to stop the bleeding cause i don't expect to see them again, in a satisfying way, until 9 or 10...

While the Tyrion parts of this episode felt kind of lame, I am really looking forward to seeing Tyrion in Daenerys camp. Such things happening faster in the show than the books, even if I expect the books to do them better, is part of the reason I am watching the show.

I expect Tyrion to be in trouble but use his mouth and give her some advice that makes her think that this sounds reasonable, maybe there is value in keeping him around.

me too since i fully expect to be worm food before the final book is released...

:smoking:

[PatrickStormborn]

GRRM has confirmed that they will meet in Winds, I'm 99.9% sure this is the show writers bringing the plot forward given there is no full on battle of Meeren. LIke you in the books I suspect they meet in Meereen but I can't see them remaining allies, particularly as Tyrion and Jon are on good terms and a Dany v Jon stand off may be a potential end game.

No, he said that "they will intersect, in a way, but for much of the book they're still apart".

I don't think Dany and Tyrion will meet in Meereen, because I don't think Dany is going back there.

[Drogonthedread]

GRRM also said that "we know that dany got a book from Jorah about history of westeros she never had time to read..,but you know who knows the history is going to her ,TYrion"

so they are more than intersecting

[Mirante]

My moronic and redundant observation is that this meeting has occurred before the fighting pit and before Dany gets swept off by Drogon to the outer wilds where she trips off berries and finally gets real with some things in her life.

So for me this is too soon. If I ruled the world, I would have had an episode at least showing the conditions around the land where slavery is far from ended, and the situation where forces are mounting against Dany in the hinterlands. I.e a bit more worldbuilding, since that part of the world is very scenic, and we could do with more picturesque land and cityscapes and an impression of how that part of the world all knits together.

Anyway, I do hope we get Dany in the wilderness as this I think represents a turning point and restoration of the woman of potential we saw in the first few books/series.

[robasp2]

My pediction.

A queen should keep her word

"True, but a queen could also show mercy. I remember Ser barristan always talked about mercy.

Let the gods decide his fate. Let him fight in the pits. If he was truly guilty may he die, else may he earn your forgiveness. Win-win?"