U.S. Politics 2016 Seasonal Hiring Edition: "You're fired"

[Martell Spy]

http://www.politico.com/magazine/story/2016/12/how-democrats-rebuild-2016-214533

‘Everything Feels Relatively Existential Now’
How can Democrats rebuild after their 2016 rout? Politico Magazine asked four smart observers to hash it out.

[Larry of the Lawn]

38 minutes ago, Dr. Pepper said:

And now in the future, journalists are going to be allowing Republicans to discuss this as a belief rather than requiring them to accept fact.  Much like they have to do with evolution and climate change.  

Maybe you should just consider both sides for once instead of just indulging your sides echo chamber of sheeple.

[Mexal]

36 minutes ago, larrytheimp said:

Maybe you should just consider both sides for once instead of just indulging your sides echo chamber of sheeple.

What is the other side to the particular statement Dr. Pepper was responding to?

[Commodore]

1 hour ago, Martell Spy said:

http://www.politico.com/magazine/story/2016/12/how-democrats-rebuild-2016-214533

‘Everything Feels Relatively Existential Now’
How can Democrats rebuild after their 2016 rout? Politico Magazine asked four smart observers to hash it out.

Events matter most, but the basic approach is not that hard. Eschew the SJW identity politics  and gun grabbing talk and focus on "GOP wants to help rich people and take away your bennies"

[Larry of the Lawn]

9 minutes ago, Mexal said:

What is the other side to the particular statement Dr. Pepper was responding to?

Sorry, that was sarcasm.  Was joking about the notion that believing Trump won the popular vote deserves the same consideration as believing he didn't.  

[Dr. Pepper]

11 minutes ago, Mexal said:

What is the other side to the particular statement Dr. Pepper was responding to?

larry was just taking on the part of the average conservative. I lol'd

[LongRider]

9 minutes ago, larrytheimp said:

Sorry, that was sarcasm.  Was joking about the notion that believing Trump won the popular vote deserves the same consideration as believing he didn't.  

  <<<<<  Me, taking you literally.  D'uh.

[Manhole Eunuchsbane]

 SNL Sketch-Hillary Actually

 

 

[Zorral]

Gads!  Their sheer control of time -- and facial expression -- and, well, everything.  Brilliant.

Um -- hmmmm, --- why aren't they president?

 

[Manhole Eunuchsbane]

4 minutes ago, Zorral said:

Gads!  Their sheer control of time -- and facial expression -- and, well, everything.  Brilliant.

Um -- hmmmm, --- why aren't they president?

 

 Yeah, Baldwin's Trump impression is good, but not nearly nuanced as McKinnon's Clinton. She's kind of brilliant.

[LongRider]

Just now, Manhole Eunuchsbane said:

 Yeah, Baldwin's Trump impression is good, but not nearly nuanced as McKinnon's Clinton. She's kind of brilliant.

Her portrayal of Kellyanne Conway is also very good.  Kellyanne, victim of her own success, or as she mentioned in last night's skit, she's chained to Trump now for all time.  

[Mr Fixit]

6 hours ago, Commodore said:

Events matter most, but the basic approach is not that hard. Eschew the SJW identity politics  and gun grabbing talk and focus on "GOP wants to help rich people and take away your bennies"

That's a smart strategy and one that would resonate with voters I guess, but there's a problem when their presidential candidate is in bed with practically every big monied interest out there. Dems have actively profiled themselves as party of Wall Street and big business. Kinda hard to campaign against their own policies. Of course, we can discuss why they adopted such suicidal policies in the first place (well, $$$), but there it is.

[Squab]

6 hours ago, Commodore said:

Events matter most, but the basic approach is not that hard. Eschew the SJW identity politics  and gun grabbing talk and focus on "GOP wants to help rich people and take away your bennies"

Isn't it better to stand for something rather than against something?

[Larry of the Lawn]

31 minutes ago, Mr Fixit said:

That's a smart strategy and one that would resonate with voters I guess, but there's a problem when their presidential candidate is in bed with practically every big monied interest out there. Dems have actively profiled themselves as party of Wall Street and big business. Kinda hard to campaign against their own policies. Of course, we can discuss why they adopted such suicidal policies in the first place (well, $$$), but there it is.

Have you paid attention to any US politics in the last 50 years?  Both parties are pro-big business, but the Repubs have been pushing corporate tax cuts, corporate welfare, and for removal of even basic environmental regulations.  

Calling Dems the party of big business just allows everyone here to know that you don't know what you're talking about.

 

Republican policies are much more damaging to the working class while being pro-big business and rich people.  Do your home work.

[Zorral]

Their coal industry friendships show how much of a wreck they want to make of the economy and the environment, and further screw the people who somehow think they are going to bring back coal mining to power energy.  While the very same people are refusing to refund the coal workers' pensions -- because, ahem their corp has declared bankrupcy.  They are also pulling out the ACA for health benefits -- which has special provisions for coal miners and black lung.

But the bankrupt coal industry says it will come back with jobs if there are no supports for alternative, sustainable, renewable energies.  And most of all all the successful wind and solar farms are to be dismantled and the technology scrapped -- which by the way means the slashing of jobs for blue color workers such as some of my relatives who are making good money up there in windy prairie states in wind tubine vane factories.  For one instance.

In the meantime the former coal miners are still coughing their lungs out with Black Lung, and complain about the corps and their lies.  But want the jobs back even though the corps's safety measures were either not implemented at all or used machines and so on that didn't work.

Why were the Dems and Hillary not hitting this stuff over and over and over during the campaign?

What is going on here?  It's all just insane.

 

[OldGimletEye]

Just now, larrytheimp said:

Have you paid attention to any US politics in the last 50 years?  Both parties are pro-big business, but the Repubs have been pushing corporate tax cuts, corporate welfare, and for removal of even basic environmental regulations.  

Calling Dems the party of big business just allows everyone here to know that you don't know what you're talking about.

 

Republican policies are much more damaging to the working class while being pro-big business and rich people.  Do your home work.

Yeah, I guess I can understand, to some extent, why some outsiders might think that American politics is pretty much two right wing parties shouting at each other over guns and abortion.

It may not be an epic showdown between Marxist and 19th Century laissez-faire capitalism, but still there are some fairly big disputes over taxes, healthcare, financial regulation, minimum wage, various social insurance programs, and during the last 8 years fights over monetary and fiscal policy were important. All these issues mattered for working class people.

[Manhole Eunuchsbane]

14 minutes ago, Zorral said:

Why were the Dems and Hillary not hitting this stuff over and over and over during the campaign?

What is going on here?  It's all just insane.

Because Coal is a mostly dead industry and should probably just be left that way? I can see the wisdom in not given credence to the Corporate/Republican argument by actually addressing it. 

[Sivin]

2 minutes ago, Manhole Eunuchsbane said:

Because Coal is a mostly dead industry and should probably just be left that way? I can see the wisdom in not given credence to the Corporate/Republican argument by actually addressing it. 

I am growing to think that we of the left need to get our acts together and remind ourselves how to debate against these things. Of course it seems obvious that coal is obsolete, but there are a lot of voters who cannot grasp that and simply telling them 'coal is bad' isn't cutting it.

There was a time when progressives had to debate, actually debate, the fact that 'niggers' are human beings and deserve basic human rights. It was a serious topic and had to be treated as such, not dismissed out of hand. There was a time not that long ago that progressives had to lay out that homosexuals were not sent by the devil to rape christian children point by point, and treat those fears as if they were not simple nonsense.

Ridiculous as it is with the wealth of knowledge available via the internet, progressives need to educate ourselves on these topics we think of as settled to try and help those who refuse to help themselves. I don't know if you've ever debated a racist, actually debated and not simply gotten into a shouting match, but it's fucking hard! They have all of these fake facts and made up figures, and with fake news it's even worse.

I don't know, I'm only a 23 year old weirdo. But I think the only recourse against the new Republican madness is to actually deconstruct each bullshit argument they propose as if it actually has merits.

If they say coal will save the day, point out exactly why they're full of it. If they make racist statements, don't just point out the racism, explain why they're racist and the statements are wrong.

If they say they won the popular vote, cite all of the evidence to the contrary.

When they bitch about big government, explain how they're benefiting and what the Republicans are doing that will make their lives worse.

Etc. Etc. Etc. On and on and on and on and on and on until the effects of fake news have been marginalized.

 

[Zorral]

1 hour ago, Manhole Eunuchsbane said:

Because Coal is a mostly dead industry and should probably just be left that way? I can see the wisdom in not given credence to the Corporate/Republican argument by actually addressing it. 

That still makes no sense, that Hillary and the Dems did not inform the most concerned electorate about this topic that they are busy working to make their lives even more difficult, right where it hurts most, in jobs, pensions and health care. That they are doing exactly the opposite.  Don't need to address what the thugs are saying, only what they are actually doing.

But it still makes no sense that the very people who have been the most exploited and damaged by the coal corps hated Hillary even more than they hated the corps.  Somebody did something very brilliant here to pull that off, and alas, one feels that Hillary herself and the whole DNC helped -- a whole lot.

 

 

[Dr. Pepper]

3 hours ago, LongRider said:

Her portrayal of Kellyanne Conway is also very good.  Kellyanne, victim of her own success, or as she mentioned in last night's skit, she's chained to Trump now for all time.  

I've really disliked the Conway portrayal.  They treat Kellyanne Conway as though she has no agency, like she didn't choose to manage Trump's campaign to an eventual victory, as though she isn't freely deciding to continue to champion Trump and America's eventual terrible decline.  It's almost outrageous to say this in light of what the Trump political brand stands for, but the SNL interpretation of Conway is extremely anti-feminist.  Maybe that's the intent, but I doubt it.  I think they more wish that a woman wouldn't be doing what Conway is doing.