What was your personal GoT breaking point?

[T and A]

5 minutes ago, YoungGriff89 said:

Honestly if you didn't watch the battle on the wall when the episode was in IMAX I feel bad for you.  The translation from TV to IMAX screen was really good.  I wish they would have brought Neil Marshall back for the battle of the bastards and the battle at Winterfell.  Given the budget and the story development that it actually had to juggle, it's certainly one of the best battle sequences I've seen.

As far as a breaking point for me when it comes to Game of Thrones, I don't know how are we defining breaking point?  I've kind of hate watched the show since The Children, but I haven't ever been so turned off by the show that I just can't watch it anymore.  I've come close, morbid curiosity has kept me tuning in.  As for The Children, I had scattered issues with season four up to this point, but this entire damn episode is just one big crapshoot.  From the shoddy camera work beyond the wall (the whole beginning with Jon's dramatic walk was literally dizzying in IMAX as just one example), the editing nightmare that is Brienne vs the Hound, the lack of a Tysha reveal after it was setup, the crap with the skeletons and the fireballs, Bloodraven having two eyes, no Lady Stoneheart, it just all irritated me.  That was probably where I first knew I was going to fall out of love with this show sooner rather than later.  

Then season five happened, and I certainly hated those big moments we all have talked about ad nauseam but I didn't hate the season as much as most people seemed to.  Dance of Dragons was a good episode, Mother's Mercy was also a really good episode.  I want to say Hardhome was a good episode based on the really strong ending sequence, but I've seen the whole episode at least three times all the way through I can't remember a single thing that happened in the episode besides that.  So it probably doesn't deserve to be called a great episode overall.  Season five just felt like a bad season of Game of Thrones.  Then Season six came along and I watched it through one big, perpetual facepalm.  Didn't even feel like a bad season of Game of Thrones, just felt like an entirely different crappy medieval show with a ton of fan service for a book series thrown in.  Season six as a whole was really the point where I figured I probably wouldn't re-watch the entire series again or recommend anybody who asked me about the show watch it beyond season four.  

Unfortunatly the Cinemas in my Hometown didn't show GOT. I would have to drive like 100 km to watch it. And that was a little too much for GOT for me . I have the seasons on Blu-ray, and I watched them on my home cinema. Which was definitively better than in televion. But not IMAX unfortunatly. 

[T and A]

There was no breaking point for me. There was a point (Season 5) where I accepted, that I am watching a TV Show and not ASOIAF. And everything worked fine with me since then. 

[Dreadscythe95]

6 minutes ago, T and A said:

Look, everything has been said here. But I can't reisist not to give my two pennys into this. As a book fan and as a show fan. 

We should be able to have a polite and civilized conversation here. Naming people dumb, morons and other insulting words, who can't defend themself, because they are not present, isn't very brave, smart nor correct. Also, if you do it, at least have the guts to not make it anonymously. Put your real name into it. Write those peoples emails, letters. Let them know, how you personally feel about it. It is a very coward move to insult people on the internet, in an anonym way. 

The people here are mainly book fans. Fair enough. A lot of people here complain that the last episode was bad. Also fair enough. I wasn't a big fan of some parts of the episode too. But keep something in your mind, before you criticize: The show is the show, the books are the books. You won't find on the show, what you miss from the books so desperately. The show won't fill the gap, the books may have left. And it is not fair to expect from a TV show that. They can't possibly deliver. The show stated from the moment, they introduced the NK, that he represents death in the show. The showrunners made in every interview clear, that he won't have a personality. He won't be able to talk. He just represents death in the show. What personality does death have? What could he possibly say? And they went with this. How do you kill someone like that? The prophecies you might add, they all stated that Jon and Daenery are the chosen one. In the show, those prophecies were made by Melissandre. She was continuously wrong in the show. Again, I am only talking about the show. Not the books. You just have to forget them for a moment. I'll come to that later, don't worry. Jon and Daenerys were presumably the princ/es that was promised. It is mentioned by Melissandre, as far as I remeber, in season 5,6 and 7. She said in season 7, that she fullfilled the prophecy, she brought together Ice and Fire. Which is what happend. Without Jon (who was resurected by Melisandre) the Boltons weren't defeated. Arya would never have went to Winterfell. Without Jon, Danerys would have never gave up the war, to go North and fight the NK. Without Daenerys Army, Winterfell would have been doomed. Yes, Arya was the one, to actually end everything, but without the Unsullied and the united northeners, she would not even have a chance alone in Winterfell. Let alone, that it would have been the Boltons, and Arya would have been either dead or somewhere in the south. So, why does it matter that Jon has to actually kill the NK in the show? Did I liked it that Arya did it. No, I didn't. But does this ruin the show for me? No, not really. One scene, doesn't ruin an entire series for me. Then again, and now I come back to the books: I seperate those two storys. I don't watch the show, and complain if something is different in the books. If you feel that way, and I completely understand that, Game of Thrones is indeed definitively not your cup of tea. You really should not watch it. It is clear, from Season 5 that this series is not a faithfull adaptation of the books. Yes, the showrunners know the (planed) ending of the series, as was stated several time by GRRM and the showrunners themself. But they don't have to stick to it. And most importantly, the journey is what matters. If the journey is different, than the result won't matter. As was recently stated by GRRM, the end may be the same. Maybe not. Who knows? The point that I try to make is the following: Don't judge the Events of a show by comparing it to books, not yet released, and then insult the showrunners (who you don't know and who haven't comited any real crime) for doing what they think is the best for their show. You won't be satisfied if you are looking for books and search for them on television. You won't find them there. You may find those on a library. Some day. Maybe. 

I had a great time here, discussing the books with you guys. Had some great discussions. But I just don't enjoy the tone here anymore. It has become vicious, mean and just like any random 9GAG comentary. 

I don't agree with the point that the show can't deliver what the books did deliver. The way Martin writes the books is literarly like a script so it's a relatively easy adaptation. 

Also the series has been top quality in the first 2-3 seasons and thay have added scenes and characters that had actually imporved on the books. 

So yeah for me this is not accepted, they just wanted to keep the series more commercial when the story started getting more complex and they also didn't want to drag the series to 12 seasons, it's GRRM creation after all, not theirs, they got the popularity they wanted. I also believe that they don;t have neither the talent nor the will to write the story the way Matin wrties it.

Game of Thrones has become convinient plots, massive plot holes, Hollywood fiesta, cringey dialogues, fan service and mediocore battles after season 5. 

The problem started to show as early as season 3 when they removed many main characters and plots and if you remember Martin had made back then the famous statement about the 5 characters he strongly wanted in the story and the butterfly effect and how it will affect the series.

I personally love Martin's work far too much to accept what we have been given, a mediocore story about dragons, zombies and mad queens.

[T and A]

1 minute ago, Dreadscythe95 said:

I don't agree with the point that the show can't deliver what the books did deliver. The way Martin writes the books is literarly like a script so it's a relatively easy adaptation. 

Also the series has been top quality in the first 2-3 seasons and thay have added scenes and characters that had actually imporved on the books. 

So yeah for me this is not accepted, they just wanted to keep the series more commercial when the story started getting more complex and they also didn't want to drag the series to 12 seasons, it's GRRM creation after all, not theirs, they got the popularity they wanted. I also believe that they don;t have neither the talent nor the will to write the story the way Matin wrties it.

Game of Thrones has become convinient plots, massive plot holes, Hollywood fiesta, cringey dialogues, fan service and mediocore battles after season 5. 

The problem started to show as early as season 3 when they removed many main characters and plots and if you remember Martin had made back then the famous statement about the 5 characters he strongly wanted in the story and the butterfly effect and how it will affect the series.

I personally love Martin's work far too much to accept what we have been given, a mediocore story about dragons, zombies and mad queens.

That was not the intention of my post, was it?

[divica]

Just now, T and A said:

Look, everything has been said here. But I can't reisist not to give my two pennys into this. As a book fan and as a show fan. 

We should be able to have a polite and civilized conversation here. Naming people dumb, morons and other insulting words, who can't defend themself, because they are not present, isn't very brave, smart nor correct. Also, if you do it, at least have the guts to not make it anonymously. Put your real name into it. Write those peoples emails, letters. Let them know, how you personally feel about it. It is a very coward move to insult people on the internet, in an anonym way. 

The people here are mainly book fans. Fair enough. A lot of people here complain that the last episode was bad. Also fair enough. I wasn't a big fan of some parts of the episode too. But keep something in your mind, before you criticize: The show is the show, the books are the books. You won't find on the show, what you miss from the books so desperately. The show won't fill the gap, the books may have left. And it is not fair to expect from a TV show that. They can't possibly deliver. The show stated from the moment, they introduced the NK, that he represents death in the show. The showrunners made in every interview clear, that he won't have a personality. He won't be able to talk. He just represents death in the show. What personality does death have? What could he possibly say? And they went with this. How do you kill someone like that? The prophecies you might add, they all stated that Jon and Daenery are the chosen one. In the show, those prophecies were made by Melissandre. She was continuously wrong in the show. Again, I am only talking about the show. Not the books. You just have to forget them for a moment. I'll come to that later, don't worry. Jon and Daenerys were presumably the princ/es that was promised. It is mentioned by Melissandre, as far as I remeber, in season 5,6 and 7. She said in season 7, that she fullfilled the prophecy, she brought together Ice and Fire. Which is what happend. Without Jon (who was resurected by Melisandre) the Boltons weren't defeated. Arya would never have went to Winterfell. Without Jon, Danerys would have never gave up the war, to go North and fight the NK. Without Daenerys Army, Winterfell would have been doomed. Yes, Arya was the one, to actually end everything, but without the Unsullied and the united northeners, she would not even have a chance alone in Winterfell. Let alone, that it would have been the Boltons, and Arya would have been either dead or somewhere in the south. So, why does it matter that Jon has to actually kill the NK in the show? Did I liked it that Arya did it. No, I didn't. But does this ruin the show for me? No, not really. One scene, doesn't ruin an entire series for me. Then again, and now I come back to the books: I seperate those two storys. I don't watch the show, and complain if something is different in the books. If you feel that way, and I completely understand that, Game of Thrones is indeed definitively not your cup of tea. You really should not watch it. It is clear, from Season 5 that this series is not a faithfull adaptation of the books. Yes, the showrunners know the (planed) ending of the series, as was stated several time by GRRM and the showrunners themself. But they don't have to stick to it. And most importantly, the journey is what matters. If the journey is different, than the result won't matter. As was recently stated by GRRM, the end may be the same. Maybe not. Who knows? The point that I try to make is the following: Don't judge the Events of a show by comparing it to books, not yet released, and then insult the showrunners (who you don't know and who haven't comited any real crime) for doing what they think is the best for their show. You won't be satisfied if you are looking for books and search for them on television. You won't find them there. You may find those on a library. Some day. Maybe. 

I had a great time here, discussing the books with you guys. Had some great discussions. But I just don't enjoy the tone here anymore. It has become vicious, mean and just like any random 9GAG comentary. 

The problem is that people aren t criticizing the episode because it doesn t correspond to what the books say. This episode is so bad that it completly destroys the show only based on what we see in the show.

There is absolutly no point to bran becoming the 3er. We are told several times how important he is to win the war through the seasons and he does absolutly nothing!

Jon has had his whole story related to the dead. This batle was the high point of his whole story in the series and his stand off with the NK. He does nothing in the batle. He is useless!

Danny, her dragons and the dothriaki are completly useless. She spends half the ep lost in fog, the dothriaki die in 5 secs and the dragons do almost nothing in the battle.The world would be much better if jon never ressurected and went to convince danny to leave the IT and join the fight. The NK wouldn t have a dragon to get through the Wall and he wouldn t have 100 000 dothriaki!

We spent years developing the story of the dothriaki and they absolutly nothing in the story before going extinct… Most useless everything!

We are suposed to believe mel saw arya kill the NK in season 3? Then what was the whole point of her burning people for stannis and believing in him until the end? Her ressurecting jon or going to danny? why not go looking for fucking arya!?

We have no idea why the NK wants to kill all people! how he got free from the cotf influence? how did he made a pact with craster? is there something special about craster's babies? what has be been doing all this time?

They have been telling us that the ww are the great menace. That the IT doesn t matter compared to them… And now we find out that it was a lie! That what matters is the IT and that cersei was right! And that the ww were defeated in their first battle in a stupid way by a girl that was super arrogante last ep about meeting the ww for the first time.

Both mel and the priestess in meereen have been talking about the profecy about tptwp for years. Now it doesn t even matter...

And I could probably continue writing how this episode ruins the series solely based on what hapens in the show. 

[T and A]

4 minutes ago, divica said:

The problem is that people aren t criticizing the episode because it doesn t correspond to what the books say. This episode is so bad that it completly destroys the show only based on what we see in the show.

There is absolutly no point to bran becoming the 3er. We are told several times how important he is to win the war through the seasons and he does absolutly nothing!

Jon has had his whole story related to the dead. This batle was the high point of his whole story in the series and his stand off with the NK. He does nothing in the batle. He is useless!

Danny, her dragons and the dothriaki are completly useless. She spends half the ep lost in fog, the dothriaki die in 5 secs and the dragons do almost nothing in the battle.The world would be much better if jon never ressurected and went to convince danny to leave the IT and join the fight. The NK wouldn t have a dragon to get through the Wall and he wouldn t have 100 000 dothriaki!

We spent years developing the story of the dothriaki and they absolutly nothing in the story before going extinct… Most useless everything!

We are suposed to believe mel saw arya kill the NK in season 3? Then what was the whole point of her burning people for stannis and believing in him until the end? Her ressurecting jon or going to danny? why not go looking for fucking arya!?

We have no idea why the NK wants to kill all people! how he got free from the cotf influence? how did he made a pact with craster? is there something special about craster's babies? what has be been doing all this time?

They have been telling us that the ww are the great menace. That the IT doesn t matter compared to them… And now we find out that it was a lie! That what matters is the IT and that cersei was right! And that the ww were defeated in their first battle in a stupid way by a girl that was super arrogante last ep about meeting the ww for the first time.

Both mel and the priestess in meereen have been talking about the profecy about tptwp for years. Now it doesn t even matter...

And I could probably continue writing how this episode ruins the series solely based on what hapens in the show. 

Sure. And I never said, it should not ruin the show for you. I even said several times, if you expect that from this show, you really should not watch it. I said it didn't for me. And I said, that there is no reason to insult people (Not you specifically)

[Dreadscythe95]

10 minutes ago, T and A said:

That was not the intention of my post, was it?

Still you build your whole post around the point that the show is not badly written, it just is different to the books. Excuse me but the show is based on GRRM and the first 3 seasons are made that way. It's not that they could not follow the same path, it's just that they didn't want to. So we can criticise the result as much as we want, it's not nearly as good in quality as the original story and it's not good storytelling for a series in general after season 6. It is cheap and without a soul. Noone insults the people that watch it, it doesn't mean that everyone that waches GOT takes it as seriously as we do. Still as a story based on ASOIAF it is very bad and as I mentioned above it's not because it's a show and not a book, it's becuase of the decisions of the production.

[divica]

Just now, T and A said:

Sure. And I never said, it should not ruin the show for you. I even said several times, if you expect that from this show, you really should not watch it. I said it didn't for me. And I said, that there is no reason to insult people.

How can you seriously rewatch this show when this ep is all about showing that all the stories the have been creating for years are useless. That have no point. 

[T and A]

8 minutes ago, Dreadscythe95 said:

Still you build your whole post around the point that the show is not badly written, it just is different to the books. Excuse me but the show is based on GRRM and the first 3 seasons are made that way. It's not that they could not follow the same path, it's just that they didn't want to. So we can criticise the result as much as we want, it's not nearly as good in quality as the original story and it's not good storytelling for a series in general after season 6. It is cheap and without a soul. Noone insults the people that watch it, it doesn't mean that everyone that waches GOT takes it as seriously as we do. Still as a story based on ASOIAF it is very bad and as I mentioned above it's not because it's a show and not a book, it's becuase of the decisions of the production.

Have you actually read what I have written?? Excuse me, I am not gonna repeat my self. I explained MY feelings without insulting anyone. That was my whole point. You don't have to share my opinion on the series. You don't have to reply to my opinion. 

[Cas Stark]

Most of the ranting and raving about the show for several years has given up on ranting about how it differs from the books, there are plenty of plot holes, continuity fails, logic lapses and inconsistent characterization WITHIN the show to rant about the show completely separately from the books.

Episode 3 ruins years of the show in hindsight.  It has nothing to do with the books.  It destroys Jon's story, it turns Dany into a pretty terrible leader, and it leaves us with the culmination of Arya's story being trained as an assassin/assassinates someone big.   None of this has anything to do with the books that aren't written.

 

[Daemon of the Blacks]

The show differing from the books has never really been an issue for me. The only issue is whether the change works out or not. Sometimes it does and sometimes it doesn't. Its a case by case basis. 

Doran no longer being a schemer and getting killed off isn't the problem. The problem that his plotline was replaced by an utterly illogical and unsympathetic Nymeria and her wacky sand siblings. 

Young Griff being written out if a very understandable move but the problem is that they didn't take any steps to ensure Varys wasn't left completely stranded without that plotline. 

[Dreadscythe95]

17 minutes ago, T and A said:

Have you actually read what I have written?? Excuse me, I am not gonna repeat my self. I explained MY feelings without insulting anyone. That was my whole point. You don't have to share my opinion on the series. You don't have to reply to my opinion. 

You start a post lecturing everyone in here about how we should not insult everyone that likes the show while it was not needed at all, I answer to you without insulting you at all and now you get insulted yourself for no reason, lol.

The next logical step is for you to report your own post.

[Dreadscythe95]

8 minutes ago, Daemon of the Blacks said:

The show differing from the books has never really been an issue for me. The only issue is whether the change works out or not. Sometimes it does and sometimes it doesn't. Its a case by case basis. 

Doran no longer being a schemer and getting killed off isn't the problem. The problem that his plotline was replaced by an utterly illogical and unsympathetic Nymeria and her wacky sand siblings. 

Young Griff being written out if a very understandable move but the problem is that they didn't take any steps to ensure Varys wasn't left completely stranded without that plotline. 

I actualy have a problem with that as well because these changes weren't needed at all. Young Griff combined with Dorn and Varys-Illyrio is a massive part of the whole story and it's not difficult to excecute at all. I understood why the put Arya with Tywin, I uderstood why Bronn had more screen time than needed and I understood why they aged up many characters, I also welcomed many of these changes. Removing and simplyfying 80% of the story and the characters is not welcome though.

[T and A]

7 minutes ago, Dreadscythe95 said:

You start a post lecturing everyone in here about how we should not insult everyone that likes the show while it was not needed at all, I answer to you without insulting you at all and now you get insulted yourself for no reason, lol.

The next logic step is for you to report your own post.

What? How am I being insulting? 

[Dreadscythe95]

Just now, T and A said:

What? How am I being insulting? 

Being insulted ( I men that you got insulted). Have you seen your previous post? You just rant that I am putting you against the wall or something.

[Cas Stark]

I understood why they cut Arianne and Aegon, bringing in two new main characters who presumably don't affect the end game at such a late date, in season 5, would have thrown off the show.  Even Euron, who clearly does have some end game purpose, they have done a terrible job on him, he flounces in, tells jokes, ticks off a plot box and then disappears again, his characterization is totally superficial...

What I had hoped was that they would find a good way to make KL relevant without Aegon's plot.  Clearly that didn't happen.  In hinsight, I'd say they should have kept the Tyrells for another season, or bit the bullet and killed off Cersei and Jamie last season.  Dragging this out and having her inexplicably be now more powerful than Dany is stupid and unbelievable.

[T and A]

5 minutes ago, Dreadscythe95 said:

Being insulted ( I men that you got insulted). Have you seen your previous post? You just rant that I am putting you against the wall or something.

I didn't rant. Far from it. Are you trying to make me go rant ?

[Dreadscythe95]

Just now, T and A said:

I didn't rant. Far from it. Are you trying to make me go rant ?

Not at all. Sorry fi that is the case, but your post really feels like you got offended for some reason.

[T and A]

5 minutes ago, Dreadscythe95 said:

Not at all. Sorry fi that is the case, but your post really feels like you got offended for some reason.

I didn't 

[State Trooper]

5 hours ago, T and A said:

There was no breaking point for me. There was a point (Season 5) where I accepted, that I am watching a TV Show and not ASOIAF. And everything worked fine with me since then. 

Pretty much this, apart from the books. As you say, it's a TV show, that's all.

Said it before but I can't believe so many people watch a show they clearly hate. I mean what's the point? It makes no sense.

And all the fallout from the last episode reminds me of the end of The Sopranos, when everyone was up in arms over how it finished. Get over yourselves!