What was your personal GoT breaking point?

[State Trooper]

5 hours ago, Dreadscythe95 said:

Still you build your whole post around the point that the show is not badly written, it just is different to the books. Excuse me but the show is based on GRRM and the first 3 seasons are made that way. It's not that they could not follow the same path, it's just that they didn't want to. So we can criticise the result as much as we want, it's not nearly as good in quality as the original story and it's not good storytelling for a series in general after season 6. It is cheap and without a soul. Noone insults the people that watch it, it doesn't mean that everyone that waches GOT takes it as seriously as we do. Still as a story based on ASOIAF it is very bad and as I mentioned above it's not because it's a show and not a book, it's becuase of the decisions of the production.

If I felt that way I wouldn't bother watching it. Again, I just don't see the point.

I'll give you an example of what I mean with Peaky Blinders. I watched the first twenty minutes, thought it was rubbish and switched it off. Same with Breaking Bad and other popular shows, and I'd have done the same with GOT as well.

 

[Cas Stark]

6 minutes ago, State Trooper said:

If I felt that way I wouldn't bother watching it. Again, I just don't see the point.

I'll give you an example of what I mean with Peaky Blinders. I watched the first twenty minutes, thought it was rubbish and switched it off. Same with Breaking Bad and other popular shows, and I'd have done the same with GOT as well.

 

1. GOT was a good to very good even some times excellent show from seasons 1-4, so after 4 years people are invested. Certainly, if anyone has been watching the show for SEVEN years, they're not going to quit at the last 3 episodes.

2. The book series is not finished and many people expect the show end is the only end there will be to the story.

So there are your answers.

[Lord Varys]

6 hours ago, Cas Stark said:

I understood why they cut Arianne and Aegon, bringing in two new main characters who presumably don't affect the end game at such a late date, in season 5, would have thrown off the show.  Even Euron, who clearly does have some end game purpose, they have done a terrible job on him, he flounces in, tells jokes, ticks off a plot box and then disappears again, his characterization is totally superficial...

They should have cut much more irrelevant characters instead of ignoring the ones who could have made the story interesting. A variation of the Aegon plot could have worked by cutting all of Dorne, you know.

6 hours ago, Cas Stark said:

What I had hoped was that they would find a good way to make KL relevant without Aegon's plot.  Clearly that didn't happen.  In hinsight, I'd say they should have kept the Tyrells for another season, or bit the bullet and killed off Cersei and Jamie last season.  Dragging this out and having her inexplicably be now more powerful than Dany is stupid and unbelievable.

The Tyrells???? They were a joke since they brought in Mace the buffoon, essentially removed Loras from the show, and failed to feature any Tyrells but the old woman and Margaery. These two couldn't lead armies, couldn't do much more than talk, and would have most definitely never been a believable or convincing threat.

But, say, the Aegon plot could have worked if Willas or Garlan Tyrell had played the role Arianne is likely going to play in the books (not to mention that the Tyrells there could also side with Aegon eventually).

Bottom line is, the show basically had no plot in KL since season 5. They dragged on the stupid High Sparrow plot through nearly two seasons without anything of substance going on there.

And Cersei simply is no believable or scary threat. Even book Cersei doesn't really have that caliber. She is cruel and petty and is not completely stupid, but she is far too unhinged to ever become a great threat in her own right. But nobody is afraid of Lena Headey.

2 hours ago, State Trooper said:

Pretty much this, apart from the books. As you say, it's a TV show, that's all.

Said it before but I can't believe so many people watch a show they clearly hate. I mean what's the point? It makes no sense.

And all the fallout from the last episode reminds me of the end of The Sopranos, when everyone was up in arms over how it finished. Get over yourselves! 

These days you have to watch the shit to prevent yourself from being spoiled. Better watch the shit so you can get over it and not wonder whether some scenes were actually pretty decent.

[Lord Varys]

1 hour ago, Cas Stark said:

1. GOT was a good to very good even some times excellent show from seasons 1-4, so after 4 years people are invested. Certainly, if anyone has been watching the show for SEVEN years, they're not going to quit at the last 3 episodes.

2. The book series is not finished and many people expect the show end is the only end there will be to the story.

So there are your answers.

If it wasn't for the books I'd have been out of there a long time ago. I recall watching 'Heroes' and realizing in the middle of the fourth season how completely inconsistent and nonsensical this thing had become, stopped watching, and never turned back.

[Cas Stark]

7 minutes ago, Lord Varys said:

If it wasn't for the books I'd have been out of there a long time ago. I recall watching 'Heroes' and realizing in the middle of the fourth season how completely inconsistent and nonsensical this thing had become, stopped watching, and never turned back.

I  held out some hope that since they had GRRM's ending, it would be a dumbed down version, but would still hold together on some level.  I still think it's the only end there will be for the story, but it's so bastardized now I'm not sure even the outline of GRRM story end will still be visible.

[Lord Varys]

2 minutes ago, Cas Stark said:

I  held out some hope that since they had GRRM's ending, it would be a dumbed down version, but would still hold together on some level.  I still think it's the only end there will be for the story, but it's so bastardized now I'm not sure even the outline of GRRM story end will still be visible.

Whatever is going to happen, it is pretty much meaningless now. Who cares who dies in war that is fought to put down Cersei?

I mean, honestly, regardless who lives or dies in such a struggle it won't be meaningful or an achievement (although I must say being killed in a fight against Cersei most definitely will make you moron).

And any strange twist or betrayal that might or might not come would be completely without motivation or proper buildup. The good guys have, at this point, basically no reason to mistrust or betray each other. They just defeated a zombie army. They should all be as close as people would become in such an existential crisis.

And the people on Cersei's side show by the very fact that they stood with Cersei that they are the enemies of the good guys.

[Squall]

It's indeed irrelevant. The hereditary system is rather unstable in finding a suitable leader. The line of Targaryens is filled with bad apples mixed with golden ones, so who knows what'll happen in 20 years. The petty squabbles of today could be just a footnote in history.

In any case, for me after episode 3 the series is past redemption. I hope the ship runs aground on a nice beach but it could just as well sink to the bottom of the sea. I hope it's not the latter but it seems D&D want to jump the shark and they try to find "unexpected" turns of events everywhere. It just seems to head for daytime tv with knights and swords.

[Dreadscythe95]

2 hours ago, State Trooper said:

If I felt that way I wouldn't bother watching it. Again, I just don't see the point.

I'll give you an example of what I mean with Peaky Blinders. I watched the first twenty minutes, thought it was rubbish and switched it off. Same with Breaking Bad and other popular shows, and I'd have done the same with GOT as well.

 

It's different when you are in season 1 and when you are in season 8. GOT was flawless in season 1. 

[Red Dragon10]

I found the whole Dorne plot boring and disappointing.  I thought the Sand Snakes were pretty ridiculous.  There were absolutely things I disliked before that, but I remember the Dorne period of the show as when I started to find my attention wandering even during a first watch. 

I keep watching because a) I DO still enjoy the show.  I still enjoy the spectacle.  I see the flaws, but can still enjoy it for entertainments sake.  But it is no longer the kind of TV that I rewatch more than maybe one extra time.  I have seen the first 4 seasons many times!  b) I keep watching because I love the characters..or at least, the characters I learned to love in the earlier seasons.  I care about what happens to them.  I want to see where they "end up".  And this is goodbye...I can always revisit them in old seasons, but I'll never see them having new adventures, making new colossal mistakes.  So I keep watching, even though I do think the show is a shadow of what it once was.  The writing and the characterization has just fallen so far, even though it still looks great. 

State Trooper - I initially found Peaky Blinders a bit boring, but I came back to it and ended up loving it!  I also found the first episode of Breaking Bad boring and haven't gotten back to it yet. 

[Lady Fevre Dream]

On 5/2/2019 at 10:00 AM, Elayis said:

There are quite a few rant and ravers here, and I’ve always been curious what moment/storyline set them down that path.

For me as an Unsullied (I didn’t read the books until after season 6), I didn’t actively start to dislike the show until Sansa’s Winterfell arc in season 5. It felt like a complete reversal of the progress she had made since leaving King’s Landing. To go immediately from talking smack to Myranda to then being raped by Ramsay was just awful writing. Unbowed, Unbent, Unbroken was the straw the broke the camel’s back, even if I didn’t realize it yet. I didn’t hate the show at that point, but it was the first time that watching GoT became a chore instead of a pleasure. It wasn’t until season 6 (specifically how they handled Jon’s death) that I became a full blown hate-watcher.

Sansa’s rape seems to be one of the points of no return for a lot of viewers (even sites like The Mary Sue refused to cover the show after that), but it wasn’t the only one. Dorne was a problem for a lot of people, but for some reason gets handwaved away as being a rare misstep. Beyond the Wall was the first time the show received a tidal wave of pushback, with sites like Forbes, Wired, Vulture and Vanity Fair being particularly critical. The Long Night seems to have been the last straw for a considerable amount of people, but then undermining the central threat of the entire series will do that for you.

I’m also curious how this will break down between Unsullied and book readers. Looking back after finally reading the books, the cracks were always present. Sympathetic Cersei, Saint Tyrion, Talisa.

So what was the moment that made you realize GoT was only tits and dragons?

I knew during season 5 that other than being a goofy nitpicking book reader, things had moved past the point of no return.  But the suspicion had been there simmering since season 3, believe it or not, the Red Wedding made it clear.  Having read the books now, I would guess you have an idea on my problem with it, beyond Talisa (who, for the most part, I laughed off and moved on), it just seemed to be missing so much of the heart of the North and the support for Robb.  In the books we know many that go down with him, I guess they are all replaced with Talisa and the fetus.  Tywin Lannister is full of crap about only killing some people at dinner.  He condoned the massacre of an entire army, not a few people at dinner.  Granted, they kinda showed that, but then seemed to go with the their Tywin Lawful Neutral BS in tone anyway.  Season 4 had some great things in it, like Oberyn (regardless of the slight of having him live in the brothel, dudebros), that were distracting but as noted in other posts, the finale of season 4 with the way Tyrion's story was handled, the Brienne and Hound business, the decimation of the NW, too, left me with a feeling of foreboding. 

That foreboding was challenged in paying attention to the filming leaks and such.  I really couldn't imagine that the rumors of having Sansa marry Ramsey were true.  We heard a lot of other crazy stuff on filming leaks, and then.......lots were confirmed when those first 4 epis for season 5 leaked.  DAMN, by then I knew.  I could hardly bring myself to live watch once we got to episode 5 that year, the first one not leaked ahead of time.  I may be one of the few GOT watchers that hasn't seen Sansa's rape.  And, nah, don't think I'm changing my mind on that now.  No thank you.  I'd' had enough of their Ramsay anyway.  Little did I know.  The reason Theon's story and what he endures with Ramsay is interesting is because WE DON'T REALLY SEE IT in the books.  We don't experience anything but the after effects and some flashbacks.  It's like Spielberg and Jaws.  The reason the shark is so terrifying is that we hardly see him.  Thank heavens for all the trouble with the mechanical shark. 

Oddly enough, I'm just numb now, I'm sure I can't come up with EVERY reasoning for a full on break and going from Nitpicking some to full on Rant and Raver.  Sadly, though, the signs were there more and more each season.  It seemed the show was on a precipice at the end of season 4.  Instead of reigning themselves in, they plunged into the abyss. 

[Lady Fevre Dream]

11 hours ago, sweetsunray said:

I binge watched until S3 to catch up with S4. By that time I also started reading. I actually believed there would be a Ros POV in the books

That may be the funniest thing I've heard all day, someone looking for the Ros POV!! 

[Cas Stark]

So, is this the absolute most uninventive season?

1 & 2 are set up for a battle, 3 is a battle.

4 is set up for another battle, 5 is a battle.

And then 6 is the wrap up.

Could it be any more bare bones or repetitive?  I guess this is the real reason they only wanted 6 episodes, they can't deal with trying to write any more plot or dialogue.  How sad.

[sweetsunray]

8 minutes ago, Lady Fevre Dream said:

That may be the funniest thing I've heard all day, someone looking for the Ros POV!! 

Yeah, I open the book, read prologue, Bran's chapter, all the chapters of WF, and everybody leaving, but no Ros chapter. So, I thought, maybe in KL? Nope. Read all of aGoT. There isn't even one Ros in the whole book  

And sometimes when I read show-only comments discussing stuff about show vs books sometimes they mention Ros as if they think she's a character in the books. Makes me nostalgic Can't even burst their bubble. Think to myself, "Oh let them find that out by themselves if they ever decide to pick up the books."

[Lady Fevre Dream]

1 minute ago, sweetsunray said:

Yeah, I open the book, read prologue, Bran's chapter, all the chapters of WF, and everybody leaving, but no Ros chapter. So, I thought, maybe in KL? Nope. Read all of aGoT. There isn't even one Ros in the whole book  

And sometimes when I read show-only comments discussing stuff about show vs books sometimes they mention Ros as if they think she's a character in the books. Makes me nostalgic Can't even bburst their bubble. Think to myself, "Oh let them find that out by themselves if they ever decide to pick up the books."

LOLOL  You are sentimental.........and sweet. 

[divica]

Just now, Cas Stark said:

So, is this the absolute most uninventive season?

1 & 2 are set up for a battle, 3 is a battle.

4 is set up for another battle, 5 is a battle.

And then 6 is the wrap up.

Could it be any more bare bones or repetitive?  I guess this is the real reason they only wanted 6 episodes, they can't deal with trying to write any more plot or dialogue.  How sad.

I think we may have flashbacks of rhaegar this ep. On reddit there were leaks with fotos of him near filming locations.

But it will the most awkward moments ever. After 3 eps someone will finally decide to talk to bran? will jon and danny finish the r+l=j conversation and argument about the IT despite the mountains of people that just died and that jon never wanted the IT?

[Cas Stark]

Just now, divica said:

I think we may have flashbacks of rhaegar this ep. On reddit there were leaks with fotos of him near filming locations.

But it will the most awkward moments ever. After 3 eps someone will finally decide to talk to bran? will jon and danny finish the r+l=j conversation and argument about the IT despite the mountains of people that just died and that jon never wanted the IT?

Why at this point?  The show already told us he's legitimate and we already saw a flashback of the not very handsome Rhaegar marrying the not very pretty Lyanna, so what else do we need to see? 

 

[sweetsunray]

7 minutes ago, Lady Fevre Dream said:

LOLOL  You are sentimental.........and sweet. 

Hehehehe Can't really blame them for thinking it: she has a whole arc of 3 seasons. They basically made her a type of sympathetic POV character who tries to warn Sansa about LF. 

[divica]

Just now, Cas Stark said:

Why at this point?  The show already told us he's legitimate and we already saw a flashback of the not very handsome Rhaegar marrying the not very pretty Lyanna, so what else do we need to see? 

 

If D&D were decent writers we could see the tournement of harrenhall, rhaegar finding that she was the knight of the laughing tree and why people tought he kidnaped her.

However D&D just don t care… I mean, jon didn t even need to ask bran more about the story before believing in it and moving on like a champ… How could he not want to know why his mother ran away with his father? why they married in secret? why people fought a war thinking she was kidnaped?

 

[Cas Stark]

Just now, divica said:

If D&D were decent writers we could see the tournement of harrenhall, rhaegar finding that she was the knight of the laughing tree and why people tought he kidnaped her.

However D&D just don t care… I mean, jon didn t even need to ask bran more about the story before believing in it and moving on like a champ… How could he not want to know why his mother ran away with his father? why they married in secret? why people fought a war thinking she was kidnaped?

 

I don't think we need to see that, I'm not sure given how pointless his heritage turned out to be we needed to see the marriage flashback. 

I would like to understand why they never made public that she wasn't kidnapped, but doing that in a flashback would be so involved and no one cares anyway.

[divica]

Just now, Cas Stark said:

I don't think we need to see that, I'm not sure given how pointless his heritage turned out to be we needed to see the marriage flashback. 

I would like to understand why they never made public that she wasn't kidnapped, but doing that in a flashback would be so involved and no one cares anyway.

But if they don t give something more to the r+l=j reveal then it was another awful moment of writting. So bad that I don t even understand how anyone could do it. Like they take all that is interesting about the story, take the emotional impact and make it about claims and bloodline…

It is s8ep3 level of bad writing...