Worst plan ever made in the saga ?

[WhatAnArtist!]

5 hours ago, EggBlue said:

Quentyn was terrible in bringing Dany the marriage proposal. since he had only two knights with him there was no presentation of Dorne's power and since Q was awkward there was no way of some good seduction or persuasion

I just reread the chapter where Dany rejects him, and I really felt bad for Quentyn. I could relate to him somewhat. The fact that Dany even thought how much hotter one of his companions was, and that she wishes he was the prince instead, was both hilarious and pitiable. 

[Darth Sidious]

On 11/12/2021 at 8:52 PM, Laren Dorr said:

Jon Snow’s plan to lead a wildling attack on House Bolton. It was illegal and would have destroyed the watch. 

I would add another one of Jon’s boneheaded plans to the list of the worst. The Arya Rescue Mission, or ARM. Jon is far from a smart person but this move would obviously cause war between Bolton and the Night’s Watch. 

[Thandros]

13 hours ago, Willam Stark said:

He had Tyrion, Lancel, Willem and Martyn as Lannister males available at that time.

Martyn is still available at the current time in-universe, but it doesn't matter now since Cersei became the lady of Casterly Rock in her own right. Tommen and Myrcella are above him in the succession line, but they will die soon, therefore he has good chances inherit Casterly Rock since Tyrion is a kinslayer.

The Westermen will never follow him.

 

…. you seem to be completely missing the point. Sure in the original timeline they were all alive if not necessarily available (Willem and Martyn were prisoners of Robb) in a scenario where Renly takes King's Landing then Tyrion and Lancel are either dead or prisoners of Renly. This would leave the Westerlands in the hands of women, distant cousins or Freys if Tywin and Kevan die. Your second section seems to be making a completely unrelated point to both the first and the context of the conversation so I'm going to ignore it.

[WhatAnArtist!]

1 hour ago, Thandros said:

This would leave the Westerlands in the hands of women, distant cousins or Freys if Tywin and Kevan die.

Assuming that in this timeline Ser Stafford Lannister still dies at Oxcross, that still leaves Ser Devan Lannister to take command in the westerlands. Since he was later made the Warden of the West by Cersei in Feast, it's not far-fetched to imagine that he'd be an acceptable choice to take charge of the westerlands should there be no other Lannisters available. He seemed to do a decent enough job in Feast (though granted at that time the war was all but over). 

[Thandros]

1 hour ago, WhatAnArtist! said:

Assuming that in this timeline Ser Stafford Lannister still dies at Oxcross, that still leaves Ser Devan Lannister to take command in the westerlands. Since he was later made the Warden of the West by Cersei in Feast, it's not far-fetched to imagine that he'd be an acceptable choice to take charge of the westerlands should there be no other Lannisters available. He seemed to do a decent enough job in Feast (though granted at that time the war was all but over). 

Technically speaking if Tytos' line fails is to reduced to unacceptable candidates it would go to Damion Lannister or his father Damon Lannister (who we don't know if he's alive or not) much more background characters we know nothing at all about. Daven Lannister I suspect would do a good job if the circumstances called for it but he isn't the first in line after the descendants of Tytos he's just much more prominent.

[Angel Eyes]

A horrible plan made from a minor character: what lord in their right mind would marry their daughter to The Mountain, who probably murdered his two wives and is generally known as a sadistic murderer and rapist as far away as the North?

[Takiedevushkikakzvezdy]

4 minutes ago, Angel Eyes said:

A horrible plan made from a minor character: what lord in their right mind would marry their daughter to The Mountain, who probably murdered his two wives and is generally known as a sadistic murderer and rapist as far away as the North?

And with that in mind, why hasn't anyone asked Tywin to do something about The Mountain over the years? Someone like Jon Arryn, for example.

[Angel Eyes]

Just now, Takiedevushkikakzvezdy said:

And with that in mind, why hasn't anyone asked Tywin to do something about The Mountain over the years? Someone like Jon Arryn, for example.

One gets the feeling that Jon Arryn was a doormat...

[James Fenimore Cooper XXII]

On 11/12/2021 at 1:04 PM, Terrorthatflapsinthenight9 said:

Of all the military or political plans made by the character of ASOIAF, which one is in your opinion the absolute worst being either completely stupid or totally delusionnal or both at the same time ?

What is the absolute worst in the main series ? Which one if we take in account the World of Ice and Fire, Fire and Blood and the other series before the main books ?

Jon Snow planning to attack House Bolton.  He corrupted the purpose of the sacred order of the night's watch. 

[Northern Sword]

Quentyn going for a dragon seemed to have been bad choice. 

[Angel Eyes]

On 7/24/2022 at 7:06 AM, James Fenimore Cooper XXII said:

Jon Snow planning to attack House Bolton.  He corrupted the purpose of the sacred order of the night's watch. 

That purpose was already corrupted when he arrived.

[C.T. Phipps]

On 11/14/2021 at 6:04 PM, Bloodraven’s Spider said:

Cersei arming the faith has to be the dumbest plan in the entire series across every book, be it before or after the start of AGOT

It makes perfect sense if you assume you're considered a patron of a godly bunch and need to raise more soldiers.

[C.T. Phipps]

On 11/19/2021 at 11:13 PM, WhatAnArtist! said:

I just reread the chapter where Dany rejects him, and I really felt bad for Quentyn. I could relate to him somewhat. The fact that Dany even thought how much hotter one of his companions was, and that she wishes he was the prince instead, was both hilarious and pitiable. 

Doran's plan seemed badass and brilliant, welcoming Danny to Dorn.

The thing was that Dorn should have been the one doing the negotiations because, well, his son is a deconstruction of Rand Al'Thor, Garion, and other paperback fantasy heroes. "I'm a quiet bookish sort who, nevertheless, will be amazingly attractive to the beautiful princess."

No, my friend. No.

The fact he just sort of awkwardly presented the note and didn't say, "Hello, Your Highness, I am the heir of Dorne and my father would like to offer you his armies and the Seventh Kingdom to you in exchange for an offer of marriage. We're really in a good time now to reconquer the other six."

Which may not have been romantic but it's not like she's looking for that.

Edited July 25, 2022 by C.T. Phipps

[C.T. Phipps]

On 7/24/2022 at 7:06 AM, James Fenimore Cooper XXII said:

Jon Snow planning to attack House Bolton.  He corrupted the purpose of the sacred order of the night's watch. 

The Night's Watch's purpose has nothing to do with Wildlings. Oddly, we know it screwed Jon over but I feel like Lord Snow might have been able to persuade people over if he'd actually taken advantage of his personable relationship and leadership style to speak in practical terms rather than assuming loyalty.

It would never have gone over well with the old guard but, "Listen, I know you hate working with Wildlings and Stannis to an extent but we've seen the White Walkers, severely understaffed, and have a job to save the kingdom. I'm aware that the Willdings are dangerous and I'm not going to turn over the kingdom. It's a complicated situation and I'm open for suggestions but I think it is our best course."

Maybe only 5 Rangers would have stabbed him.

Seriously, though, the Boltons are also a threat to the Night's Watch.

[Your Mummer]

The Yunkish battle plans, particularly changing the command every day, and hiring so many mercenaries - too stupid to be true (or is that the point?). 

[C.T. Phipps]

If I had to say who is the worst strategist in all of Westeros, I would have to say Rhaegar Targaryen who somehow managed to botch what should have been a simple prophecy.

[Angel Eyes]

37 minutes ago, C.T. Phipps said:

If I had to say who is the worst strategist in all of Westeros, I would have to say Rhaegar Targaryen who somehow managed to botch what should have been a simple prophecy.

True. I keep puzzling over in my mind why he decided to cross the Trident, if he had the high ground where his army could just force the Rebels to cross and turn them into pincushions?

[C.T. Phipps]

2 hours ago, Angel Eyes said:

True. I keep puzzling over in my mind why he decided to cross the Trident, if he had the high ground where his army could just force the Rebels to cross and turn them into pincushions?

Until George writes otherwise, my headcanon is that Rhaegar was wrong-genre savvy (which is a common affliction in Westeros). He believed he was part of a prophecy to save the world and the Prince that Was Promised or at least the father of one, so he was going to win no matter what.

While we know Robert would make a b-line for Rhaegar no matter what, I'm also confident Rhaegar thought he could kill him.

Edited July 26, 2022 by C.T. Phipps

[Terrorthatflapsinthenight9]

41 minutes ago, C.T. Phipps said:

Until George writes otherwise, my headcanon is that Rhaegar was wrong-genre savvy (which is a common affliction in Westeros). He believed he was part of a prophecy to save the world and the Prince that Was Promised or at least the father of one, so he was going to win no matter what.

While we know Robert would make a b-line for Rhaegar no matter what, I'm also confident Rhaegar thought he could kill him.

He has to be to have taken Lyanna with him in the first place without expecting the terrible consequences it could have.  

Anyone with common sense would have known that it was going to be a disaster, especially with Rhaegar disappearing and people naturally looking for him in King's Landing, right within his mad father's earshot and sight. 

[C.T. Phipps]

27 minutes ago, Terrorthatflapsinthenight9 said:

He has to be to have taken Lyanna with him in the first place without expecting the terrible consequences it could have.  

Anyone with common sense would have known that it was going to be a disaster, especially with Rhaegar disappearing and people naturally looking for him in King's Landing, right within his mad father's earshot and sight. 

I feel like Rhaegar had plans to deal with the consequences of cheating on his highborn Dornish wife (possibly the fact Dornish people don't necessarily expect sexual fidelity) and probably planning on some way to placate the Starks.

However, I believe that Rhaegar's entire "plan" (and I use the term loosely) went utterly off the rails when:

* His father ordered Ned and Robert put to death as well as burned Rickard as well as Brandon Stark. From that point, there was no compromise possible.

* Rhaegar almost certainly didn't think Robert would react to his fiance that he barely knew being taken would suddenly develop an all-consuming obsession with the idea they were destined lovers. Nor that Robert would vilify Rhaegar to the point of mentally making him a sexual sadist, driving Robert to incredible acts of bravery/stupidity.

Edited July 26, 2022 by C.T. Phipps