Babylon 5 Rewatch Pt. 2

[Ran]

[quote]... in which case Sheridan cannot travel 17 years into the future as he does at the end of the episode as at that point the future is still [b]in flux[/b] and in that alternate future Sheridan is killed in the Shadow attack on B5.[/quote]

I think "in flux" would be the key words here, surely? The future is obviously in flux, meaning that it is not fixed and it's ready to diverge depending on what happens in the episode. The future where they are destroyed is a glimpse of what may be if they fail. The future where Sheridan and Delenn are held prisoner is a glimpse of a different what-may-be if they succeed. As the present action's outcome was in a state of indeterminacy, either future was possible, and the weird time bending stuff could send messages from one future into the past, or send one person from his present-past to his future-present (heh).

It's actually fairly straightforward for a time travel story, I always thought. He grossly simplified quantum physics-derived speculations on time (from infinite outcomes for every event, to relatively fixed 'this can lead to just one of two possible futures')

[mandy_k]

[quote name='Ran' post='1291521' date='Mar 28 2008, 10.11']I think "in flux" would be the key words here, surely? The future is obviously in flux, meaning that it is not fixed and it's ready to diverge depending on what happens in the episode. The future where they are destroyed is a glimpse of what may be if they fail. The future where Sheridan and Delenn are held prisoner is a glimpse of a different what-may-be if they succeed. As the present action's outcome was in a state of indeterminacy, either future was possible, and the weird time bending stuff could send messages from one future into the past, or send one person from his present-past to his future-present (heh).
...
He grossly simplified quantum physics-derived speculations on time (from infinite outcomes for every event, to relatively fixed 'this can lead to just one of two possible futures')[/quote]

One can discard the "nothing can be changed" possibility immediately, since this would be anathema to JMS' personal philosophy ("we create the future").

It's a version of the multi-universe idea, each decision leads to a the realisation of a different timeline. The distorted time field in Sector 14 allows the crew to see glimpes of these "what if" futures. Two of them are shown (1: don't take back B4 and B5 is destroyed, and 2: take back B4, and you end up in Centauri Palace) and a third is hinted at ("Do not go to Z'ha'dum). I thought Delenn stated that quite clearly: "If we do not proceed, a possible future will become the true future!" I see a few problems with the episode, relating to the question where the triluminaries are in each timeline, and what happens with Sheridan in Centauri Palace, but the overall timeline issue isn't one of them.

[quote]It's actually fairly straightforward for a time travel story, I always thought.[/quote]

I agree. I find it more logical than Harlan Ellison's award-winning Trek story "The City on the Edge forever" - at least the aired version, not sure what this was like in the original script - where due to the changed timeline suddenly no Enterprise exists, and the audience is left to wonder how in this alternate history the crew even got onto the planet with the guardian :D

[SpaceChampion]

Just got this email from the B5 Scripts team:

[font="VerdanaGenevaArialHelveticasans-serif"][size=2][color="#000000"] [font="VerdanaGenevaArialHelveticasans-serif"][size=2][color="#000000"] [font="Verdana Arial Helvetica sans-serif"][size=3]
[b][size=4][color="#cc3300"]VOLUME 15 - GOOD NEWS #1 [/color][/size][/b] [/size][/font][font="Verdana Arial Helvetica sans-serif"][size=4][color="#cc3300"] [/color][/size][/font][font="Verdana Arial Helvetica sans-serif"] [/font][font="Verdana Arial Helvetica sans-serif"][font="Verdana Arial Helvetica sans-serif"][font="Verdana Arial Helvetica sans- serif"][size=3][b][font="Verdana Arial Helvetica sans-serif"][size=3][img]http://www.babylon5scripts.co%0d%0am/Vol15n.jpg[/img][/size][/font][/b][/size][/font][/font][size=3]Are you sitting down?[/size][/font]

[font="Verdana Arial Helvetica sans-serif"] [/font][font="Verdana Arial Helvetica sans-serif"][font="Verdana Arial Helvetica sans- serif"][size=3][/size][/font]Last week, we were having our regular pow-wow with J. Michael Straczynski, detailing the production status of Volume 15. This is when JMS told us that while he was adding one big, bonus piece of content (which you'll read about in Good News #2), he also wanted to do something extra special for the fans as a thank you for their patience and loyalty to the script books.[/font]

[size=3]"You could sign them," we replied in unison, half-chuckling, as if JMS would lock himself up for weeks to sign every Volume 15.[/size]

[size=3]"That's what I was thinking," he replied.[/size]

[size=3]Stunned silence. We knew he wasn't kidding.[/size]

[size=3]So that's what he's doing. Right now. As you read this. Signing.[/size]

[size=3]Actually, to be more specific, he's signing the title page of each book, and the signed title page will be bound with the rest of the pages for Volume 15.[/size]

[size=3]To do this, we paused production on Volume 15, dispatched a FedEx convoy that arrived at an undisclosed location -- fondly referred to by the team as the "Signing Bunker" -- and off-loaded box after box after box after box of these title pages.[/size]

[size=3]Signing stations were set-up throughout the Signing Bunker. Each station has a table with a stack of title pages and a fresh- out-of-the-box pile of red Sharpie pens. If you were to climb up on a ladder all you'd see is row after row of these signing stations and, a speck at one of them, hunched over.[/size]

[size=3](Important note: J. Michael Straczynski is signing his name only. In other words, these aren't personally inscribed, meaning that they don't include a inscription such as "To John". If you would like JMS to inscribe your book, he's happy to do that during signings at his personal appearances.)[/size]

[size=3]Once JMS is done signing all the title pages, the FedEx convoy will return to haul the pages back across country to Cafepress, who will reunite the signed title pages with the rest of Volume 15's contents, and then bind them.[/size]

[size=3]We expect the whole process to take about 21 days -- give or take a little.[/size]

[size=3]Because Volume 15 is being shipped with Volume 14, we are holding the shipping of all Volume 14s until we have the signed Volume 15s bound and ready. [b][url="http://rs6.net/tn.jsp?e=001FGXKMkKjnjje1AZ0uUcHiB_agGJJ6fepUvI5XBCqoqw9AAvGU6-O2rTeKhyyipT5JmfwkjByhYyoQ0sj-XFWoN2vQZ9_6Uls1GRCOFTp6JTpNIlRBbdPz8OQMmHryKA8"]Despite the slight shipping delay, you can still order Volume 14 today[/url][/b], and as soon as Volume 15 is done, both will be shipped together to those folks who have completed and submitted their proof of purchase form.[/size]

[size=3][b]So that's the first big piece of good news. Your Volume 15 will arrive SIGNED[/b].[/size]

[size=3]
[color="#cc0000"][b] VOLUME 15 GOOD NEWS #2[/b][/color]
The second good news item is that JMS has added a new goodie to Volume 15 that he describes as "the most staggering document to appear in any of these volumes. A Rosetta Stone, if you will, to the whole series of script books."[/size]

[size=3]This Rosetta Stone is called "Joe Cuts."[/size]

[size=3]Joe Cuts is an inventory of every variation between all 92 scripts in the 14-volume series and what you've seen on the DVDs. In other words, a script archivist compared every single line of every single script to what is in the episode on DVD, and itemized those differences, line by line, shot by shot, scene by scene.[/size]

[size=3]Here's an example of one entry:[/size]

[indent] [indent] [font="Verdana Arial Helvetica sans-serif"][size=3]EPISODE: Infection -- Deleted Scene -- Ivanova has taken Mary Ann on a tour of the Station and they end in C&C. Mary Ann asks a few questions about Ivanova's family then thanks her and then asks if there's anything Ivanova would like to say to the audience. Ivanova gives some sound advice.[/size][/font]

[/indent] [/indent] [font="Verdana Arial Helvetica sans-serif"] [size=3]This is just one of 526 entries in the inventory. 526. This is why it took 160 hours to compile and why it runs 70 pages.[/size]

[size=3]So if your "things to do before I die" list includes watching every episode on the DVDs along with the scripts from this 14-volume series to spot the differences, you've just been given a chunk of your life back.[/size]

[/font] [font="Verdana Arial Helvetica sans-serif"][size=3][b]WHAT YOU SHOULD DO NEXT[/b]
[color="#cc0000"]We sent out an announcement with every Volume 13 that explained that fans must submit their proof of purchase BEFORE they order Volume 14, and that Volume 15 is being shipped with every Volume 14 that has a proof of purchase form associated with it.[/color][/size][/font]

[font="Verdana Arial Helvetica sans-serif"][size=3][color="#cc0000"]If you haven't ordered Volume 13 yet, or if you haven't completed your set up to Volume 13, you'll want to read all about this. For full details go to
[url="http://rs6.net/tn.jsp?e=001FGXKMkKjnjikUAo4Ey9jAWS0ILEU_aM1R-C2F-aQYtDPmNVUzZFHaVJEq3OC-woq6pbaVbJYIWc-nHlOHpUlHeaiPHF49wnIVrOAzPCW3lY0ETz1dSKw9By7RvwM8IyV"] [url="http://babylon5scripts.com/proof"]http://babylon5scripts.com/proof[/url][/url][/color][/size][/font][font="Verdana Arial Helvetica sans-serif"][size=3]
[/size][/font][font="Verdana Arial Helvetica sans-serif"][size=3]
Our mandate from J. Michael Straczynski is to make sure that every fan who is entitled to the free Volume 15 gets one. If you have any concerns, questions, special considerations, or notable exceptions, and are worried that your proof of purchase form might not go through successfully, worry NOT. We're here to help. Just email us at [email protected] and put "Question about Proof of Purchase" in your subject line.[/size][/font]

[font="Verdana Arial Helvetica sans- serif"][size=3][color="#000000"][b]If you've already completed your proof of purchase form, all you need to do is order Volume 14.[/b][/color][/size][/font][font="Verdana Arial Helvetica sans-serif"][size=3] That's it. We will match your proof of purchase form with your Volume 14 order and make sure that you get your free Volume 15. It will be sent at the same time. [/size][/font]

[font="Verdana Arial Helvetica sans-serif"][size=3]
[b][size=4][color="#cc0000"]VOLUME 14 - JUST RELEASED[/color][/size][/b][/size][/font]

[font="Verdana Arial Helvetica sans-serif"][size=3][url="http://rs6.net/tn.jsp?e=001FGXKMkKjnjjzIDEVbJOeBwO_jCcMrUicx55LarWAQqzPcIXcKIWFOZAjKc1j-RKj2_Yzejf1w7RN-GmIwCWj0xUaXn23GhRHyZIgrmn2GuinlhQuljNUcgG-hzPkKYXV"][img]http://www.babylon5scripts.co%0d%0am/Cover14.gif[/img][/url]• The Wheel of Fire
• Objects in Motion
• Objects at Rest
• In The Beginning
• BONUS: "In The Beginning" Producer's Notebook

[url="http://rs6.net/tn.jsp?e=001FGXKMkKjnjjzIDEVbJOeBwO_jCcMrUicx55LarWAQqzPcIXcKIWFOZAjKc1j-RKj2_Yzejf1w7RN-GmIwCWj0xUaXn23GhRHyZIgrmn2GuinlhQuljNUcgG-hzPkKYXV"]Click here to order Volume 14[/url][/size][/font]

[font="Verdana Arial Helvetica sans-serif"][size=3]It's here. Volume 14 of the 14-volume series which includes not only the last three scripts of the series, but the complete script of the Babylon 5 movie-for-television: "In the Beginning."[/size][/font]

[font="Verdana Arial Helvetica sans-serif"][size=3]But wait. There's more.[/size][/font]

[font="Verdana Arial Helvetica sans-serif"]You'll also get a replica of the highlights of J. Michael Straczynski's Producer's Notebook for "In the Beginning," including documents never released to fans such as the Storyboards, Shooting Schedule and One Line Schedule.[/font]

[font="Verdana Arial Helvetica sans-serif"][size=3]Volume 14 is also packed with more goodies, including the opening narration credit voice-over scripts, more exclusive photos and an appendix.[/size][/font]

[font="Verdana Arial Helvetica sans-serif"][size=3]Yes, an appendix.[/size][/font]

[font="Verdana Arial Helvetica sans-serif"][size=3]Now that you've got all 14 volumes, we figured it would be handy to have a catalog of everything in them, and, more importantly, where to find what you're looking for. So this section inventories every photo, concept art, memo, script fragment and other highlights with a succinct description and reference so you know in exactly which volume of the 14 to find each of them.

But wait. There's even more.

[/size][/font][font="Verdana Arial Helvetica sans-serif"]As if it couldn't get any better, also in this volume JMS is releasing a bit of "Sleeping in Light" Holy Grail: act one of the script he used while shooting which contains his handwritten director's notes, some set illustrations and set diagrams. As an extra treat, he's also including five pages from the production draft script of "Sleeping in Light" autographed by every member of the cast and most of the crew.[/font][font="Verdana Arial Helvetica sans-serif"][size=3] [/size][/font]

[font="Verdana Arial Helvetica sans-serif"][size=3]Remember, to get the free Volume 15 you must purchase all 14 volumes, so complete your set today.

[url="http://rs6.net/tn.jsp?e=001FGXKMkKjnjjzIDEVbJOeBwO_jCcMrUicx55LarWAQqzPcIXcKIWFOZAjKc1j-RKj2_Yzejf1w7RN-GmIwCWj0xUaXn23GhRHyZIgrmn2GuinlhQuljNUcgG-hzPkKYXV"]Click here to order Volume 14[/url]
[/size][/font]
[font="Verdana Arial Helvetica sans- serif"][size=3][b]Finally, know that the 14-volume series may be over, but JMS has lots more to share. Stay tuned.[/b][/size][/font]



[b][font="Verdana Arial Helvetica sans-serif"][size=3]Thank you all from the Babylon 5 Scripts Team.[/size][/font][/b]

[/color][/size][/font][/color][/size][/font]

[Werthead]

Nice.

[b]3.17: [i]War Without End, Part II[/i]
[/b]What in the name of hell is going on in this episode? I don't think anyone knows, not even the writer. Where does Sheridan go the second time he vanishes? Why all the pissing around in blue spacesuits? Why does Delenn wander around on B4 in the spacesuit? Why, when Zathras gives her the time stabiliser, does she vanish rather than became anchored properly in time? Huh?

I still think JMS made the wrong call with putting this story in the middle of the series rather than at the end as it was supposed to be (and as it was clearly intended during the writing of [i]Babylon Squared[/i]). Enjoyment of the story is seriously compromised as it creaks under the weight of ham-fisted exposition (the reason why Sinclair ages twenty years is seriously lame), although the CGI is all very pretty. The ending is okay, although again it was guessed by lot of the fans going back to Season 1, and getting closure on the Sinclair story just as we enter the war in force is a good idea.

The best bit of the episode is the flash-forward to Centauri Prime on New Year's Day 2278. We knew previously about Londo and G'Kar killing one another and saw it briefly in [i]Coming of Shadows[/i], but now we see the context. Londo and G'Kar as old friends (Londo had had G'Kar under house arrest on Centauri Prime for something like three years by the time of their mutual demise) and G'Kar giving Londo the end he'd wished for for so long, only for the Drakh Keeper to come to life and return the favour. Powerful stuff.

[b]3.18: [i]Walkabout[/i]
[/b]Back to the current Shadow War, then. Sheridan decides to test the supposition that the Shadows are vulnerable to telepathic emissions by ambushing a Shadow warship with the [i]White Star[/i] carrying a telepath - in this case Lyta Alexander - and seeing if they can destroy it. Obviously, they succeed but a much larger Shadow fleet then shows up. Yikes! Meanwhile, the Narn cruiser that caused the shenanigans in [i]The Fall of Night[/i] shows up again, the new Vorlon ambassador Ulkesh shows up and turns out to be a bit of a bastard (even if his transport inexplicably flies up to an EVA Sheridan at the start of the episode, presumably to ask, "Which way to the docking bay, mate?") and Franklin decides to go walkabout and ends up getting laid.

A pretty good episode. Seeing the [i]White Star [/i]actually taking down a Shadow ship with its own weapons rather than having to trick one in some elaborate manner is cool, and having gotten bored of seeing Narn cruisers being cut to ribbons by Shadow vessels up to this point (I think the count was something like eleven Narn warships have been destroyed on-screen by Shadow vessels by this episode) it's great to see one dishing out some payback. The Franklin story is interesting from a character point of view, although one wonders if they could have pushed the button on it a bit earlier and not had it slowing down the pace of events with the Shadows.

Next time on the [b]B5 Wertwatch[/b]:

"XAAAAAAAAAAAAAARG!"

EDIT: Sorry, memory failure.

"ZAAAAAAAAAAAAAARN!"
"A Zarn?"
"A Zarn?"
"It's only a guy in a really, really shit rubber suit."
"Sssh! It's threatening!"

[Werthead]

Okay, I got it wrong. It was 'Zarg' after all :(
[b]
3.19: [i]Grey 17 is Missing[/i][/b]
There is some pretty nifty stuff in this episode. The Marcus/Neroon fight is pretty cool. But the whole stuff with Grey 17 disappearing and the Xarn (laaaaaame) is just pathetic and Robert Englund is a wasted guest star. The weakest episode of Season 3.

[b]3.20: [i]And the Rock Cried Out, No Hiding Place[/i][/b]
Ooh, a countdown! Z-minus 14 days. What happens at 0?

This episode is a nice exercise in book-keeping. Lots of loose threads are tidied up and the decks are cleared for the war in earnest. Londo and Refa's simmering antagonism comes to a head in a tense confrontation on the Narn homeworld, whilst Sheridan finally cracks the pattern behind the seemingly random Shadow attacks and Delenn gets to show off an entire [i]fleet [/i]of White Star-class warships. All good stuff and the tension is building nicely. Something [i]major[/i] is coming...
[b]
3.21: [i]Shadow Dancing[/i][/b]
Having worked out that the Shadows are planning to attack Sector 83, where thousands of refugee ships have fled from the fighting elsewhere, Sheridan convinces the non-aligned worlds, the Minbari and the Narn rebels to amass a huge fleet to ambush the Shadows. The plan succeeds, but at a horrific cost. Elsewhere, Franklin's spiritual quest comes to a bloody and violent conclusion.

This episode is exceptionally dark and action-packed. To those who were watching the first time around they probably thought that this was the season finale. As we get to the gargantuam space battle (which nearly rivals [i]Severed Dreams[/i]' in size) you wonder what they've got left next week to top it off. And then you get [i]that[/i] cliffhanger. Obvious, perhaps, but still dramatically powerful.

Overall, a great episode, but there are a couple of problems with it. The Franklin story is great but it would have worked better earlier in the series, or perhaps later in Season 4 or 5. It has to compete with the war story for attention and the pacing is off as a result.
[b]
3.22: [i]Z'ha'dum[/i][/b]
A very different season finale. Dark, sombre and revelatory, with a doom-laden atmosphere as Sheridan is drawn into the very heart of the Shadows' power base. The results there are dark and dramatic, culminating in a stunning conclusion as Sheridan takes (another) leap of faith, the [i]White Star[/i] is destroyed, Garibaldi is kidnapped and the Shadows receive one massive setback, with G'Kar's elegant voiceover leaving the viewer reeling and waiting for Season 4. Although, again, this worked much better in the UK where we did have to wait for [i]a year[/i] for Season 4. Owch. But what really makes the episode work is the twisted way the Shadows use Sheridan's own wife against him, which is more than a bit disturbing and twisted.

Whilst there are other episodes that I think are better overall, it may well be that the sequence starting with Sheridan pulling out his PPG and shooting the Shadow [i]in the face[/i] (fistpump!) and ending with the Shadow warships hovering above the blasted ruins of their world may be the most powerful sequence in the entire series.

When first aired the episode did suffer from two major flaws. 1: Why doesn't the Shadow homeworld have orbital defences capable of, for example, shooting down a ship trying to kamikaze its capital city? 2: How the hell did Morden survive a 1-gigaton thermonuclear blast when he was only a couple of miles away at the most? Both questions are, more or less satisfactorily, answered in the subsequent techno-mage novels.

[left][quote name='G'Kar'][i]“It was the end of the Earth year 2260 and the war had paused, suddenly and unexpectedly. All around us it was as if the universe were holding its breath, waiting. All of life can be broken down into moments of transition or moments of revelation. This had the feeling of both. G’Quan wrote: ‘There is a greater darkness than the one we fight. It is the darkness of the soul that has lost its way.’ The war we fight is not against powers and principalities, it is against chaos and despair. Greater than the death of flesh is the death of hope, the death of dreams. Against this peril we can never surrender. The future is all around us, waiting in moments of transition to be born in moments of revelation. No-one knows the shape of that future, or where it will take us. We know only that it is always born...in pain.”[/i][/quote][/left]

[Lord of Oop North]

The conclusion of [i]And the Rock Cried Out...[/i] was oh so satisfying. Seeing him getting run down like a dog was just perfect.

Your 'fistpump' moment was so spot on. I remember having a freak-out when I first saw the Shadow and Sheridan take that shot. Incredible. I also love that G'kar monologue at the end of Z'ha'dum. Very powerful.

[Ran]

Franklin's B-story in [i]Shadow Dancing[/i] has stuck in my head more than the battle, actually, so I'm not sure I ever perceived pacing problems with it. This is the episode that sticks out in my head as Biggs' finest episode. I recall someone in the earlier thread remarking negatively on his confronting himself as a hoary cliche, but I always thought it worked quite powerfully. I think someone else -- TFM? -- noted JMS has a theatrical background, and this particular story just drips the closed space of what could readily have been a two man (or one man, if one wanted to be hokey about it), staged play.

As I recall, this is the first episode where we see the Vree saucer actually fire a shot, and it turns out they throw out a barrage of something or other that chops up Shadow fighters like no one's business. I always thought they were among the coolest of the Nonaligned vessels.

So, what answer did the the Technomage series give to those two questions?

[Guest Other-in-law]

[quote name='Ran' post='1293256' date='Mar 29 2008, 20.33']So, what answer did the the Technomage series give to those two questions?[/quote]
For the planetary defense letting the white star in, Galen did it. The Shadows coralled him into taking over as the enslaved heart of the system to let the ancient Wierden (sp?), the very first technomage, die. Then he figured out how to talk to his tech and told it to ignore the White Star, more or less.

Seemed like a pretty huge retcon.

[Werthead]

I don't really like Galen as a character. For a character who was never in [b]B5[/b], it felt quite odd for JMS to shoehorn him into every single post-[b]B5[/b] project, including the novels. However, for some reason he works much better in the books. Because obviously there was a gaping plot hole in that part of the story, Galen's presence as a techno-mage (someone who uses Shadow tech and thus one of the few who could be on Z'ha'dum undetected) felt vaguely plausible.

Obviously it is a pretty big retcon, but it just about works. Although the novels don't explain why Galen isn't as badly injured by the blast as Morden is.

[Ran]

Interesting. And Morden's survival?

[Werthead]

It was an experimental piece of Shadow technology, a personal shield of some kind, that Galen used to protect himself. He found Morden, who had been wounded in the fight with Sheridan, and took pity on him and enveloped them both in the shield. Justin and Anna were both vapourised, obviously, but Galen and Morden survived.

The one thing that the novels don't elaborate on is where Justin came from. He just seems to be a smarter-than-average random guy the Shadows picked up as an agent. We see a bit more of him - he oversees Anna's reconditioning after they pull her out of her Shadow ship - but don't learn any more about his background.

[Jon AS]

[quote name='Werthead'][b]3.20: [i]And the Rock Cried Out, No Hiding Place[/i][/b][i] [/i][/quote]

The ending sequence with the murder intercut with the singing in the church is awesome. And disturbing.

[quote name='Werthead'][b]
3.21: [i]Shadow Dancing[/i][/b][i] [/i][/quote]

[quote name='Ran']Franklin's B-story in [i]Shadow Dancing[/i] has stuck in my head more than the battle, actually, so I'm not sure I ever perceived pacing problems with it. This is the episode that sticks out in my head as Biggs' finest episode. I recall someone in the earlier thread remarking negatively on his confronting himself as a hoary cliche, but I always thought it worked quite powerfully.[/quote]

Like Ran, I really like the Franklin story, and I also think that once the concepts of "Walkabout" and "meeting himself" were introduced a scene like that became inevitable. What would have worked better? Franklin talking to thin air? Or taking the Star Trek route and have his subconscious confront him in the shape of his colleagues?

[quote name='Werthead'][b]3.22: [i]Z'ha'dum[/i][/b][i] [/i][/quote]

I think, as B5 was the first series I followed this closely, this was my first introduction to the dreaded "season ending cliffhanger". I couldn't believe that this was going to be the finale.

It took over a year before the show returned in Germany, and I think that, in combination with me leaving on a student exchange, let to me not following the last 1.5 seasons very closely. Luckily today I have the DVDs.

[quote name='Werthead']The one thing that the novels don't elaborate on is where Justin came from.[/quote]

This is one piece of information I would have liked to have. Was he somehow tied to Clark? etc.

[mandy_k]

Does anyone know how Sheridan and Anna got to Z'ha'dum alone on board the White Star - I thought the White Star required a crew?

[Jon AS]

The ship seems to have extremely advanced computer systems. And considering that even when their are more people aboard, all functions of the ship seem to be controlled by 2-3 main cast members, it's anyone's guess what exactly all those Minbari in the background are supposed to be doing.

[Werthead]

[quote name='mandy_k' post='1293526' date='Mar 30 2008, 11.21']Does anyone know how Sheridan and Anna got to Z'ha'dum alone on board the White Star - I thought the White Star required a crew?[/quote]

Most of the stuff is computer-controlled. I think they only really need the crew if they're going into battle and the automatic systems are likely to be damaged. If you're just flying from Point A to Point B you don't need a crew at all. Remember Sheridan's personal White Star in [i]Sleeping in Light[/i] also doesn't need a crew.

[mandy_k]

I was asking because recently I re-read the Marcus-shortstory by JMS, and in that it is mentioned that the White Star requires a crew. (" In his time, the White Star had been the smallest ship capable of jumping into hyperspace without the aid of a jump gate, and even that still required a fairly substantial crew.")
Biut you're right, in SiL Sheridan is also alone, as I recall. Continuity glitch, I guess.

[Ran]

Sheridan's ship wasn't quite a [i]White Star[/i], IIRC -- it was a smaller, personal transport version. If the person quoted is Marcus, I suppose by SiL they could have ships that could handle jumps without large crews.

I expect the quote itself, re: White Stars, does indicate a glitch though.

[Werthead]

I don't really see a glitch myself. The [i]White Star[/i] must have an autopilot. We know it has a fairly advanced (presumably Minbari) computer system. All it has to do is generate two jump points and follow the beacons in between the Epsilon Eridani system and Z'ha'dum's system. If it had gotten into major combat operations, yeah a crew would definitely have been required. The weapons and navigation consoles are seperate from one another.

I think an analogy is when Kirk took the [i]Enterprise[/i] out with just a tiny crew in[i] Star Trek III[/i]. Flying from point to point was okay but the second they got into a combat situation with Kruge's bird of prey, the lack of the 400 other crewmembers really told.

Something that confused me much more is how that it takes 3 days to cross the 15 light-years from Epsilon Eridani to Sol in [i]Messages from Earth[/i] but only 2 days to cross the 20,000 light-years from Epsilon Eridani to Z'ha'dum (on the Galactic Rim)? I remember JMS being asked about this and saying something about it not being the Galactic Rim but merely 'the Rim of Known Space', but then later on changing his mind. Or just getting confused. Luckily the get-out clause, "Travel in hyperspace is weird" can be used to explain away this one ;)

[mandy_k]

Well, with the White Star we can always say that Marcus' memory suffered during the 300 years in cryogenics. In this story, it seems he's partially lost his mind anyway. ;)

As for the astronomy, [url="http://chronology.org/noframes/b-five/astronomy.html"]the Chronology site[/url] has tried to figure things out, and come to the conclusion that astronomy is not Joethras' skill. :)

[Horus Ex Machina]

[quote name='Blanc de Wert '79' post='1293626' date='Mar 30 2008, 08.46']... I remember JMS being asked about this and saying something about it not being the Galactic Rim but merely 'the Rim of Known Space', but then later on changing his mind. Or just getting confused...[/quote]It was partly a matter of him being caught in a series of contradictions. He claimed that it was the rim of known space yet in an episode we see Morden and Londo Mollari divvying up the entire galaxy on a holographic map.