I don't understand cars

[Brother Wolf]

I like to look at high-end cars, but in reality, my practical side rules. My 12 year old Cherokee without power windows/locks has been super stable and gets me where I need to go. I've never had a lot of the "conveniences" so I don't really miss them. This is the first car I've had that had working A/C (and I spent the first 22 years of my life in LA/MISS) and a working cassette player (yeah - I said "cassette"). I'd like better MPG, but it does better than a lot of things I see advertised these days. I plan on driving this thing until it drops; and when it does, I will be sad.

[Vethnar]

It's just something some people like. A well designed car is a beautiful thing. Are These Not Beautiful?

No, they're not.

Cars are ugly. They make an awful lot of noise. They emit poisonous gases. They kill and cripple people every day. In short, they're evil.

I understand why cars are useful or even necessary for a lot of people, but how anyone can actually like them is beyond me. It's hard to think of any form of modern, non-military technology I hate more. It's not just the cars by themselves, but also how all the infrastructure required to make cars work -- like the big roads, the parking lots, and the gas stations -- makes our entire civilization visually appalling.

[Eponine]

We had 80" of snow this year and I never got stuck once (and we don't own a snow blower, but we will this winter. But I also drive a manual transmission and figure that is why I didn't get stuck

I didn't have trouble with 2WD when it snowed in Virginia (rarely) or Michigan (frequently), but I didn't live on the side of a mountain then either. The Elantra didn't do that well at one of my places where I had to make a turn through snow drifts at the top of a hill, and getting to my house now is like 10 of those. Maybe it's a difference in the snow texture too?

[naz]

I wonder if the people who are so utilitarian about cars (not that it's bad thing) feel the same way towards other things in their life. Like homes, appliances, clothing, books, etc. Do you also just want those things to fulfill their function and nothing else? E.g., do you want your house to just provide shelter? Do you want your clothing to just cover your nakedness? Do you want your books just interesting enough to pass the time?

What I'm getting at is that most people have some desire or another that goes beyond simple functionality. A desire that fulfills more than a simple need. Take Lany, for example. I happen to know that she's a good cook; she likes cooking (especially for others). Why? Because it probably interests her, and she gets a certain satisfaction from it that compels her to do more than make just any old meal. Cooking, for her, probably fulfills a desire that goes beyond preparing a meal simply for sustenance. Me, I personally hate cooking. While I certainly love good food, I don't care enough to make the extra effort if I have to make it myself. I'm just not interested in cooking. So I'm perfectly happy with a peanut butter sandwich for dinner. If I want something more or I want to feed others and there's no one around to make it for me, I simply order out.

Same thing can be applied to cars. Some people just like driving. They like a car to fulfill more than just the need to get from Point A to Point B. To them, driving is an experience. That's not to say they're all Mario Andretti's, but certainly there are certain cars and automotive choices we identify with more than others... even if we're just using it to commute to work.

My last car was an Acura TL and I loved it. Did I get to take advantage of it as often as I liked? Probably not... most of my driving was on urban or suburban roads. But even when I was driving it just to get to work, at least it made even that experience more enjoyable. And if a car can make something slightly extraordinary out the mundane, then why not?

Anyway, I hope that explains why cars are more than just functional for so many people. It doesn't necessarily have to do with rampant consumerism or the need to drive 160 mph. It's just adding an experiential value to an otherwise commonplace existence. Some people look for it in clothes, some in food or cooking.... and some find it in cars.

[Greywolf2375]

No, they're not.

Cars are ugly. They make an awful lot of noise. They emit poisonous gases. They kill and cripple people every day. In short, they're evil.

I understand why cars are useful or even necessary for a lot of people, but how anyone can actually like them is beyond me. It's hard to think of any form of modern, non-military technology I hate more. It's not just the cars by themselves, but also how all the infrastructure required to make cars work -- like the big roads, the parking lots, and the gas stations -- makes our entire civilization visually appalling.

And in my eyes those are gorgeous - the engineering and lines of the cars are truly something to behold. Driving is fun, I can't quite consider it a hobby, but I enjoy the experience of driving vehicles.

And unless it is Christine, a car really can't be "evil".

[Jaime L]

Honestly, I'm a bit surprised at the overwhelming negativity and at best apathy people in this thread have to cars. Yes, the car culture creates its share of negatives, and I'd agree with almost all of them. Just like I'd agree the internet has its share of negatives, as do cell phones and planes and just about any technology that's become ubiquitous over the last century.

But even the sentiment of cars solely as a tool. Just seems like a kind of blah way to look at them. Is your home just a shelter?

No, they're not.

Cars are ugly. They make an awful lot of noise. They emit poisonous gases. They kill and cripple people every day. In short, they're evil.

Well, that settles that.

And unless it is Christine, a car really can't be "evil".

In fairness, many cars in the 70s were pure evil. Patrolling desert highways driverless, seeking out victims. Think it was the second leading cause of death back then after malaise.

ETA: What Naz said. That Argentinian bastard is right on.

[DanteGabriel]

I managed to survive into my 33rd year without having a regular vehicle of my own. I was all kinds of resentful about not being able to have a car when I was a teenager, but I got through early adulthood just fine without it. When I changed jobs a few weeks ago and my commute went from a 4-mile journey with convenient public transportation to a 24-mile journey with no viable public transport, I had to get myself on the road.

So I'm kind of a virgin to the whole daily driving commute thing. I'm quite enjoying it. I wasn't incredibly anti-car before -- I just didn't want to spend the money or assume the additional responsibility required. But now that I've taken the plunge, I do enjoy the freedom of being on the road, of being able to go somewhere at a moment's notice if the mood strikes me. My commute is on state routes and the roads are pretty tranquil, and some of the neighborhoods I drive through are beautiful.

I'm developing quite a bit of affection for the car. It's old and it's had some dings and it ain't pretty, but it gets me where I need to go and it's small and agile enough that I can squeeze through tight spots. I like having my Amoeba Music "Peace Through Music" bumper sticker on the back and the little Ganesha figurine my friend gave me for the dash. I don't need a car to express my personality, but I'm not afraid of expressing my personality through the car. Also, I LOVE LOVE LOVE smoking in my car, especially with some nice tunes on the stereo. The degree to which I enjoy smoking in the car will probably make it that much more difficult to quit. And I won't even start on the amount of time and attention I've devoted to making road mix CDs (the stereo plays MP3 CDs but doesn't have an iPod jack).

I have yet to find myself wishing for an SUV or some hot expensive car, though I can see the argument for value over time in getting a Mercedes or BMW. I'm driving an old Altima I bought from a friend now, and it seems likely that I'll just want a newer version when I choose to upgrade -- which I think will be for a 3-5 year old car. I don't see much point in buying new.

[Pinwheel]

Like Bellis, All White Lightning and a few others, I've spent most of my adult life without a car. I didn't get my license until I was 23. I lived downtown in cities with public transit and I used buses and trains for long trips.

It was a pain sometimes -- grocery shopping meant limiting myself to whatever I could carry, and nothing could be spontaneous (except for in Philly, NYC, and London, most city buses don't come along every few minutes so I had to wait for up to an hour to go somewhere sometimes).

I was forced to buy a car last year because my office moved across town and I could no longer hop one bus in the morning. It was fun at first -- I can buy stuff in bulk! I can go somewhere on a whim late at night!

But now I'm certain that driving has made me much more stressed out and unhappy. I used to sit on the bus and listen to music while looking out the window. Now I can't relax or look at scenery, because I'm surrounded by morons on cell phones, so I get to work all frazzled.

It used to be that my biggest problem with drivers is that they don't respect pedestrians (I used to carry a big umbrella and glower at any car who dared to ignore my right of way when I was on foot -- any jackass who tried to bump me got the finger and I would shake my umbrella at them). Now I see they don't respect *anybody*. I know it's silly and I should lighten up, but it's just depressing.

So my next move will be to a place on a direct bus line to my work. I'll save the car for long trips and grocery shopping. I can't wait.

Also, I learned that in America, unless you live in a huge city, people think that if you don't drive it must be because you've had your license revoked. I realized that most people assumed I was a convicted drunk driver when I told them I take the bus. :ohwell:

[naz]

I also want to add that there's often an intrinsic value simply to 'good design' that goes beyond even the experiential aspect that I mentioned earlier. There's an aesthetic appeal or an engineering innovation that just strikes a chord with some people (those who care, anyway). As a designer, I'm probably more biased towards this view, yet I don't think this appeal is limited to us designers. In fact, I'd say that *all* people, to some extent, are affected by simple aesthetics or the way something is designed.

For example, if you're uninterested in cars, you probably won't be shopping for an Aston Martin or a Karmann Ghia. But at the same time, you're probably not going to buy a car that you find particularly ugly, are you? Just because it gets you from A to B? I doubt it. Even those who claim the utmost indifference to a car's design, will probably still be affected by some design decisions, even if it's just the color.

Of course, a lot of that has to do with having a plethora of choices in a diverse market, and that probably *does* say something about consumerism in our respective cultures, but think about it... even if you buy a car simply for reliability or convenience, even that is a design decision made by someone. A reliable yet boring car was probably designed specifically to be that way, in order to appeal to someone just like you. So yes... there's something more than just functionality there.

[MercenaryChef]

firstly, i take the train every single day to and from work. i drive my auto no less more than once a week. it has been a fantastic car for me. i drove my 2001 suzuki vitara from oregon to maryland last summer and then from maryland to canada in the spring. the vehicle has been just a workhorse for me, despite the lack of power windows, ac and the like i love it.

my wife on the other hand has a lovely and sexy sports coupe that i simply adore. it is sleek, it is fast, powerful and likes to be driven.

does someone really need to have a fast car? probably not. but, it is something if you can afford and you feel you will enjoy it, go for it. for me, you only live once. may as well enjoy life. it is not for everyone. some people like a giant tv. some people fill their closets with nice clothes and shoes. some people like to eat expensive meals.

[Tears of Lys]

With the generalized apathy I've read about thus far regarding people and their cars, the very idea of providing a beautiful place for your ride of choice to reside will probably strike most here as the epitome of decadence and waste. My husband is about to expend a great deal of effort (his and MINE) to clear out the garage and put in a special flooring for the objects of his affection to reside.

I'd be completely exasperated, only he spends an equal amount on making sure OUR domicile is habitable too. :)

[Blaine]

I love cars. But I'm more of an SUV person. And when I say SUV, I don't mean giant grocery getting wagon, I mean actual vehicles used for sports and utilities. I've never had or needed a V8 engine, so I've been able to stay mid-size and still pull trailers or go offroad in 4WD whenever I need to. I've had Bronco II, a pickup and an Xterra.

My last buy was a Honda Element that I loved quite a bit, despite it's lack of 4WD capability. It's able to haul stuff all day long and the 4cyl engine gets better mileage. However, once we had the baby, it was obvious my Element makes a better family car, so I got stuck driving my wife's Volkswagen Cabrio. Which means I drive around looking like the world oldest, ugliest and surliest high school senior girl ever.

So now I'm finally getting rid of the Cabrio and buying what I've wanted since I was 16, a Jeep Wrangler. I'm psyched. I haven't been able to offroad or camp in my own vehicle for almost 10 years now. Also, the one good thing about the Cabrio was it's convertible top. And the new 4 door Jeeps have plenty of room in the back for the kid. So I'm getting the best of all worlds.

Heading to the dealership next weekend, if all goes to plan.

[S John]

Honestly, I'm a bit surprised at the overwhelming negativity and at best apathy people in this thread have to cars. Yes, the car culture creates its share of negatives, and I'd agree with almost all of them. Just like I'd agree the internet has its share of negatives, as do cell phones and planes and just about any technology that's become ubiquitous over the last century.

But even the sentiment of cars solely as a tool. Just seems like a kind of blah way to look at them. Is your home just a shelter?

I feel the need to clarify my stance a bit. When I say that I've never been 'much of a car guy' I mean that I don't buy car magazines, that I don't usually go to car shows, I am not familiar with all the classic makes and models, and that I don't rebuild engines in my spare time (though I do think that would be awesome). I have a couple cousins who are definitely car guys. We'll be driving around and they'll say, 'hey man did you see that '73 Chevy Nova that we just passed?' And I'll say, 'I think I saw a red car.' That doesn't mean I don't have appreciation, just that I have less than encyclopedic knowledge about them, and I tend to approach the kind of car I own from a practical standpoint.

As far as car ownership in general though, I'm all about it. Can't see myself without one. Public transportation is all well and good, and I certainly make use of it, but I don't think I can give up the ability to choose my own route on my own schedule. Just where some people would prefer a Mercedes or a Porche, or a Corvette I would rather have this or this, maybe one of these on the side.

[Lany Freelove Cassandra]

I wonder if the people who are so utilitarian about cars (not that it's bad thing) feel the same way towards other things in their life. Like homes, appliances, clothing, books, etc. Do you also just want those things to fulfill their function and nothing else? E.g., do you want your house to just provide shelter? Do you want your clothing to just cover your nakedness? Do you want your books just interesting enough to pass the time?

I still only have the builder issued stove though :crying: Yes, I am that way with most things. I make a list of the functions an items needs to fill and then I go for the most practical model of that item. Doesn't mean I haven't drooled over an 8 burner, 2 oven plus warming tray stove.

I honestly care nothing for name brands and labels. I shop sales at the already cheap places.

My one indulgance is my house. I wanted a yard and a decent neighborhood, and in the NE those two things do cost. The house is mid-sized to small (by American standards) at only 1800 sq ft, so even though it was more than the basics, it was still not way over the top.

And I have found I love cheesey urban fantasy books (especially the mysteries) so I can answer yes to the last question too, even though I'd not recommend them to many I know (they are like my Nora Roberts---just good enough to pass the time)

I am trying to be more commercialized, but I swear there is a practical reason: all these cheesey books that I can read in an afternoon are piling up all over the house, so I actually need a nook so I can spend less on the books and not clutter my house with them.

(Books like GRRMs still are required in hardback---everyone should have a vice)

[Insert Edit]

I didn't have trouble with 2WD when it snowed in Virginia (rarely) or Michigan (frequently), but I didn't live on the side of a mountain then either. The Elantra didn't do that well at one of my places where I had to make a turn through snow drifts at the top of a hill, and getting to my house now is like 10 of those. Maybe it's a difference in the snow texture too?

Drifting is usually what gets you. The place I'm renting has a LONG driveway, and the snow tends to drift right across it. So sure there's only 10 cm of snow, but it's drifted 40cm high in my driveway. A lighter 2wd car ain't going to make that.

[Jaime L]

I feel the need to clarify my stance a bit. When I say that I've never been 'much of a car guy' I mean that I don't buy car magazines, that I don't usually go to car shows, I am not familiar with all the classic makes and models, and that I don't rebuild engines in my spare time (though I do think that would be awesome). I have a couple cousins who are definitely car guys. We'll be driving around and they'll say, 'hey man did you see that '73 Chevy Nova that we just passed?' And I'll say, 'I think I saw a red car.' That doesn't mean I don't have appreciation, just that I have less than encyclopedic knowledge about them, and I tend to approach the kind of car I own from a practical standpoint.

As far as car ownership in general though, I'm all about it. Can't see myself without one. Public transportation is all well and good, and I certainly make use of it, but I don't think I can give up the ability to choose my own route on my own schedule. Just where some people would prefer a Mercedes or a Porche, or a Corvette I would rather have this or this, maybe one of these on the side.

Yeah, I'm the same way. There was a time where I dreamt of sports cars and would scope out other people's rides. Still do occasionally if there's something super rare like a Lotus Elise or a Lamborghini but that's about all that catches my eye. Now I have no clue what I'd want my next car to be. Hoping this one lasts long enough that there's an affordable, reliable electric car I can buy but that's about the extent of extravagant features I'd target. There's nothing I really want. All the luxury cars look kinda soulless to me. So do most of the mid tier sedans to be honest.

But like you, I appreciate more of the universal aspects of cars, the freedom and independence they provide, rather than what a specific model offers. And like Naz, occasionally I do marvel at what incredible machines they are.

[kairparavel]

We had 80" of snow this year and I never got stuck once (and we don't own a snow blower, but we will this winter. But I also drive a manual transmission and figure that is why I didn't get stuck

I never imagined in a million years there would be this much snow here. I drove MC's Suzuki a lot this winter. Argh.

I love to drive* and a good car is essential to having a positve experience.

(*with the exception of commuting to work, which, fortunately I barely have to drive as the park-n-ride for my bus is only 2 miles from my house)

I do a lot of driving, most of it highway. A lot of my driving is around the DC Beltway. I got tired of hitting the gas pedal on my Civic and having absolutely nothing happen as I was changing lanes, only to have some large vehicle up my ass just as the car decided that yes, it would accelerate a little. So I wanted something with some balls while traveling 270/495/95/66. I was originally looking at a brand new Lexus but really, that kind of money seemed irresponsible to me. So I bought a pre-owned Infiniti, two years old, low mileage, for what a brand new Accord/Camry/Legacy would cost. And it's worth every penny when I hit the gas and blow by people.

I've done a lot of driving since getting my license some 22 years ago. To and from school. To and from sports practices and games. Weekend tournaments all over the province. To and from work. Weekends at the cottage. Road trips to my friends seven hours away. Two and from Northern Ontario, seventeen hours each way. To and from my family, between nine and twelve hours each way. For stuff like that, you need a vehicle that will do just more than point A and point B on occasion. If you're going to spend that much time in a vehicle, you need to at least like it if not love it, and have some creature comforts like air, a good stereo and cruise. I can understand the views of people who aren't that into cars, but for me, much of what I do depends on one to get me places so, I care more about what I'm driving.

[kungtotte]

Wheels, a steering-wheel, seats, a windshield, these are the things that a car needs, but what a car is, what a car really is, is freedom.

[DanteGabriel]

Wheels, a steering-wheel, seats, a windshield, these are the things that a car needs, but what a car is, what a car really is, is freedom.

Nah, it just makes you a slave of the petrochemical cartel. :P

[kungtotte]

A diesel car can be converted to run on fryer oil.