Eye of the World

[Rhaegon Targaryen]

As I said in another thread, the aiel seem based on pre-Christian Irish society, with elements of Native American and Japanese culture mixed in. Sept, clan based, chiefs chosen on merit(taoisigh) even the buckers and spears were Irish style weapons and a constant low level feuding, cattle raiding culture occasionally erupting into full battles and longer wars, vicious bloodfeuds among them though they would ultimately acknowledge themselves of the same nation, Ji' e' toh like Brehon laws, high prevalence of red hair, glorifying warrior culture, feats of strength, etc.etc. Even the names can sound Irish eg Rhuarc.

The Spartans were a pretty warlike culture but they also had a population of slaves/serfs who did all the work for them called helots who outnumbered them for most of Spartan history.

[Doug LeBeau]

You have to read EoW to get to the terrific middle books. TGS was good, but I expect that was Sanderson, by the time Jordan had died the books had become bogged down in exposition.

Almost every fantasy novel feels like a rip off of the Lord of the Rings, but only if that's as far back as you go. The Lord of the Rings rips off tons of mythology. It is no great surprise, and no great condemnation that such things happen. We base everything we do off of things learned over the course of our lives, whether we will it or no.

I enjoyed EoW more after I had read the later books. I suggest you keep up with it.

[elmis]

Haha, I love me a Wheel of Time thread! :D

[Lightning Lord]

Haha, I love me a Wheel of Time thread! :D

You must be quite pleased, there are three going on right now, though this one is dying off.

Upset...want new book... must begin disagreeing with fionwe... :)

[Edward the Great]

I've spent some time thinking about this series because if Robert Jordan can get wealthy off of a rambling mediocrity, why can't I do the same?

I think Wheel of Time is a superhero story with flawed superheros. The superheros may have temporary setbacks, but still attain great fame and power. Think of the Aes Sedai as a dysfunctional Justice League.

I'm digressing a bit into the 12th book, but Rand's character reminds me partially of Superman and partially of the Supreme Commander of all Forces from the Mister Neutron episode of Monty Python's Flying Circus. Like Superman, Rand isn't absolutely indestructable, he had kryptonite or something jammed into his side and it is a wound from which he can never completely recover.

Two things that are missing to give the story a proper fantasy atmosphere - the main characters don't really suffer, because their paths to greatness are never really derailed, or even frustrated. Aragorn, although he got one of the greatest pieces of ass in history, was about 100 years old before he got it. Also, partially because the story is set in a civilization in a long term recovery from a post apocalyptic event, you don't get the feeling that things will be lost that will never be attained again like you did in Lord of the Rings. In fact, the characters start to rediscover things that have been lost for thousands of years.

However, I see there is a graphic novel version of this story, and I'm curious if it's better than the books. I would expect the story to work better in that format. Also, it is really a graphic novel? I.e., does it use glue instead of staples for the binding and does it lack advertising? If so, it would be classified as a book. I found that out when a postal worker told me the Akira graphic novels would qualify for media mail.

[Old Nan]

I'm really bemused by the fact that you've read only the first and twelfth books of a (so-far) 13-book series and are criticizing major elements of the overall plot.

And this: "the main characters don't really suffer, because their paths to greatness are never really derailed, or even frustrated" is a very peculiar, almost Marxist-materialist, view of both suffering and one of the two books you have read.

[Edward the Great]

And this: "the main characters don't really suffer, because their paths to greatness are never really derailed, or even frustrated" is a very peculiar, almost Marxist-materialist, view of both suffering and one of the two books you have read.

How can it be Marxist-materialist when I'm including their personal lives? Are we supposed to go boo hoo hoo because Rand never consummates his relationship with Egwene? The dude gets to impregnate 3 women, one of whom is royalty.

[Horza]

That's strange, I found Edward's analysis to be overtly Lacanian-Baudrilliardian in its insistance on a hermeneutic phenomenonology wherein the extrinsic interpollation of the Other reverses the heteronormativity of agape through much sniffing and tugging of braids.

[Wras]

That's strange, I found Edward's analysis to be overtly Lacanian-Baudrilliardian in its insistance on a hermeneutic phenomenonology wherein the extrinsic interpollation of the Other reverses the heteronormativity of agape through much sniffing and tugging of braids.

I did not understand a one word of that, sir.

[Old Nan]

How can it be Marxist-materialist when I'm including their personal lives? Are we supposed to go boo hoo hoo because Rand never consummates his relationship with Egwene? The dude gets to impregnate 3 women, one of whom is royalty.

All I'm saying that your definition of suffering based on what material rewards one gets and what social position one ends up assigned to rather than what pain one feels is a very strange one. I have no idea why you're bringing up Rand's sex life.

[Horza]

I did not understand a one word of that, sir.

If I wanted you to understand I would have explained it better. ;)

[Crazydog7]

I must have sat down to read book 1 like 10 times. I read Book three but never much cared for the rest of the books.

[aidan]

I've started re-reading the series, in preparation for A Memory of Light and have posted my review of The Eye of the World, for those interested.

As impressive as Jordan's foreshadowing and general structural forethought was, it's clear that The Eye of the World had Jordan exploring his universe and lore as surely as the hill-billies from Emond's Field. It's a very different novel from those that follow, but its simple nature and lighter world-building are surely keys to the series' long-term success. The smoke of my youth has long cleared, and it's pretty clear to me now that Robert Jordan, at least near the beginning of his career, is more accomplished than many of the other authors I was reading at the same time. Really, I wasn't sure what to expect when I jumped back into The Eye of the World, my tastes (not to mention my emotional maturity and personality) have changed so drastically since the first read that in many ways it felt like I was tackling the novel again for the first time. But, just like last time, the urge to head straight from The Eye of the World to The Great Hunt is too compelling to ignore. Say anything for Robert Jordan, but at least give him credit for writing wonderful endings. Let's just hope I don't burn myself out again.

Full review HERE.

[Stego]

Is this the new trend around here? bashing WOT to look kewl? I personally think the series are great, additionally I think its stupid for the kind of reader who starts an epic fantasy with the 12th book to bitch about shit they donno.

It's an old school trend. But I shit right back on it. Robert Jordan was a great fantasy author. Not the best, but very, very good.

A lot of not-so-well-read folks who read WoT and ASOIAF tend to disparage WoT in comparison. I can see the opinion, but I don't understand the need to disparage one to uplift the other. (Hence, I hate all the 'vs.' threads, but I will do it for the sake of comedy...)

I'm digressing. There would be no ASOIAF without Robert Jordan, IMO. Ran and I have argued about this before. I've heard the other opinions. Sure... all well, and good. I still believe it to be true. Without Jordan there would be no proof that something other than Tolkien and Tolkien pastiches were commercially successful, and so George may have redoubled his efforts in Hollywood.

Certainly fantasy would not look as it does today without his contributions.

[Guy Kilmore]

It's an old school trend. But I shit right back on it. Robert Jordan was a great fantasy author. Not the best, but very, very good.

A lot of not-so-well-read folks who read WoT and ASOIAF tend to disparage WoT in comparison. I can see the opinion, but I don't understand the need to disparage one to uplift the other. (Hence, I hate all the 'vs.' threads, but I will do it for the sake of comedy...)

I'm digressing. There would be no ASOIAF without Robert Jordan, IMO. Ran and I have argued about this before. I've heard the other opinions. Sure... all well, and good. I still believe it to be true. Without Jordan there would be no proof that something other than Tolkien and Tolkien pastiches were commercially successful, and so George may have redoubled his efforts in Hollywood.

Certainly fantasy would not look as it does today without his contributions.

I agree and I think this gets lost in some of the critques of the series.

[Guy Kilmore]

It's an old school trend. But I shit right back on it. Robert Jordan was a great fantasy author. Not the best, but very, very good.

A lot of not-so-well-read folks who read WoT and ASOIAF tend to disparage WoT in comparison. I can see the opinion, but I don't understand the need to disparage one to uplift the other. (Hence, I hate all the 'vs.' threads, but I will do it for the sake of comedy...)

I'm digressing. There would be no ASOIAF without Robert Jordan, IMO. Ran and I have argued about this before. I've heard the other opinions. Sure... all well, and good. I still believe it to be true. Without Jordan there would be no proof that something other than Tolkien and Tolkien pastiches were commercially successful, and so George may have redoubled his efforts in Hollywood.

Certainly fantasy would not look as it does today without his contributions.

I agree and I think this gets lost in some of the critques of the series.

[elmis]

Stego is right, but some of the books are horrible. Crossroads of Twilight is 700 pages nothing.

People can hate on the Eye of the World all they want, I like that book. It is exciting, the world is exceptionally well made. It's very Tolkienesque, which doesn't bother me at all. If you're going to steal from someone, at least steal from someone good, and that's what's been done, also sometimes classic fantasy is just what you're in the mood for, at least I am.

It appears to me that it helps to be not too well read before you start with the Eye of the World - at least that is what I'm seeing from the people who start the series after having read basically every other fantasy book out there.

EDIT: Guy Kilmore, your avatar is awesome.

[alguien]

the main characters don't really suffer,

Dude, just stop now. You've read 2 of the 12 books and you're embarrassing yourself.

[alguien]

I'm digressing. There would be no ASOIAF without Robert Jordan, IMO. Ran and I have argued about this before. I've heard the other opinions. Sure... all well, and good. I still believe it to be true. Without Jordan there would be no proof that something other than Tolkien and Tolkien pastiches were commercially successful, and so George may have redoubled his efforts in Hollywood.

Certainly fantasy would not look as it does today without his contributions.

The reason I picked up Game of Thrones was the "Its brilliant" quote I read from Robert Jordan on its paperback front cover, all those years ago.

I remember GRRM mentioning this with gratitude after Jordan passed away.

[Edward the Great]

I have no idea why you're bringing up Rand's sex life.

Because if someone attains great success in their professional and personal life then harping on their setbacks just makes them whiny spoiled brats who need a good spanking.

However, I forgot about Lews Therin talking in Rand's head when I wrote that. That was a good idea and that was real sufferring.