Reviewing the Season 2 Bluray Set

[Brendan Moody]

Amazon has a Preorder Price Guarantee that refunds the difference if people ordered at a higher price than what the item goes for on the release day, so those who were charged more than the current $30/$25 will get a credit posted to their payment method within a few days.

I picked up the set at Target today, where they have an exclusive version with a bonus Blu-ray featuring a George R. R. Martin interview. Walmart also has a version with a bonus disc; the featurette there is on the visual effects.

[The Flaying Man]

agreed, while i wasn't too much a fan of the change in Renly's character, only declaring because of Loras, not being the cocky, ambitious guy he was in the book (though i love Gethin Anthony), those changes were already shown to us in season one. this scene didn't further change what we already knew.

I suppose what I meant was that it emphasises those altered traits of Renly's more...which I'm not too fond of. I also love Gethin Anthony, he's great :)

[Kittykatknits]

What did you ladies think? Tyrion, why.

I liked it better the second time, Sophie and Rory are great as always, getting across that the two characters both saw right through each other.

Screencaps of the scene look great.

Then Tyrion came along out of the blue. The same triangle dynamic at the end of the rescue scene, but then they gave the Hound a great comeback.

Because it has become the Tyrion appreciation show. Seriously Tyrion can do no wrong is getting ridiculous.

God knows why they are building up the Sansa / Tyrion thing (well I suspect because it's end game and they want to make Tyrion into a hero) but c'est la vie.

I'm not convinced that Tyrion/Sansa are endgame. Depends on how much wish fulfillment we get with Tyrion later in the scene.

But, the Tyrion thing ruined it for me. We had more time on his face than the actual dialogue in that scene. Seriously, this show is turning in to the Tyrion appreciation hour, starring Tyrion Lannister and a few other people who don't really matter. In this week's episode, Tyrion is the hero again.

I was enjoying the scene until Tyrion came along. Why?!? I didn't think it was possible for a deleted scene to give me further negative impressions of the show but I got proved wrong again.

Also, the Doreah/Irri scene was bad, I'm glad it got cut. I don't want to watch any more after that.

[Kittykatknits]

To correct my earlier post, it seems that the Sansa/Sandor deleted scene came out of 2x03 and not 2x04. That actually makes more sense, if the scene was intended to fall after Sansa's horrible dinner with Cersei and before Shae shows up as her handmaid: Sansa is upset in the deleted scene at the beginning because she's just been emotionally tortured by Cersei, and Tyrion showing up is a nod to Shae showing up in the next scene as Sansa's handmaid. So this explains not only how Tyrion got the idea to ask Shae to be Sansa's handmaid (he sees one of Sansa's handmaids hustle by and you can see the wheels turning), but also why Sansa's so on edge around Shae: not only has she been put through the wringer by Cersei, she's also had to deal with the Hound. The "missing scene" explains a lot, actually.

So I guess Bryan Cogman wrote the scene and not Vanessa Taylor.

Thanks for the explanation although I'm not sure it makes me feel much better. It gives some context but I'm still frustrated with the Tyrion appearance. It feels like season two was incapable of having anything in KL without Tyrion. And did they really need to spend as much time on his face as their actual dialogue?

[Newstar]

Thanks for the explanation although I'm not sure it makes me feel much better. It gives some context but I'm still frustrated with the Tyrion appearance. It feels like season two was incapable of having anything in KL without Tyrion. And did they really need to spend as much time on his face as their actual dialogue?

There are actually four related scenes from 2x03 (including the deleted scene, again, assuming I'm right and the scene came from 2x03). The three aired scenes aired back to back in 2x03:

Scene 1: Tyrion and Shae discuss finding something for Shae to do.

Scene 2: Sansa suffers through the dinner from hell while Cersei needles her.

(Scene 3, deleted): Sansa, upset from the dinner, is on her way back to her chambers when she bumps into the Hound. The Hound gives her a bit of a hard time, further adding to her agitation and emotional distress (although she pulls it together in the moment to stand up to the Hound). Tyrion shows up and as Sansa enters her room, he notices a handmaiden hustling by. You can see the wheels turning in Tyrion's head.

Scene 4: Sansa is preparing for bed, Shae shows up as her new handmaid, and Sansa gets upset. Sansa losing it a bit on Shae at this point is doubly understandable now that she's been hassled by both Cersei and the Hound in the space of one evening and probably wants nothing more than to crawl into bed without being bothered by anyone else.

The way I see it, this deleted scene, as well as providing insight into the Sandor/Sansa dynamic (and explaining where the line "You won't hurt me" from 2x09 came from), served as a bit of connective tissue to get us to where the writers wanted to end up (Shae as Sansa's handmaid), and Tyrion figured into that. So his showing up wasn't actually random in context at all: he needed to show up for the writers to show where he got the idea to place Shae with Sansa. It's not critical, but it does explain a fair bit. It also ties the scenes which did air together.

Interesting that Sansa straight-up refuses to sing for the Hound here, which never happened in the books (I kind of like the Hound shrinking back after she says she doesn't know any songs, like "Damn, girl," ha!). Maybe she was supposed to go back on this and sing for him in 2x09? I know there were supposed to be two alternate takes of the Blackwater Sandor/Sansa scene, so maybe she sang in one (or both) of them. (ETA: Scratch that, it seems from reports about the Blackwater 2x09 commentary track that there was a take where Sansa sang the same song she sang earlier with the women, but they cut it.)

[Lord Godric]

I actually don't have a problem with any of the scenes with the exception of the Doreah/Irri one. The Loras/Renly one is a great behind the scenes shot of the Tyrells and I really hope we get glimpses like that in this season and the next. The Littlefinger/Varys scene was a little redundant, but the shot of Littlefinger examining the throne and cutting his finger was great. You can just see him thinking "dammit, it cut me."

[julyleo]

There are actually four related scenes from 2x03 (including the deleted scene, again, assuming I'm right and the scene came from 2x03). The three aired scenes aired back to back in 2x03:

Scene 1: Tyrion and Shae discuss finding something for Shae to do.

Scene 2: Sansa suffers through the dinner from hell while Cersei needles her.

(Scene 3, deleted): Sansa, upset from the dinner, is on her way back to her chambers when she bumps into the Hound. The Hound gives her a bit of a hard time, further adding to her agitation and emotional distress (although she pulls it together in the moment to stand up to the Hound). Tyrion shows up and as Sansa enters her room, he notices a handmaiden hustling by. You can see the wheels turning in Tyrion's head.

Scene 4: Sansa is preparing for bed, Shae shows up as her new handmaid, and Sansa gets upset. Sansa losing it a bit on Shae at this point is doubly understandable now that she's been hassled by both Cersei and the Hound in the space of one evening and probably wants nothing more than to crawl into bed without being bothered by anyone else.

The way I see it, this deleted scene, as well as providing insight into the Sandor/Sansa dynamic (and explaining where the line "You won't hurt me" from 2x09 came from), served as a bit of connective tissue to get us to where the writers wanted to end up (Shae as Sansa's handmaid), and Tyrion figured into that. So his showing up wasn't actually random in context at all: he needed to show up for the writers to show where he got the idea to place Shae with Sansa. It's not critical, but it does explain a fair bit. It also ties the scenes which did air together.

Interesting that Sansa straight-up refuses to sing for the Hound here, which never happened in the books (I kind of like the Hound shrinking back after she says she doesn't know any songs, like "Damn, girl," ha!). Maybe she was supposed to go back on this and sing for him in 2x09? I know there were supposed to be two alternate takes of the Blackwater Sandor/Sansa scene, so maybe she sang in one (or both) of them. (ETA: Scratch that, it seems from reports about the Blackwater 2x09 commentary track that there was a take where Sansa sang the same song she sang earlier with the women, but they cut it.)

I totally agree with everything you just said also i'm a little sad they cut the varys littlefinger scene. I think it shows the dynamic between the two and that even though they are both cunning,and somewhat "shady" they clearly have different goals and I think it is building toward showing littlefingers ultimate goals of winning the game and the alliance varys has in tyrion. Plus I mean the banter is just pure acting how could you not like that!

[Le Cygne]

Newstar, I see the Sansa/Sandor deleted scene differently. I think they capture the book subtext pretty well in the show. "There's something there." And she knows he's harsh but won't hurt her.

I think Sandor is responding to what she said in the scene, "I don't know any songs. Not anymore." That's pretty sad. He looks sad. Sometimes sad is just sad.

Just heard the GRRM commentary for episode 9, he just says "he demanded a song" in the book and she sang the one they used in the earlier scene. That's all he really had to say other than the actors did a great job.

He kept saying, they all need to wear their helmets! And then when I thought he'd let that go, he came back to it. It was pretty entertaining, I wish he'd comment on all of them.

[Kittykatknits]

Newstar, I see the Sansa/Sandor deleted scene differently. I think they capture the book subtext pretty well in the show. "There's something there." And she knows he's harsh but won't hurt her.

I think Sandor is responding to what she said in the scene, "I don't know any songs. Not anymore." That's pretty sad. He looks sad. Sometimes sad is just sad.

Just heard the GRRM commentary for episode 9, he just says "he demanded a song" in the book and she sang the one they used in the earlier scene. That's all he really had to say other than the actors did a great job.

He kept saying, they all need to wear their helmets! And then when I thought he'd let that go, he came back to it. It was pretty entertaining, I wish he'd comment on all of them.

He didn't say anything else about there scene together?! Kinda disappointing.

[Le Cygne]

He seemed really intent on watching it. I took that as a good thing. He got quiet during a good Cersei scene, too. Other times, he was really getting into something like medieval battle strategies and of course, helmets. :)

Oh, you'll probably like this, Bronn vs. Hound, he didn't say who would win, but he said the Hound was famous and Bronn was someone Tyrion picked up on the road.

[Le Cygne]

So, second bit of commentary, same episode, same scene, for Kittykatknits and anyone interested.

Director Peter Marshall, Lena Headey, and Peter Dinklage.

Sansa (to Sandor): What are you doing here?

Lena: He loves you.

...

Peter (singing): {Beauty and the Beast}

...

Sansa: You won't hurt me.

Peter Marshall: Naaaah... (as in, no, of course he won't)

He also said they originally had Sansa sing the song for Sandor but it would have been redundant since she sang it in the previous scene.

[Nick_Scryer]

I really liked the Sansa/Sandor scene until Tyrion showed up and kinda wish it was kept in even if it did show some of the same stuff as other scenes. All Tywin/Arya scenes were basically the same so...

Loras and Margaery was also great, although Loras is different in the books, this scene felt real and sad.

Varys and LF was amazing but again, LF seems to talk differently. His voice and way of speaking in S1 was a lot better than the varied way of speaking he uses in S2. I hate the way he says "I suppose"

The Irri death scene was pretty terrible.

[Queen of Winter]

Not sure how I feel about the deleted Hound/Sansa scene, though it does tie up how Shae became her lady's maid. And it also ties into the Blackwater scene where the Hound shows up in Sansa's room--where she repeats the whole "You won't hurt me" thing again-except then he tells her "No little bird, I won't hurt you." (or something similar to that).

Varys and LF was amazing but again, LF seems to talk differently. His voice and way of speaking in S1 was a lot better than the varied way of speaking he uses in S2. I hate the way he says "I suppose"

I'm glad I wasn't the only one who noticed this during S2..... :wacko:

[Caro99]

So, second bit of commentary, same episode, same scene, for Kittykatknits and anyone interested.

Director Peter Marshall, Lena Headey, and Peter Dinklage.

He also said they originally had Sansa sing the song for Sandor but it would have been redundant since she sang it in the previous scene.

Oh my daysss! This is priceless! Lena saying that and peter singing!! Maybe he's read the b&B essays on the FP2P thread x)

And they should have had her singing to Sandor too!!! Waah! HBO is breaking my heart!

[Kittykatknits]

So, second bit of commentary, same episode, same scene, for Kittykatknits and anyone interested.

Director Peter Marshall, Lena Headey, and Peter Dinklage.

He also said they originally had Sansa sing the song for Sandor but it would have been redundant since she sang it in the previous scene.

Now, I'll go ahead and call this good news! Thank you for letting me know. It makes up for Tyrion, almost. :)

[Stannis the Wight]

I would buy a blu ray just to see the new histories animated scenes

[Karmarni]

Sandor and Sansa

‘Serpentine steps’ and a mash-up of Tyrion needing to find a place for Shae, as others have said. It does show viewers again the Hound’s attraction to Sansa. It doesn't reference the fact that he's supposed to be drunk here as in the books. She's mouthing her courtesies to him, but he's not having it. Though ironically, he’s the one who told her to use them.

I’m not sure I understand from the scene on its own why she knows he won't hurt her. Because she just knows he won't based on her limited previous experience with him (and ours)? (Same shown later in S02-09, “Blackwater” where she just seems to know he won’t.)

Serves to take the "songs and stories" aspect out of Sansa's role for the show and gives her more strength and confidence than she has in the books, something that I think will continue with her character in the show and eventually the books.

Having Tyrion there kills the angle that the Hound and Sansa were never seen talking alone together. But it is able to reinforce the enmity felt between the Hound and Tyrion. Found the Hound fearsome, while the scene shows his cringe-worthy inability to communicate with her. Also depicts his mocking of her and what I'd say was his jealousy and resultant anger.

Technically, the actors are sometimes stiff and some of their timing is off, it doesn't flow. Also, there are some continuity problems, shot to shot, obviously because of different takes. This scene reveals problems inherent in book-to-film. Mash-ups suck and there’s a problem if the dialogue that was so terrific on the page doesn’t play well on screen. And you’ve got limited time, so you’ve got to pare the dialogue down . . . and there you go, just not up to par.

Sorry, more attention paid to this because there’s more there. Would’ve been nice to have been included in that regard.

Margery and Loras

This scene is just fluff to me. We knew all the information from other scenes. Here we just have Loras admitting that he loved Renly. Lighting was good, shots were well done, but a waste otherwise.

Irri and Doreah

As others have said, this was pretty much crap. Doreah’s over-the-top lines and delivery felt wrong.

Varys and Littlefinger

I don’t like the blocking on this one. The extraneous actors rebuilding the throne room are distracting. Also don’t like the long angle shot of Varys and Littlefinger talking or the lighting. The information we’re given though is interesting, in that Littlefinger says he is aware who Varys is backing. I can’t remember if we knew that from other S02 scenes. Littlefinger is getting quite cocky here after receiving his lordship, towards Varys and the other ‘grotesques’. We get more of Littlefinger’s sexualization of his thoughts toward Varys. Kind of like he again thinks less of him because he doesn’t have a cock. Fascinating that Littlefinger can sense Varys behind him when in the books Varys is always sneaking up on people. “Always bet on my friends” – nice little dig on Littlefinger’s part. Or is it?

I’m not sure how others think, but once I view deleted scenes I usually incorporate them into the whole in my head anyway. Suppose they felt these were up to snuff to include at least in that regard.

[JimWolf]

Still waiting. So glad I paid the extra shipping to have it delivered yesterday. I did get an email saying I'd get the $5 refund for the release price. I've waited 11 months to watch season 2. I can wait a few more days, right? RIGHT?!?!?!

[Le Cygne]

She's mouthing her courtesies to him, but he's not having it. Though ironically, he's the one who told her to use them.

True. I think he's saying she doesn't have to do that with him. And he's overdoing it because he's the Hound, but Sansa can handle him (and his "ferocity"). When she says the Lannisters took away her songs, there is a nice moment between them there. That Tyrion interrupts. So there's no payoff to the scene. But in the book, there was. Sandor knew she was afraid of Ser Boros and he reassured her, covered for her, and called him a toad to his face. They captured this in other scenes, sure, but Tyrion in that scene was just wrong.

I'm not sure I understand from the scene on its own why she knows he won't hurt her. Because she just knows he won't based on her limited previous experience with him (and ours)?

Ellipsis, we don't have to see everything to know it happened. I can buy this based on what we've seen. Sandor has been protective of her, and he obviously loves her. And like in the books, Sansa takes all of this in.

I would buy a blu ray just to see the new histories animated scenes

Just saw them, they are pretty good!

[Bastard of Boston]

Chugging my way through all the commentary. Alfie and Gemma were hilarious, as were the kids. I found it interesting that they mentioned fast forwarding through all the nudity/sex after it appeared they sat through nudity in last season's commentary, heh. I laughed for about five minutes after hearing Carice say "prosthetic vagina." It's the little things.