Did you believe Aegon was fake from the start, or did you believe he was real?

[Magic 8 Ball]

No, only those 'courtyards of the mighty' could have had one. It says so in the text.

What would prevent someone from shipping potted lemon trees from Dorne to Braavos en masse and selling them at a Bazaar for relatively cheap, especially at the beginning of a summer? Unless simply having a courtyard means "mighty" in the context of a dense urban area with limited acreage? Doesn't necessarily mean a sealord, now does it?

[yolkboy]

What would prevent someone from shipping potted lemon trees from Dorne to Braavos en masse and selling them at a Bazaar for relatively cheap, especially at the beginning of a summer? Unless simply having a courtyard means "mighty" in the context of a dense urban area with limited acreage? Doesn't necessarily mean a sealord, now does it?

Because a. trees are not cheap in Braavos. b. Trees have great difficulty growing in Braavos.

This is why there's almost no trees in Braavos. If it was as easy and cheap as you seem to think it is, then why isnt Braavos in full bloom?

Braavos, devoid of grass and trees

...

They have no trees, she realized. Braavos is all stone, a grey city in a green sea.

...

In the forest, they see all. but there are no trees here

...

"There's no more wood." Dareon had paid the innkeep double for a room with a hearth, but none of them had realized that wood would be so costly here. Trees did not grow on Braavos, save in the courts and gardens of the mighty."

[silentwanderer]

I honestly thought Aegon was the loving son of a renaissance kind of fisherman obsessed with old Valyria until Tyrion pointed out who he really was.

Blame Illyrio Mopatis (he was supposed to be hiding the Lannister, not the Targaryen)

[Magic 8 Ball]

Because Gilly couldn't very well enter someone's courtyard and ask to chop trees down. You can grow trees in a courtyard or rooftop even in the most dense urban conglomerations.

[Bunners]

So I just finished reading the faegon chapter. I'm still reading ADWD but I have been following along forums basically the whole series so I know what happens. I had a bias to faegon from the beginning. There was no doubt in my mind that he is fake.

But while reading this chapter I tried to pay special attention to Tyrion, his actions, and his words. Something I noticed is there is an undercurrent of Tyrion either not believing Aegon or trying to lead him astray. I can sense that he's skeptical and though he does give advice there is something missing from his words, his demeanor is different. When Tyrion would plan and scheme with his allies (even when he would just give advice to bastard boys) there was something in his demeanor, a humor, a fun. Here it's completely absent and there is a certain coolness I sense coming from him and his words as he speaks to Aegon

his enemies however there was always a slickness of speech, a poker face, a facade, that same coolness. Like with Cersei.. Usually GRRM includes much mental commentary with Tyrion chapters, so the reader is always very clearly aware of what he is thinking. But I noticed that they are curiously absent when Tyrion is talking to Aegon. The only thoughts he has are him drawing a comparison to him and Joffery (not a good sign) and a small mental note when Tyrion is commanded to pick up the chess set after Aegon flips it over. He thinks, word for word.

He may be a Targaryen after all. So not in the beginning of the conversation but after? Tyrion is drawing a reference to Aegon's ability to oppress (again not a good sign). But I want to say that this thought suggests in Tyrion's mind that he is skeptical. That he knows Aegon isn't the real deal. And so do some of his words.

"How can she help but not love you then, I ask you?" Smiling he seized his dragon, flew it across the board. " I hope Your Grace will pardon me. Your king is trapped. Death in four."

The prince stared at the playing board. "My dragon"

"is too far away to save you. You should have moved her to the center of the battle."

"But you said"

"I lied. Trust no one. And keep your dragon close." Pg 309 ADWD

After this Tyrion goes on and thinks of many other things. Aegon not even really on his mind. He then an goes and gets himself caught but all the while he seems very unconcerned. You would think he would be thinking about Aegon and how to get him closer to Daenerys and planning. But he's out, and seems very unconcerned.

All this suggests Tyrion knows he's and imposter and the advice he gave him is going to get him killed/discovered/captured. And if he believed that Aegon was true why would he strive to not find him instead of Daenerys after capture (aside from the dragon bit) why not go back to their party? Because he believes they are on the loosing side, or he believes Aegon is Faegon.

Also, GRRM is basing some of the series off of the real War of the Roses. The parallels between Perkin Warbeck and "Aegon Targaryen" are uncanny.

Did anyone else sense that Tyrion was merely playing the part that he believed? Did anyone else notice these things about Tyrion

[The Mad Wolf]

I really thought he was legit until I read some theories

[GrumpkinsAndStarks]

At first I was hooked. Mostly because Tyrion seemed to have deduced it. But then I remember that Holden Half Maester may have told him, which gave me doubts. After reading the theories, as usual, I am more confused than ever.

[averde]

I thought he was real. I still do. Even if he were fake the only people who know are Varys and Illyrio and they aren't going to tell anyone. So how would anyone ever find out. Unless Aegon being "fake" is Danny killing him with fire and saying no true Targaryen can be harmed by fire like she said about Viserys.

[sheofseidhr]

I did believe he was the real deal, and actually I still do, but as many others have said before me there are certain clues falsifying his claims that believers simply cannot ignore. But then again this is GRRM we are talking about, so I guess I believe him now but wouldn't really be surprised if he turned to be fake which the majority of the fans seem to think.

And also, the one thing that actually bothers me personally is whether (f)Aegon actually knows who he really is. Of course the logical thing to assume is that if he was supposed to be Aegon then he was probably raised believing that he really IS that person. But what if he knows he isn't or had somehow found out that he's fake unintentionally... It's a stupid thing to speculate about and like I've said it's just a thought I like to entertain personally.

[RainBow]

I believed he was the real deal and I still do.

It would have been so easy for Varys to smuggle out Aegon to a ship. And I still see no valid reason to why Varys would lie to a dying Ser Kevan.

[Chatty Duelist]

I am perpetually faithful to Rhaegar's trueborn son, and look forward to him stealing dragons, killing bastards and aunts left and right.

[Errant Bard]

It would have been so easy for Varys to smuggle out Aegon to a ship.

Most of the disbelief* comes not from the easiness of smuggling one infant out, but from the logistics of having a body double kid on tap to smuggle in. And also from the question it leaves about his failure to smuggle out anyone else but Aegon. If you are so crazy prepared as having a body double for a one year kid, surely you are prepared enough to grab everyone else that needs grabbing.

On the other hand if your aim is to put a puppet on the throne, leaving everyone else to die makes some sense, but in that case saving the kid (and dooming another) instead of using the double directly seems a risk and a waste of time.

It's not as if Varys is lying even if Aegon is a fake Targaryen, anyway. He's not saying he smuggled Aegon out, he's saying that a boy named Aegon is taking Storm's End, and that he is killing Kevan not for the Targaryens, but for the realm and the children.

*Aside from the prophecy thing. For one reason or another it's easier for me to believe in prophecy than in Varys.

[Roddy the Ruin]

I wanted to believe he was real, but I don't think he is.

[Fragile Bird]

I thought he was real, until I read the Blackfyre theory.

But what occurs to me also is that GRRM may be giving us a huge hint by naming his protector Jon Connington. "Conning" in the sense of fooling. Fooling us a whole lot, a ton in fact. :P

[Julia Martell]

I understand everyone's argument about keeping him hidden and safe, but no. Varys and Illyrio are not so dumb as to not know there can't be any doubt as to his identity.

Viserys and Dany were out in the open the whole time. Yes, you can argue they were in danger but no one could have any doubt they are who they say they are.

fAegon has no... provenance, for lack of a better word. One minute he's a baby then he's a grown man with only paper thin rationalizations for how he got from one state to the other. Sure the Pisswater Prince story is possible, but there's no really reason to believe it. And even if JonCon vouches for him... well, Margret of Burgundy vouched for Perkin Warbeck, and all the evidence is that she was knowingly lying.

No, I knew he was fake. Varys and Illyrio wouldn't have acted like this with a real prince.

[Wicked Woodpecker of West]

I think he's real. It's just some evil, misleading thing George would do.
I mean look no one is safe, world is gritty, gods are cruel or nonexistent, no happy endings and stuff. And then bam! there is dead prince that is not dead but saved in the last moment and put in the middle of whole saga to be revealed and return from behind the sea!
And fandom is like: "A no way. George is playing with us. He's got to be impostor".

And that's how fandom will be ultimately trolled.

[Errant Bard]

Hmm, the only difference between Aegon being "real" and "fake" would be that Varys planted an innocent kid to die in baby Aegon's place, so I'm not getting the implication that him being "real" is not gritty, not cruel, but is an happy ending. Especially when Aegon, real or fake, is prophecised to be slain by Daenerys anyway.

[Chatty Duelist]

Hmm, the only difference between Aegon being "real" and "fake" would be that Varys planted an innocent kid to die in baby Aegon's place, so I'm not getting the implication that him being "real" is not gritty, not cruel, but is an happy ending. Especially when Aegon, real or fake, is prophecised to be slain by Daenerys anyway.

As if prophecies were an indicator to what will happen...oh wait is the Stallion That Mounts The World?

[Errant Bard]

As if prophecies were an indicator to what will happen...oh wait is the Stallion That Mounts The World?

The only prophecy among dozens that didn't come to pass? I'd call that an indicator, even if it's not 100% accurate, thank you very much.

[ghosts in winterfell]

I tend to take most things at face value on first readings, so I had rolled with him being the real deal initially. I had also read the books back-to-back in a very short period of time and had forgotten a lot of details, so I didn't make the connection to the clues that had been dropped early on. The forums have been a real eye-opener. Having looked closer, the Pisswater prince story stinks to high heaven.