Small questions v.10013

[Trinton07]

There's a SSM where he confirms Ned named Jon.

http://www.westeros..../SSM/Entry/1202

edit: ninja'd

was he named after Jon Aryn?

related, was Robb named after Robert Baratheon?

[Arch-MaesterPhilip]

In Asha Greyjoy's final POV in ADWD raven is eating the flesh off the skull of one of the burned men. Could this Raven have been warged by BR or Bran? And could they be the one's who sent the blizzard?

[VaramyrSixchins]

After Robert's Rebellion, why did it take so long to secure Dragonstone? Dany was born there, 9 mos after the sack. It took more than 9mos to gather a fleet & capture it? Why? I understand if there would be some reluctance to send the Redwyne fleet, but was there really no Robert-loyal naval power to send? No White Harbor? No remnants of the Royal Fleet that could be commanded by a trustworthy admiral? There was no other choice than waiting on Stannis to recuperate from the Storm's End siege & sending him? What gives?

[RumHam]

After Robert's Rebellion, why did it take so long to secure Dragonstone? Dany was born there, 9 mos after the sack. It took more than 9mos to gather a fleet & capture it? Why? I understand if there would be some reluctance to send the Redwyne fleet, but was there really no Robert-loyal naval power to send? No White Harbor? No remnants of the Royal Fleet that could be commanded by a trustworthy admiral? There was no other choice than waiting on Stannis to recuperate from the Storm's End siege & sending him? What gives?

We don't really know that Dany was born nine months after the fall of Kings Landing. Here is the quote:

burning would arouse him. A king has no secrets from his Kingsguard. Relations between Aerys and his queen had been strained during the last years of his reign. They slept apart and did their best to avoid each other during the waking hours. But whenever Aerys gave a man to the flames, Queen Rhaella would have a visitor in the night. The day he burned his mace-and-dagger Hand, Jaime and Jon Darry had stood at guard outside her bedchamber whilst the king took his pleasure. “You’re hurting me,” they had heard Rhaella cry through the oaken door. “You’re hurting me.” In some queer way, that had been worse than Lord Chelsted’s screaming. “We are sworn to protect her as well,” Jaime had finally been driven to say. “We are,” Darry allowed, “but not from him.” Jaime had only seen Rhaella once after that, the morning of the day she left for Dragonstone.

He only saw her once after that, and that was when she left for Dragonstone. That doesn't mean she left right away. If she had left the next day he probably would have mentioned it. We know Aerys didn't send her and Viserys away until after the Trident, which could have been well after he came up with the wildfire plot and burnt Chelsted. It probably wasn't, but we don't know for sure.

If I'm not mistaken there was a naval blockade of Dragonstone, and at a certain point the castle guard conspired to turn the royal family over. When you consider the time needed to establish a "rebel fleet" and then establish a blockade and have the castle run low on supplies, the timeline makes perfect sense.

[RumHam]

We don't really know that Dany was born nine months after the fall of Kings Landing. Here is the quote:

He only saw her once after that, and that was when she left for Dragonstone. That doesn't mean she left right away. If she had left the next day he probably would have mentioned it. We know Aerys didn't send her and Viserys away until after the Trident, which could have been well after he came up with the wildfire plot and burnt Chelsted. It probably wasn't, but we don't know for sure.

If I'm not mistaken there was a naval blockade of Dragonstone, and at a certain point the castle guard conspired to turn the royal family over. When you consider the time needed to establish a "rebel fleet" and then establish a blockade and have the castle run low on supplies, the timeline makes perfect sense.

Edit: the Redwynes are banner men of the Tyrells and were actively involved in the siege of Storms End. I don't know what became of the royal fleet, but you can sorta understand why the rebels would want to send their own men, not former loyalists, to root out the last Targaryens.

[Trinton07]

Edit: the Redwynes are banner men of the Tyrells and were actively involved in the siege of Storms End. I don't know what became of the royal fleet, but you can sorta understand why the rebels would want to send their own men, not former loyalists, to root out the last Targaryens.

the royal fleet was defending dragonstone, until it was destroyed by the storm that gave Daenerys Stormborn her name. Throughout the novels, the three main naval forces seem to be the royal fleet, the redwyne fleet, and the iron fleet. as you said, it doesn't make much sense to send former loyalists to capture the last Targaryen stronghold. The ironborn seemed to stay out of the war altogether, so they werent under Robert's command for him to send. The royal fleet was at dragonstone, and it would've taken awhile to assmeble the smaller naval forces of the rebels together to have enough ships to take dragonstone. so yeah, 9 months to take dragonstone isnt ridiculous.

[assjfjgjsgjljljglgjfjsduar]

He only saw her once after that, and that was when she left for Dragonstone. That doesn't mean she left right away. If she had left the next day he probably would have mentioned it. We know Aerys didn't send her and Viserys away until after the Trident, which could have been well after he came up with the wildfire plot and burnt Chelsted. It probably wasn't, but we don't know for sure.

It couldn't have been too long after, because from what I remember it's implied that she still has the marks from whatever Aerys did to her during the marital rape.

ETA: OK I think I have it narrowed down somewhat more. Chelsted was burned alive in wildfire and replaced with Rossart, who served for about two weeks and was the last Hand of the King. He's the one Jaime killed. Assuming that Rossart was appointed immediately after Chelsted was burned — which makes the most sense, they wouldn't leave the office vacant — then Dany's conception would have only been two weeks before the night of the Sack. So yes, she would have been born nine months, give or take a few days, after it.

[Morienthar]

was he named after Jon Aryn?

related, was Robb named after Robert Baratheon?

Yes and as For Robb I think so.

[Morienthar]

In Asha Greyjoy's final POV in ADWD raven is eating the flesh off the skull of one of the burned men. Could this Raven have been warged by BR or Bran? And could they be the one's who sent the blizzard?

No clue,Not really a small question this one,We don't really have the data to answer it.

[Roadside Rose]

Has anyone read the book Beyond the Wall? Does it have any ASOIAF back story or supporting material? What is it really about. I tried reading some reviews but none were clear.

[Black Wolf Smith]

She was having her moon blood plus she had eaten some berries that turned her bowels to water.

Then on the next page:

There was no blood from the back, only the front.

Well not to argue, but the way I read that, she woke up and thought she had soiled herself, and then found blood between her legs, and thinks it is must be her moonblood. Not really a strong endorsement IMO.

After Robert's Rebellion, why did it take so long to secure Dragonstone? Dany was born there, 9 mos after the sack. It took more than 9mos to gather a fleet & capture it? Why? I understand if there would be some reluctance to send the Redwyne fleet, but was there really no Robert-loyal naval power to send? No White Harbor? No remnants of the Royal Fleet that could be commanded by a trustworthy admiral? There was no other choice than waiting on Stannis to recuperate from the Storm's End siege & sending him? What gives?

First we don't know when she left. Only that she left after he raped her, before KL was sacked. It could have been couple of months/weeks/days before the sack, it doesn't tell us. Second Stannis was trapped in SE, staving, after KL was taking. Ned left KL and got to SE around the time he was freed. Third Stannis had to both recover, get the order to take it from Robert and gather and/or build a fleet. Fourth the Loyalist fleet keep Stannis fleet away, until the storms broke them, which is when Dany was born. They fled DS shortly afterwards.

[assjfjgjsgjljljglgjfjsduar]

First we don't know when she left. Only that she left after he raped her, before KL was sacked. It could have been couple of months/weeks/days before the sack, it doesn't tell us. Second Stannis was trapped in SE, staving, after KL was taking. Ned left KL and got to SE around the time he was freed. Third Stannis had to both recover and gather and/or build a fleet. Fourth the Loyalist fleet keep Stannis fleet away, until the storms broke them, which is when Dany was born. They fled DS shortly afterwards.

We're talking weeks at most. Two, to be precise. Rossart was Chelsted's successor and he only served for two weeks before the Sack, when Jaime killed him. Aerys raped Rhaella after Chelsted was burned alive. Assuming Rossart was appointed immediately — which I think is more than fair, given the office's importance and Rossart's yes-man syndrome regarding the wildfire — then Dany's conception would be two weeks before the Sack. Which lines up with her being born about nine months after it. Now, Rhaella might have left King's Landing later than two weeks pre-Sack, but the conception lines up with Dany's birth being nine months after the Sack (and Jon's being at the same time up to a month after). Seeing as Rhaella seems to have been hiding her injuries when she left, i.e. they would still have been very visible, I'd say a few days after the rape is probably when she left. Any later and the injuries wouldn't be as blatant.

[mindchap]

Well not to argue, but the way I read that, she woke up and thought she had soiled herself, and then found blood between her legs, and thinks it is must be her moonblood. Not really a strong endorsement IMO.

Then why point out that she would have been relieved if she hadn't been so sick.

[Black Wolf Smith]

Which lines up with her being born about nine months after it.

I agree, didn't put the time, w/ the hand of the moment( nice call, and thank you for that) but doesn't change the facts. They didn't have a Fleet, Robert told Stannis to get DS. It took time to find/build/steal it and then sail there. That would have taken at least a few months.

[assjfjgjsgjljljglgjfjsduar]

I agree, didn't put the time, w/ the hand of the moment( nice call, and thank you for that) but doesn't change the facts. They didn't have a Fleet, Robert told Stannis to get DS. It took time to find/build/steal it and then sail there. That would have taken at least a few months.

Oh no I'm not arguing the Dragonstone fleet thing. Just reiterating that Dany's birth and conception can actually be nailed down pretty firmly.

[Black Wolf Smith]

Then why point out that she would have been relieved if she hadn't been so sick.

OK, she went out in to the crowds because she was sure she wouldn't get sick, and now she is sick, lost and confused. My point is that her judgment is suspect to begin with, let alone now.

@ apple martini the question I was answering was why did it take so long to capture DS.

[TheCrannogDweller]

We're talking weeks at most. Two, to be precise. Rossart was Chelsted's successor and he only served for two weeks before the Sack, when Jaime killed him. Aerys raped Rhaella after Chelsted was burned alive. Assuming Rossart was appointed immediately — which I think is more than fair, given the office's importance and Rossart's yes-man syndrome regarding the wildfire.

That's a good estimate, but you assume two things:

1. Chelsted was burned immediately after being fired. (no pun intended.)

2. Rossart was appointed at the same moment.

It's not unheard of for the office of the Hand to remain vacant for some time. Robert was Hand-less for months between Jon's death and Ned's acceptance of the post. On the other hand, you have Aerys' fear and jealousy of Tywin. He was mistrustful of his best Hand, so why be in a hurry to appoint another one?

I think the best thing would be to remember what Chelsted was fired for. Was it the loss at the Trident?

[Dr. Pepper]

That's a good estimate, but you assume two things:

1. Chelsted was burned immediately after being fired. (no pun intended.)

2. Rossart was appointed at the same moment.

It's not unheard of for the office of the Hand to remain vacant for some time. Robert was Hand-less for months between Jon's death and Ned's acceptance of the post. On the other hand, you have Aerys' fear and jealousy of Tywin. He was mistrustful of his best Hand, so why be in a hurry to appoint another one?

I think the best thing would be to remember what Chelsted was fired for. Was it the loss at the Trident?

Chelsted wasn't fired. He quit. Then he was fried. He quit before the Trident. There's also a big difference between Robert's Hand-less months and Aerys quick Hand replacements. For one, Aerys was in the middle of a war while Robert was experiencing a lovely peace and had the luxury of going on a cross-country journey to ask his friend to become his hand. For another, the man who replaced Chelsted - Rossart - was already there in King's Landing. Likely the one who performed the burning of Chelsted.

[Arrowtic]

Is it for sure that Oberyn was going to finish The Mountain right before he died ?

[TheCrannogDweller]

Is it for sure that Oberyn was going to finish The Mountain right before he died ?

He had already finished him - he had stuck him with his poisoned spear a few times. So, the Mountain was dying. He just managed to kill Oberyn before he did.