DaveyJoe Posted June 26, 2014 Share Posted June 26, 2014 They did show Wendell Manderly at the Red Wedding but he was basically an extra with no lines. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Winnief Posted June 27, 2014 Share Posted June 27, 2014 The whole story of Manderly knowing that Rickon is in Skagos and he needs Davos to fetch Rickon doesn't really hold together. Why would Rickon go to Skagos? Even if Ned's mother was from Skagos, which is pure speculation, how would Osha know to go there? The story of Wex tracking them makes little sense - what was Wex's motivation and how did he track a wildling and a direwolf without them noticing. Why would Manderly need Davos to fetch Rickon when Manderly has a whole fleet and port city? Even if he's being surreptitious, surely Manderly could have found a Stark loyalist smuggler. What was his plan if Davos hadn't showed up? The most plausible explanation is that Manderly is lying about some or all of it, but then you have to wonder why Manderly wants to send Davos to Skagos on false pretenses. Or maybe GRRM just wanted to send Davos on a quest and didn't worry too much about it holding together. I don't know. Anyway, I doubt that any of that plot will be in the show ITA. I think Martin was just looking for an excuse to go to Skagos, (and maybe see unicorns,) so he came up with that subplot without bothering to consider how plausible it was. Personally, I think having Rickon and Osha just hiding out with a loyal bannerman until WF gets re-taken really makes more sense and is probably what D&D will do. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hippocras Posted June 27, 2014 Share Posted June 27, 2014 The show will need at least one House to serve as rebels inside Winterfell with Roose, and another House to march with Stannis.With that in mind I think we will get both the Umbers and the Manderlys. The Umbers will be Stannis's allies, as half of them are anyway in the books, while the Manderlys will be the sneaky rebels inside murdering Freys. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bearded Swordsman Posted June 27, 2014 Share Posted June 27, 2014 The show will need at least one House to serve as rebels inside Winterfell with Roose, and another House to march with Stannis.With that in mind I think we will get both the Umbers and the Manderlys. The Umbers will be Stannis's allies, as half of them are anyway in the books, while the Manderlys will be the sneaky rebels inside murdering Freys. So basically they will get a minor non-speaking role ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arkash Posted June 27, 2014 Share Posted June 27, 2014 I wouldnt be surprised to have one of the Mormont ladies next season. An Alysanne Mormont equivalent marching alongside Stannis would be very cool. Add to that Wyman Manderly in Winterfell and another Northern Lord siding with the Bolton and in three new cast-members, you have all the Northern Lords you need to pull of the Winterfell arc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hippocras Posted June 27, 2014 Share Posted June 27, 2014 So basically they will get a minor non-speaking role ?Um no. At least one House, probably Manderly, will be the significant players inside Winterfell I said. How do you arrive at the conclusion that the major inside guerrilla players are non-speaking and minor? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hippocras Posted June 27, 2014 Share Posted June 27, 2014 I wouldnt be surprised to have one of the Mormont ladies next season. An Alysanne Mormont equivalent marching alongside Stannis would be very cool. Add to that Wyman Manderly in Winterfell and another Northern Lord siding with the Bolton and in three new cast-members, you have all the Northern Lords you need to pull of the Winterfell arc.I am not sure about Mormonts, but I would like to see them. The necessary ones are:Karstarks: Already featured, and can provide Alys as fArya, merging those two similar elements. They would be the ones inside Winterfell actually loyal to Bolton.Manderlys: the ones inside Winterfell who are secretly sabotaging things.Umbers: the ones openly but tentatively loyal to Stannis. They also possibly have Rickon. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cas Stark Posted June 27, 2014 Share Posted June 27, 2014 I am not sure about Mormonts, but I would like to see them. The necessary ones are:Karstarks: Already featured, and can provide Alys as fArya, merging those two similar elements. They would be the ones inside Winterfell actually loyal to Bolton.Manderlys: the ones inside Winterfell who are secretly sabotaging things.Umbers: the ones openly but tentatively loyal to Stannis. They also possibly have Rickon. There is no way we're getting 3 Northern lords in the story next season. Good grief, we didn't have any Northern lords in Robb's story. We will be lucky to get 1 guy who the audience can remember his name. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crixus Posted June 27, 2014 Share Posted June 27, 2014 There is no way we're getting 3 Northern lords in the story next season. Good grief, we didn't have any Northern lords in Robb's story. We will be lucky to get 1 guy who the audience can remember his name. Yup. More the shame, because their loyalty to him was so uplifting and rare in-universe. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hippocras Posted June 27, 2014 Share Posted June 27, 2014 There is no way we're getting 3 Northern lords in the story next season. Good grief, we didn't have any Northern lords in Robb's story. We will be lucky to get 1 guy who the audience can remember his name.The post you quoted is a minimum for the Northern storyline. Whatever their names, there needs to be one group allied hesitantly with Stannis, one group that is neutral on Stannis but out for Frey blood on the inside, and one group that is genuinely working with the Boltons. Without each of these, you can't tell the story of the battle for Winterfell and Stannis's relationship to the North. I have no doubt it will be a simplified story, but it will still require someone to fill all of these roles.Where do you get that the Northern lords weren't shown? Roose Bolton was very present in season 2, and 3, as was Karstark, and as was the Greatjon. The only one of the ones I mentioned above that would be new is Manderly, and it need not even be house Manderly, it is simply necessary for someone to be working against the Boltons from inside Winterfell. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cas Stark Posted June 27, 2014 Share Posted June 27, 2014 The post you quoted is a minimum for the Northern storyline. Whatever their names, there needs to be one group allied hesitantly with Stannis, one group that is neutral on Stannis but out for Frey blood on the inside, and one group that is genuinely working with the Boltons. Without each of these, you can't tell the story of the battle for Winterfell and Stannis's relationship to the North. I have no doubt it will be a simplified story, but it will still require someone to fill all of these roles.Where do you get that the Northern lords weren't shown? Roose Bolton was very present in season 2, and 3, as was Karstark, and as was the Greatjon. The only one of the ones I mentioned above that would be new is Manderly, and it need not even be house Manderly, it is simply necessary for someone to be working against the Boltons from inside Winterfell. Show Stannis doesn't need the Northern lords because he already has an army. So,the whole Karstark subplot I would think will be cut. There is no way the show is going into all of that detail. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fez Posted June 27, 2014 Share Posted June 27, 2014 The post you quoted is a minimum for the Northern storyline. Whatever their names, there needs to be one group allied hesitantly with Stannis, one group that is neutral on Stannis but out for Frey blood on the inside, and one group that is genuinely working with the Boltons. Without each of these, you can't tell the story of the battle for Winterfell and Stannis's relationship to the North. I have no doubt it will be a simplified story, but it will still require someone to fill all of these roles.Where do you get that the Northern lords weren't shown? Roose Bolton was very present in season 2, and 3, as was Karstark, and as was the Greatjon. The only one of the ones I mentioned above that would be new is Manderly, and it need not even be house Manderly, it is simply necessary for someone to be working against the Boltons from inside Winterfell. Or, the battle for Winterfell just becomes a straight-forward Stannis-Bolton battle, with no other Houses involved. Stannis already seems to have a significantly larger army than in the books, so no need for him to gather the mountain clans or rally other Northerners. At best, there will be one noble on Bolton's side who betrays him, thus mirroring Bolton's betrayal of Robb, and making things even easier for Stannis (assuming he does in fact live and win in TWOW). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peasant Rebel Leader Posted June 27, 2014 Share Posted June 27, 2014 They will have scenes in Winterfell leading up to the battle. If they'd want to include the "Ghost" storyline which I would since it's quite intriguing, it needs more than one suspect. There's Theon, and then they either Mance or a Northern Lord or both. I'd advocate Lady Dustin as another candidate for the "Manderley" place, though that may need some twiggling. But there are so many good dialogues to be found here. I can see Davos+Sam going to Northern Lord, who incarcerates Davos and then - time-jump - presents him Rickon. (Insert illogical reason/quest/waiting time here). The Northern Lord meanwhile goes to Winterfell, talks to Theon/is a candidate for the Murders. Then we have the Battle. 4-5 scenes, no? :) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crixus Posted June 27, 2014 Share Posted June 27, 2014 Or, the battle for Winterfell just becomes a straight-forward Stannis-Bolton battle, with no other Houses involved. This. The show conserves on characters and subplots (mostly within reason) so Stannis vs Bolton is very plausible. I do hope they don't cut Manderley; that would be a real letdown. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Janicia Posted June 27, 2014 Share Posted June 27, 2014 I am not sure about Mormonts, but I would like to see them. The necessary ones are:Karstarks: Already featured, and can provide Alys as fArya, merging those two similar elements. They would be the ones inside Winterfell actually loyal to Bolton.Manderlys: the ones inside Winterfell who are secretly sabotaging things.Umbers: the ones openly but tentatively loyal to Stannis. They also possibly have Rickon.I hope we do get the Umbers and Manderlys in the roles you describe. The Karstarks seem more skippable as named roles - if they are loyal to Bolton than they're functionally the same as Bolton's own troops. And the one Karstark we already knew is dead. It kind of depends on how the whole Northern situation resolves. It seems like the Northern lords are planning to use Stannis to get rid of Bolton and then turn on Stannis in the books. If that is true, a Stannis - Umber (or whoever) alliance seems like an important thing to set up, and it ties into Rickon. Sure, it could be one ManderUmber playing all the roles of the Northern lords, but I'd be kinda sad. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hippocras Posted June 27, 2014 Share Posted June 27, 2014 I hope we do get the Umbers and Manderlys in the roles you describe. The Karstarks seem more skippable as named roles - if they are loyal to Bolton than they're functionally the same as Bolton's own troops. And the one Karstark we already knew is dead. It kind of depends on how the whole Northern situation resolves. It seems like the Northern lords are planning to use Stannis to get rid of Bolton and then turn on Stannis in the books. If that is true, a Stannis - Umber (or whoever) alliance seems like an important thing to set up, and it ties into Rickon. Sure, it could be one ManderUmber playing all the roles of the Northern lords, but I'd be kinda sad.The difference is they can be split off and pretend to be loyal, some of them, to Stannis, giving him a taste of treachery too, to parallel Manderly. Also they can provide Alys in the role of fArya and that would fit with their behaviour in the books.I am not sure they will turn on Stannis. The North is not interested in the Iron Throne, so it might as well go to someone who helped them out when they needed help. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arkash Posted June 27, 2014 Share Posted June 27, 2014 Show Stannis doesn't need the Northern lords because he already has an army. So,the whole Karstark subplot I would think will be cut. There is no way the show is going into all of that detail. He still wants to rally the North behind him to become King of the 7K. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Janicia Posted June 27, 2014 Share Posted June 27, 2014 I am not sure they will turn on Stannis. The North is not interested in the Iron Throne, so it might as well go to someone who helped them out when they needed help. Don't the Northern lords still want to secede from the kingdom? I think they're in an "enemy of my enemy is my friend" state now with Stannis, but I doubt they have any intention of letting him rule over them in any capacity, and they aren't interested in giving him armies to fight for the iron throne. Circumstances could change before the Northern lords come into conflict with Stannis, but if they defeat Bolton and the White Walkers are still north of the Wall, I think the northern lords will want Stannis to go away. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Janicia Posted June 27, 2014 Share Posted June 27, 2014 My guess is that the Dornish story in season 5 opens with Ellaria returning to Dorne with Oberyn's body. The Ironborn story opens with Balon's death. How does the Northern story start? At the Wall, probably Stannis' offer to legitimize Jon and then the LC election? Does the Bolton story start with ravens from Stannis demanding fealty? That seems like a logical place to start, but maybe not very exciting. On the other hand, it would be fun to see a bunch of ravens go out, a bunch of people reading the letters incredulously, and then a very grumpy Stannis, but that isn't the show's style. Maybe it starts with an update on Rickon or the procurement of a wife for Ramsay? Maybe it starts with Manderly marching into Winterfell on Roose's orders and then they all get news of Stannis' arrival together? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hippocras Posted June 27, 2014 Share Posted June 27, 2014 Don't the Northern lords still want to secede from the kingdom? I think they're in an "enemy of my enemy is my friend" state now with Stannis, but I doubt they have any intention of letting him rule over them in any capacity, and they aren't interested in giving him armies to fight for the iron throne. Circumstances could change before the Northern lords come into conflict with Stannis, but if they defeat Bolton and the White Walkers are still north of the Wall, I think the northern lords will want Stannis to go away.Yeah, they will not give him armies, but they won't sabotage him in any way either. Smile and nod...and do their own thing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.