2.0 New TWOW Sample Chapter to be Released 10/29

[Ran]

Quentyn's story makes quite a lot of thematic sense, and in terms of the narrative it's the other half of the Dornish involvement that first appeared in AFfC, and no more need be said. The point of his story is, to some degree, that he dies. And that he releases the dragons while doing so.

The idea that he teleported away and that the Tattered Prince was teleported in in his place remains one of the more perniciously silly notions that has been put forward.

[The Human Abstract]

I don't think the idea is that he teleported, but that we don't see what happens offscreen. And the assumption would be the Tattered Prince is one of the folks there as well (we only have the verbal claim that he's not present).

However, I'm not that attached to this theory, as I think Quentyn being dead works very well for the story. And, Barristan's deal with the tattered prince still totally works with, of course, the real tattered prince!

As far as it being a "cheap trick"... well... this story is kinda built on cheap tricks. For example, the only real reason to say that Sandor's axe took Arya in the back of the head instead of saying more precisely it was the flat of his axe is, of course, to make the reader think she's dead. That's not the only time he pulls out this trick. And there's no way it's the last. So if you don't care for this "cheap trick", steel yourself. I guarantee it's coming again.

But, of course, the most likely candidate for this trick in the future is Jon Snow.

..

Can you imagine if the book had ended with Sandor's axe taking Arya in the back of the head.

"I don't think she's dead, man".

"Dude, she took an axe to the back of the head. Little girl's don't survive that"

"Well, maybe it was just like a glancing blow or a not-fatal hit or something"

"Professional soldier versus little girl? I think she's dead man"

"Unless he didn't want to kill her. I still think she has a purpose in the story"

"Nah, it'd be really cheap for the author to make us think she's dead when she's really not"

"Have you ever read Martin before?"

[Alhazred]

Once again you're putting words in my mouth. [...]I understand you're argumentative but c'mon man that's twice now.

The first was a joke; and if the second was a misunderstanding ... then it was a misunderstanding. The only point to the joke is that you or I disliking something (whether a porn interlude or any other kind of "cheap" writing) does not mean it will not happen.

[Alhazred]

I don't think the idea is that he teleported, but that we don't see what happens offscreen. And the assumption would be the Tattered Prince is one of the folks there as well (we only have the verbal claim that he's not present).

Yes. Thank you. I don't know where this teleportation idea came from.

As far as it being a "cheap trick"... well... this story is kinda built on cheap tricks. For example, the only real reason to say that Sandor's axe took Arya in the back of the head instead of saying more precisely it was the flat of his axe is, of course, to make the reader think she's dead. That's not the only time he pulls out this trick. And there's no way it's the last. So if you don't care for this "cheap trick", steel yourself. I guarantee it's coming again.

But, of course, the most likely candidate for this trick in the future is Jon Snow.

..

Can you imagine if the book had ended with Sandor's axe taking Arya in the back of the head.

"I don't think she's dead, man".

"Dude, she took an axe to the back of the head. Little girl's don't survive that"

"Well, maybe it was just like a glancing blow or a not-fatal hit or something"

"Professional soldier versus little girl? I think she's dead man"

"Unless he didn't want to kill her. I still think she has a purpose in the story"

"Nah, it'd be really cheap for the author to make us think she's dead when she's really not"

"Have you ever read Martin before?"

Part of the issue, of course, is that the Arya cliffhanger (and others) were not book-spanners. It is possible that some readers have less patience for this kind of thing when they span volumes, and end up fooling people for years at a time, rather than for a few hours, days or weeks.

However, if the Quentyn theory is correct, it may not originally have been meant to be a book-spanner. GRRM may have made less progress with the story than he had originally hoped or intended. The battle of Meereen that we are seeing glimpses of might have made a pretty good climax.

[Magic 8 Ball]

I archived and re-loaded it on my Kindle app on an iPhone 5. No sample chapter.

BOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[sifth]

Quentyn's story makes quite a lot of thematic sense, and in terms of the narrative it's the other half of the Dornish involvement that first appeared in AFfC, and no more need be said. The point of his story is, to some degree, that he dies. And that he releases the dragons while doing so.

The idea that he teleported away and that the Tattered Prince was teleported in in his place remains one of the more perniciously silly notions that has been put forward.

while true, were 4 chapters from his POV needed to tell us this story if his only major significance in the story is freeing Dany's dragons.

pretty sure that story could have been handled in only one or two chapters, lol

[Ran]

Well, as I said, it's also the other part of the Dornish narrative in general.

[Le Cygne]

As far as it being a "cheap trick"... well... this story is kinda built on cheap tricks. For example, the only real reason to say that Sandor's axe took Arya in the back of the head instead of saying more precisely it was the flat of his axe is, of course, to make the reader think she's dead. That's not the only time he pulls out this trick. And there's no way it's the last. So if you don't care for this "cheap trick", steel yourself. I guarantee it's coming again.

I wouldn't call it a cheap trick. Filtering Arya's POV's, Huckleberry Finn-style, since she's an unreliable narrator due to her immature outlook (her age/inexperience), the reader knows just minutes before, he saved her, she was about to get it then and he killed the guy. If he wanted her dead, he'd have let her run straight into a massacre. I thought it was pretty nicely written to show that contrast (her POV/what the reader knew was really going on, that he was trying to save her).

I archived and re-loaded it on my Kindle app on an iPhone 5. No sample chapter.

Same here, just tried, not seeing it.

[sifth]

If you have a Nook you can get it

just reload your book or call B & N up and have them re upload it for you

While it was nice to read, I still wish it were about Sansa. It's been nearly ten years since I read a chapter from her POV

[Arkash]

I agree, when I'll finally be able to read new Sansa material, I'll be so delighted !!!

[aryagonnakill]

I don't think the idea is that he teleported, but that we don't see what happens offscreen. And the assumption would be the Tattered Prince is one of the folks there as well (we only have the verbal claim that he's not present).

However, I'm not that attached to this theory, as I think Quentyn being dead works very well for the story. And, Barristan's deal with the tattered prince still totally works with, of course, the real tattered prince!

As far as it being a "cheap trick"... well... this story is kinda built on cheap tricks. For example, the only real reason to say that Sandor's axe took Arya in the back of the head instead of saying more precisely it was the flat of his axe is, of course, to make the reader think she's dead. That's not the only time he pulls out this trick. And there's no way it's the last. So if you don't care for this "cheap trick", steel yourself. I guarantee it's coming again.

But, of course, the most likely candidate for this trick in the future is Jon Snow.

..

Can you imagine if the book had ended with Sandor's axe taking Arya in the back of the head.

"I don't think she's dead, man".

"Dude, she took an axe to the back of the head. Little girl's don't survive that"

"Well, maybe it was just like a glancing blow or a not-fatal hit or something"

"Professional soldier versus little girl? I think she's dead man"

"Unless he didn't want to kill her. I still think she has a purpose in the story"

"Nah, it'd be really cheap for the author to make us think she's dead when she's really not"

"Have you ever read Martin before?"

I am not trying to insult you, but in my opinion it has been relatively obvious when a character has actually died. The instances when they don't read just like Brans fall from the tower and the instances where they do die read like Neds trip to the sept of Baelor. I did not think for a second Arya was dead. And come on dude, the sun rose in the west and set in the east.

[Cruella]

pretty sure that story could have been handled in only one or two chapters, lol

It's true for many, many, many POVs though.

It was made pretty clear in a pit scene with Dany and Quentyn that he's no "dragon". He's a good, kind, mundane guy who's made to do a lot of things but probably not for riding huge magical creatures who rain death from above.

It is also our "do not fuck with dragons" moment so that we worry more about our POV characters who will have to mount the dragons. If we only had Dany's successful attempt it would seem like easy-peasy. IMO, it makes total sense from writing perspective to show failed taiming attempt. So that when whoever next approaches dragon - Tyrion, Jon, Aegon, whoever, - we'd be on the edge of our seats.

[ApKing06]

While QM being alive is certainly interesting. QM dying also spurs things in Dorne. How will Doran Martell react to the death of his son? Arianne in the sample chapter seem to have a low opinion of Dany letting the Dothraki kill her own brother. QM's death and a lack of full understanding of Dany's motives and actions could be what pushes Dorne to back Aegon.

[Alhazred]

How will Doran Martell react to the death of his son?

Dunno. By throwing in with Faegon? It seriously looks as though he is about to do that anyway, merely because Faegon arrived first, and he really cannot wait.

Faegon and Dorne were both potential allies for Dany. But she's stuck in Meereen, so they ally with each other instead, leaving both Quentyn and Dany out in the cold.

In this context, Quentyn dying is merely convenient for Dorne and Faegon. It his his survival and the success of his mission that becomes an inconvenience, making things interesting and messy, when and if Quentyn and Dany finally arrive.

[Stallion That Mounts Texas]

Dunno. By throwing in with Faegon? It seriously looks as though he is about to do that anyway, merely because Faegon arrived first, and he really cannot wait.

Faegon and Dorne were both potential allies for Dany. But she's stuck in Meereen, so they ally with each other instead, leaving both Quentyn and Dany out in the cold.

In this context, Quentyn dying is merely convenient for Dorne and Faegon. It his his survival and the success of his mission that becomes an inconvenience, making things interesting and messy, when and if Quentyn and Dany finally arrive.

It will depend. Doran knew the mission he was sending Quentyn on was a very dangerous one. If he simply hears that Quentyn is dead, he may not lose it. He still has Arianne and Trystane.

But, if hears of Dany's rejection of Quentyn all bets will be off. Doran lost his sister and her children due to Rhaegar's actions with Lyanna. He lost his uncle Lewyn on the Trident after Aerys used Elia as a hostage. He lost his brother in a quest for vengeance. If he learns that he lost his son in connection with house Targaryen, he may lose it.

Aegon is his blood (supposedly), but Dany certainly is not. If one of the kingdoms is ripe for independence in the end, it is Dorne.

[The Human Abstract]

I am not trying to insult you, but in my opinion it has been relatively obvious when a character has actually died. The instances when they don't read just like Brans fall from the tower and the instances where they do die read like Neds trip to the sept of Baelor. I did not think for a second Arya was dead. And come on dude, the sun rose in the west and set in the east.

Well, I guess I'm just more easily fooled. Ah well. Such is my lot in life. I immediately thumbed forward in both instances to see if the character was still alive (I cheated myself).

Prior to the this, there are only 2 perspective deaths in the book, and I agree that both were very obvious. However, 2 is not enough to derive any sort of reasonable pattern from IMO.

I still don't get why the witch woman's "prophecy" needs to be fulfilled. Nor did I even think it was a prophecy. Is Khal Drago coming back? What precisely is the point?

[The Human Abstract]

I wouldn't call it a cheap trick. Filtering Arya's POV's, Huckleberry Finn-style, since she's an unreliable narrator due to her immature outlook (her age/inexperience), the reader knows just minutes before, he saved her, she was about to get it then and he killed the guy. If he wanted her dead, he'd have let her run straight into a massacre. I thought it was pretty nicely written to show that contrast (her POV/what the reader knew was really going on, that he was trying to save her).

Ok. Don't personally think it's a "cheap trick" myself. The point I'm trying to make is that if you think making the reader believe a character is dead is a "cheap trick", expect more of it. You know he will do it again.

Honestly, these little television-y tricks are part of his style and I usually enjoy them. "Breaking Bad" skipping forward in the narrative is a trick to create suspense and pique viewer interest. It is not the normal and logical way to tell a story. But I love it.

[Moon-Pale Maiden]

Quentyn's story makes quite a lot of thematic sense, and in terms of the narrative it's the other half of the Dornish involvement that first appeared in AFfC, and no more need be said. The point of his story is, to some degree, that he dies. And that he releases the dragons while doing so.

The idea that he teleported away and that the Tattered Prince was teleported in in his place remains one of the more perniciously silly notions that has been put forward.

I don't know, guys.. Ran knows George's mind better than any of us, and if he thinks Quentin is dead, it carries some weight.

Eh, I never liked Quentin anyway. He was a frog. The fallout from his death will be far more exciting than his character ever was living. Could any of you truly see Quentin riding a dragon? All I see in my mind's eye is a short, terrified man clinging desperately to a dragon's back ready to soil himself. Not a very inspiring image.

[The Human Abstract]

I don't know, guys.. Ran knows George's mind better than any of us, and if he thinks Quentin is dead, it carries some weight.

True

[Le Cygne]

Honestly, these little television-y tricks are part of his style and I usually enjoy them.

That's a good point, he does have a very visual style! I'd love to see a really faithful adaptation one day, lifting the best scenes/lines from the books the way they were written (with the necessary changes, but the essentials).