please help

[Quoth]

Tobin, I'm so sorry to hear... :grouphug:

[Waldo Frey]

If you can write up an agreement on dividing everything amicably, then you probably don't need a lawyer. If there are items heavily contested and worth a lot, then yes. You also can let the lawyer to look over the agreement too.

Can you two remain friends afterward? Many split couples do that. Sometime afterward, they even reunited again.

Whatever the reasons causes the disagreement, I sincerely hope you two can work them out instead of the split.

May peace and strength be with you.

[Mlle. Zabzie]

[quote name='Raidne' post='1563731' date='Oct 22 2008, 11.00']Tobin, I'm so sorry. If it looks like it's really going to happen, I'd recommend divorce mediation. You both hire one attorney who mediates the process between the two of you - you can also hire you own individual attorneys, or not. Just Google divorce mediation Florida and you'll find tons of links.[/quote]

That's a really good idea.

Also, as Harlot said, don't sign or promise anything until you've had time to think about it and digest the implications. It never hurts to sleep on big decisions.

[Lyanna Stark]

Oh no, Tobin I am so sorry. :(

Loads of good advice in this thread.

I'd like to add: take some time with people who are supportive and who you can trust.

Best of luck!

[Odie]

[quote name='Dancing Queen' post='1563683' date='Oct 22 2008, 09.26']If there are significant assets or children involved, I would definitely see a lawyer. I have a hard time believing his parents can override the legal process, and he might be trying to pull a fast one here since he is the one both initiating the divorce and saying he doesn't want lawyers involved.[/quote]
YES THIS. Anyone who wants to go through a divorce without lawyers is trying to pull a fast one on you. Or, at best, is really, really cheap and puts their future well-being on the back burner in order to save money.

Sorry you have to go through this. :grouphug:

[Nymeria Sand]

[quote name='Tobin' post='1563656' date='Oct 22 2008, 10.10']my sister and mother are trying to get a lawyer because they don't trust me to stand up for myself.
he said that he didn't want laywers involved because his parents would step in too - and then none of our agreements/wishes would matter.


i still can't/won't believe that there is no hope for us.


denial can be a beautiful and ugly thing[/quote]
Tobin, I'm really sorry. I've been there and it really is a tough thing. But just hang in there; it'll be okay. I know it doesn't seem like it now, but in the end this may be the best thing for you.

That said, you must [b]absolutely[/b] get a lawyer. That's not even an option. Screw his parents--it's not their lives, it's yours. He doesn't want lawyers involved because he's afraid you'll take him to the cleaners. And if he's going to let Mommy run the show, you're better off without him anyway.

Why is he saying that none of your agreements or wishes will matter if his parents get involved? That's yet another reason to make sure you have an attorney. Let the lawyers fight it out--that's what they get paid for. It will protect you, most of all, and get you a fair and equitable settlement. Without one, you could end up in poverty while he walks away with everything you've worked for. Men's standard of living [b]increases[/b] 27% in the year following a divorce. A woman's drops 30%, especially if you have children.

[Relic]

I'm so sorry =(

its not impossible to be friends after...but you should focus on yourself right now.

[naz]

Sorry to hear about this and I hope you get through it with as little pain as possible. I was going to suggest [b]mediation [/b]when I saw the thread, and noticed that Raidne already suggested it. So, I would second that suggestion (or third it?). Anyway, I've heard a lot of good things come out of mediation, especially when either party is unsure about how amicable or antagonistic the process is going to be.

At least try it out and if it doesn't work, then go the traditional lawyer route. But definitely don't try to navigate it without professional guidance if there's any chance at all that there might be even a small dispute. That's how small disputes become large ones.

Again, good luck and keep a positive outlook.

[Nymeria Sand]

[quote name='nazfyratu' post='1563791' date='Oct 22 2008, 11.34']Sorry to hear about this and I hope you get through it with as little pain as possible. I was going to suggest [b]mediation [/b]when I saw the thread, and noticed that Raidne already suggested it. So, I would second that suggestion (or third it?). Anyway, I've heard a lot of good things come out of mediation, especially when either party is unsure about how amicable or antagonistic the process is going to be.

At least try it out and if it doesn't work, then go the traditional lawyer route. But definitely don't try to navigate it without professional guidance if there's any chance at all that there might be even a small dispute. That's how small disputes become large ones.

Again, good luck and keep a positive outlook.[/quote]
But it seems to me that he is dead set against a lawyer--so to him mediation might seem like coersion if he has to get one and he really, really doesn't want to. If he doesn't want to be there, he's not going to be cooperative and might well become combative instead of reasonable. (Been there.) My ex-husband physically threatened the mediator and had to be removed, he was so resentful.

[Rhom]

As someone who went through the entire process this calendar year, I can certainly sympathize with you.

Its hard and frustrating. There's nothing worse than having to look at the person you once loved unconditionally and realizing that they are determined to cause you pain.

That said, you have to remove your emotions from this process. A divorce isn't the end of a relationship, I have learned that the relationship ends much earlier than that. A divorce is a legal proceeding, and for that you need someone with good impartial advice. Raidne's suggestion sounds like the best possible route. There were things that my ex-wife offered me when we first separated that I turned down out of some weird emotional impulse. (Like refusing the wedding and engagement rings! What the hell was I thinking??!!??) You need people you can rely on to give you that solid advice.

When that's done, the good news is that life goes on and there are plenty of people out there in the US that have been through what you have. You'll find plenty of kindred spirits to lean on. That's long term though, in the short run I wish you the best of luck in difficult times. :grouphug:

[Nymeria Sand]

[quote]That said, you have to remove your emotions from this process.[/quote]
Absolutely agree. You can't make decisions of this magnitude if your emotions are clouding the issue. Think of it as you would any other business transaction. That way you keep your sanity and your half of your distribution.

[quote](Like refusing the wedding and engagement rings! What the hell was I thinking??!!??)[/quote]
You wouldn't have gotten much for them anyway; at least, probably not what you paid for them. LOL They're not meant to be re-sold and the diamonds aren't worth anything. It's the metal they want.

Then again, I was divorced before eBay was invented, so maybe I just didn't wait long enough to try to sell mine.

[Arakasi]

I didn't know your husband well Tobin, but from your time in WoW with us I feel sad about this. My condolences and hope you pull through this okay.

[ztemhead]

I've also been divorced. *shrugs* we were okay dating, but married life together was a horrible idea, and I let myself get pressured into it.

I also recommend hiring a lawyer especially if there's assets to be split or kids to be taken care of. In my divorce all we had was a hosue which we agreed to split 50/50 so it was no big deal. I also got to keep the big orange cat as he was mine from before the marriage. ;)

I was notified by e mail when the paperwork was done. :) I suppose I could have gotten part of her family trust if I had pressed the issue, (community property state and all) but I didn't want to be too much of a jerk about it. Regardless, it didn't stop her martyr complex afterwards, bitching to any and every-one how she is a "divorced woman on her own" as though she had been home making babies for the last twenty years...

I recommend getting a lawyer because I meet recently divorced women all the time in my work, and it's often, but not always, the same story. Woman is very emotional, and just wants this chapter to be over so she can move on. The husband is better at compartmentalizing his feelings and being patient, so he hires the attorney and gets off as cheaply or quickly as he can. If you have kids, or you have money, don't be that girl. Get the attorney.

now breathe...

[Guest Raidne]

[quote name='Bowed Bent Broken' post='1563842' date='Oct 22 2008, 11.59']I suppose I could have gotten part of her family trust if I had pressed the issue, (community property state and all) but I didn't want to be too much of a jerk about it.[/quote]

Just to reassure you, I believe trusts are treated as separate property, regardless of whether they became her property before or after the marriage. At least they were in Texas, which is also a community property state with the usual rules, and I believe I looked into it a couple of years back for a friend in Tuscon.

[AndyP]

I am sorry to hear that.

[url="http://retrouvaille.org/"]Retrouvaille[/url] saved my marriage. The initial commitment is only for a weekend with follow up only if you want it. The cost is no more than for a weekend in a hotel. If your husband is willing to try for one weekend then it is well worth it. Warning : Sponsored by the Catholic church but religion isn't pushed on you. The people who run it are primarily interested in saving your marriage not pushing God. The presenters are couples with troubled marriages themselves (and I mean troubled) who have probably experienced many of the same things you have.

[Rhom]

[quote name='Nymeria Sand' post='1563809' date='Oct 22 2008, 11.41']You wouldn't have gotten much for them anyway; at least, probably not what you paid for them. LOL They're not meant to be re-sold and the diamonds aren't worth anything. It's the metal they want.[/quote]

That was pretty much my reasoning behind not wanting them... knowing how much I paid and how little I might get back. Then someone told me that some jewelry stores will actually trade them in for near full value towards the purchase of a more expensive ring. I have no plans to run out and get remarried anytime soon... but that would buy one heckuva engagement ring for a future lady!!! :lol:

I don't mean to hi-jack the serious nature of this thread. So I'll leave my pithy comments at that.

[Pebble thats Stubby]

I am so sorry :grouphug:

I would also say mediation sounds like good advise. but before you offically agree to anything from the mediation process you need to make sure you have not "caved" where you really shouldn't, your own lawyer here just to give things the once over may be needed. - Hey if everything is ok, then there will be no need for your ex to get one as well.

Do consider personal counsiling. Friends and relatives can be very supportive, but often they are too involved.

Whatever you do, take caer of yourself. don't give up on your future, no matter how bleak it gets. your life will get better.

[ztemhead]

[quote name='Raidne' post='1563848' date='Oct 22 2008, 09.02']Just to reassure you, I believe trusts are treated as separate property, regardless of whether they became her property before or after the marriage. At least they were in Texas, which is also a community property state with the usual rules, and I believe I looked into it a couple of years back for a friend in Tuscon.[/quote]

[thread drift...]
perhaps. though the way grandma structured it, she had received at least two shares of it valued at $11,000 each, which says to me a completed gift removed from grandma's estate. I might be wrong about the terminology, and whether it was a family trust or not, but I'm pretty sure the way it was done it qualifies as a marital asset. It was one of those situations where grandma and her advisors were careful to never tell the fam exactly what she was doing, except that they were going to be beneficiaries of something, someday. She could have a $20Million insurance policy for all I know. Further, I could sense a noticable change in the ex's attitude, which is how I got the impression there was money there if I wanted it. *shrugs* I didn't care though, I just wanted to moveon.org, or have something to use if she tried to make things hard for me.

In another thread sometime we should discuss the pros and cons of community property states versus sole and separate, or whatever they're called.

[TheBigTEA]

I am actually going through my divorce right now...and I am really sorry to hear that anyone else has to go through it as well. All you can do is try and take care of yourself and don't get depressed...easy to say than to do I know.

You have my sympathies though and I wish you the best of luck.

Ty

[Guest Raidne]

[quote name='Bowed Bent Broken' post='1563885' date='Oct 22 2008, 12.26']In another thread sometime we should discuss the pros and cons of community property states versus sole and separate, or whatever they're called.[/quote]

Like now? I'll work one up. It's a subject I'm pretty interested in, and I feel pretty bad about getting off topic in this thread.

:grouphug: Tobin. Lots of good advice in this thread - I agree with all Z and others have said about compartmentalization and the typical financial state of women after divorce, as well.