Are you a Male Sansa fan? Please come and tell me why? and is your a female fan also come share the love.

[Luciferase_3H]

I think she has had one of the best arcs so far, along with Theon. I disliked her quite a bit in the first book, but again as you mentioned, it's nice to see a pretty and unimposing girl play the game of thrones after much trial and tribulations without turning into an emasculated fembot. I don't "like" her as a character, but I appreciate what she means to the story.

[Pod The Impaler]

I guess I am a Sansa fan, though she's not may favourite character (Arya is, then a few others).

I do enjoy reading the Sansa chapters, moreso on the re-reads. Sansa's a tough character to get into right away, because what goes on in them is so internal.

Sansa's story is the Damsel In Distress concept gone mad. She consciously tried to model herself on those ladies from in-story fairytales (about Jonquil and so on), and to become the perfect daughter, the perfect lady, the perfect princess, and so on. She lived this stereotype to the point where she was actually quite arrogant, self-centered, two-faced, shallow, spoiled, and vain. In other words, she was a lot of things which I (and many others) tend to dislike. She's not truly evil, so she's not going to turn into Ramsay Snow or Cersei Lannister, but in AGOT she comes off as weak and vapid, and a bit of an anchor around her family's neck. However, GRRM is clever in the way he wrote her, in that her story is a reminder that the Damsel In Distress stories have to involve the pure-hearted damsel actually being in horrible captivity and/or mortal peril. It's that whole "be careful what you wish for" thing, because she becomes a tormented pawn, surrounded by sadistic royals, brutalizing false knights, and various creeps and liars. Her only (real) protectors are a surly huge brute and a despised dwarf, both of whom are physically and psychologically scarred, not to mention being significant figures among her enemies. All the others who seem helpful end up one way or another proving false or failures. Really, all she can do is rely on herself for protection, and in warfare terms she's utterly harmless. All she has is her charm (as a traitor's daughter) and her wits (as she is being denigrated as stupid) and her beauty (which attracts sexual menace like a magnet). She is living proof that damsel-in-distress stories are not at all enjoyable when you're the damsel. (And yet, her fans still yearn for the happy ending & some affirmation of true love). The fairy-tale example here is both deconstructed / inverted, and at the same time it is affirmed.

Sansa the character has some very positive points too. Her naive outlook is a sort of liability at first, but you soon see this is because for all her top-girl snottiness at the beginning, she really is quite innocent. In her sheltered state, she has created a world-view where her sister Arya is The Villain - Sansa's POV thoughts show Arya as a sort of wicked Loki figure who is capricious and unruly and strives to sow discord in Sansa's perfectly lovely world. Of course Sansa eventually meets up with the real world with its horrifying adult problems, and sees what real villainy looks like. Eventually, her basic sort of goodness and innocence comes to be a sort of unusual strength. Sansa's begun to show her perceptive side, and an ability to use her charm and wits to both defend herself and manipulate people, but while one might on the surface rejoice that she might become a more serious "game player", the question becomes whether she can do so without turning into some sort of "fallen woman" thanks to the nature of the game itself. As Alayne, she has learned a bit of self-reliance and gained a sort of backhanded appreciation of bastards, but the cost is that she cannot be herself and has to follow a script written by someone else.

Last seen, Littlefinger was trying to seduce her, and we do not know whether she will accept or reject his advances. There are so many possible paths for Sansa's personality to take, and this is just two of them. Most of the major characters in the story have been the subject of one or more cliffhangers, but Sansa's one of the rare ones where the cliffhanger is not a question of whether a character is alive or dead, but rather a moral cliffhanger. (And what an unconventional bit of writing that is, particularly in this genre.) Readers know what they hope will happen and rarely speak what they fear might happen.

I suppose this is what makes Sansa an interesting bit of reading, and I learned to feel for her as a character because she is very human. Sansa's early failings are not really that unusual, considering she is a typical 11 year old girl, one who has (up to that point) been quite successful being just that. Now she has to get through life in circumstances which didn't just set aside out the rule book, but burnt it to cinders right before her eyes. Sansa is this kind of character, and if you look at all the major female characters in ASOIAF, you do not really get two that are alike.

[Florina Laufeyson]

When ever I check out from Pawn to Player I feel totally out of place

To be fair, so do i. Some of that discussion goes in places i do not wish to venture or i feel has little relevance to Sansa as a whole. So i sorta dont go in there. And discussion about Sansa's flaws is usually shot down.

[Sansa_Stark]

To be fair, so do i. Some of that discussion goes in places i do not wish to venture or i feel has little relevance to Sansa as a whole. So i sorta dont go in there. And discussion about Sansa's flaws is usually shot down.

The hardest circlejerking on this board involves Sansa. It honestly annoyed me enough to dislike her character.

[Ser Creighton]

The hardest circlejerking on this board involves Sansa. It honestly annoyed me enough to dislike her character.

You know your screen name is Sansa right?

[Sansa_Stark]

You know your screen name is Sansa right?

i didnt notice r u trolling me!!?? But in all seriousness I hated her for a while bit then had a recent reread. See sig.

[Ser Creighton]

To be fair, so do i. Some of that discussion goes in places i do not wish to venture or i feel has little relevance to Sansa as a whole. So i sorta dont go in there. And discussion about Sansa's flaws is usually shot down.

You know I wasn't even joking about the Bieber thing, last time I looked in there they were having a Sansa party, freaked me out.

I don't like any thread you go in where can't talk about the good and the bad with a character. Martin wrote them with flaws for a reason, tells you they are flawed and then you get these perfect character threads. And I get the relevance thing, that stuff drives me nuts but at the same time I understand that people are searching for topics to talk about. Only so many relevant angles you can take, and after almost a decade with no new Sansa chapters, shit is going to get weird. For most of the characters, thats why so many threads and topics repeat. I think 9 years in October was the last Sansa chapter. Plus I notice with this kind of dark fantasy, fans are often desperate for good things for their favorite character, so they tend to make things up and try to force them to make sense. I personally have excepted the fact that most of the characters will do stupid shit, make mistakes and probably get killed. Even the characters I like, while somehow I know the ones I don't like will get away with outlandish plot armored shit. Like the Mountain.

[Sansa_Stark]

You know I wasn't even joking about the Bieber thing, last time I looked in there they were having a Sansa party, freaked me out.

I don't like any thread you go in where can't talk about the good and the bad with a character. Martin wrote them with flaws for a reason.

Thank you. I agree with this so much. Its part of what makes these books so great. The characters make mistakes. I generally wonder...the characters in this series aren't mary sues.

[Ser Creighton]

i didnt notice r u trolling me!!?? But in all seriousness I hated her for a while bit then had a recent reread. See sig.

Yes I was, but you did say you disliked her. I am on my Iphone so your sig is a bit tiny. I think it says "Farm of Sand snakes the god and the bed, nut to mentos every being in belize, shed no I patch. Shrek human."

Just a guess but I might be struggling with your sig, or you speak a wonderful new form of broken english. I will go with new form of broken english, and I love it, tell me what do you think Mentos means?

[Sansa_Stark]

Yes I was, but you did say you disliked her. I am on my Iphone so your sig is a bit tiny. I think it says "Farm of Sand snakes the god and the bed, nut to mentos every being in belize, shed no I patch. Shrek human."

Just a guess but I might be struggling with your sig, or you speak a wonderful new form of broken english. I will go with new form of broken english, and I love it, tell me what do you think Mentos means?

mentos aren't those chocolates?

[The Weirwoods Eyes]

No I think they are a chewy mint?

[Stoned Dragon]

MSF

I enjoy Sansa, oddly enough, because of something Lady Dustin says to Theon -- Starks melt south of the Neck. In the last two decades, Sansa's grandfather, uncle, father, and brother had all marched south (or, in Lyanna's case, were kidnapped and taken south) and she's the only one that has ever survived. Robb won every battle, but even that wasn't enough to survive in the South. Realizing that made Sansa way more interesting, and it put her accomplishments into perspective.

I can't imagine a resolution to the military or political intrigues in the South that doesn't involve Sansa -- she's the alleged bastard daughter of the Lord Paramount of the Riverlands and Lord Protector of the Vale, which is filled with food and a fresh army. She's also one of the few confirm-able Starks in Westeros (and the only one south of the Neck). Her estranged husband will (probably) end up in Dany's inner circle. Her bastard half-brother is the LC of the Night's Watch, which is where Stannis has his seat. Just like Bran is going to be instrumental in the supernatural storyline, or how Jon will be instrumental in the oncoming War for the Dawn, Sansa feels super important to whatever ends up happening in the political game of thrones.

[Mark Antony]

and she's the only one that has ever survived.

:cheers:

Arya survived! :D

[Ser Creighton]

mentos aren't those chocolates?

Well braking down the word Men coming from the binary latin meaning Male, and and as we know Tos comes from the ancient Egyptian glyph of the thrower, or to throw. Thus I believe the word means to throw a man. Perhaps a sport in Westeros. The Mentos or Man toss it is probably really popular.

[Stoned Dragon]

:cheers:

Arya survived! :D

Whoops! Totally forgot.

But thinking about it, Arya's feat probably isn't as impressive as Sansa's -- if only because of Arya managed to escape King's Landing and land amongst the NW and the BWB, both pro-Stark. She then falls under the protection of a Faceless Man and the Hound, the latter Sansa softened up a bit. Arya is kicking but, but Sansa's feat is incredible given where she started from and what game she's having to play.

[Table8]

I think she has had one of the best arcs so far, along with Theon.

This

[Pecan]

I'm a guy and I'm a fan. To me, it's the evolution of the character from pawn to player that's so interesting. She lost her wolf and she lost her pack and now she's under the control of Littlefinger, the greatest monster in the series. To me, this is the most suspenseful, gripping, dramatic plotline that we have in the series (more than Jon even, since we GRRM has a plan to make him not dead), and it's killing me that don't know yet what's going on in the Vale.

[Le Cygne]

Also tummy is a cute word :D

I am a Sansa fan but I don't want to ever see that word again.

Oh, and it doesn't help that Sansa is attractive and knows it. Good looking people, in the sci-fi world, should never know they are good looking. That's the trick.

She has to know it, people keep telling her she is. There are down sides to being pretty, and unwanted attention is number one. Would Littlefinger be pawing all over her if she was plain?

I also admire how he hasn't lost her humanity or became too overly bitter about her circumstances. I am looking forward to Sansa figuring out that LF is pretty much the main contributing factor to her fathers death and then taking vengeance on him.

She, who has a right like no one else to only look out for herself, still feels for those who are more (and sometimes less) unlucky than her. She even cares for Sweetrobin a good bit, and he would make almost anyone want to throw him on a wall in less than a week.

I agree and this comprises so much of the debate of how to portray the feminine experience, making that experience heroic. In this way, I very much enjoy Sansa's story. It's almost as if GRRM drew an Austen heroine with the Sansa character insofar as what is ostensibly so ordinarily feminine is made extraordinary and dramatic.

Yes to all of these!

I don't agree at all, I really don't see Sansa looking up to Baelish at all. I wish I hadn't loaned my books out but there is a quote where she defies him in her internal monologue that he is not her father that she is Sansa Stark THE BLOOD OF WINTERFELL. I think she is intelligent enough to nod and smile and bide her time. LF is the one being deceived.

Madam, your quote:

I am not your daughter, she thought. I am Sansa Stark, Lord Eddards daughter and Lady Catelyns, the blood of Winterfell.

Both characters retain a gentle femininity about them. Marianne grows to care for Colonel Brandon, the dude who loved her for just the way she was: Unspoiled, innocent, cheerful. Sansa has yet to have her happy ending, but she will have to earn it.

Just an incidental note, in Sense and Sensibility, Marianne is 16, Colonel Brandon 35.

As Alayne, she has learned a bit of self-reliance and gained a sort of backhanded appreciation of bastards, but the cost is that she cannot be herself and has to follow a script written by someone else.

Last seen, Littlefinger was trying to seduce her, and we do not know whether she will accept or reject his advances.

I meant to answer this one, too. In that last chapter, she's thinking about "another kiss" - with another man - in the same chapter Littlefinger asks for "another kiss" - this is setting up conflict. We also have a good idea she's going to remember that kiss again, GRRM says she remembers in later volumeS (plural), likely the chapter that was moved from ADWD to TWOW, it's going to come up again. The story she's writing for herself (what Sansa wants) vs. the story he's writing for her (what Littlefinger wants). THAT'S the conflict. And that's what the cliffhanger is about. They are about to butt heads.

[Jack's Smirking Revenge]

Whoops! Totally forgot.

But thinking about it, Arya's feat probably isn't as impressive as Sansa's -- if only because of Arya managed to escape King's Landing and land amongst the NW and the BWB, both pro-Stark. She then falls under the protection of a Faceless Man and the Hound, the latter Sansa softened up a bit. Arya is kicking but, but Sansa's feat is incredible given where she started from and what game she's having to play.

I'd say both feats are equally impressive. Arya may have fallen into the hands of "friendlier" hands but Arya has been through as much shit as Sansa. Arya was saved by Yoren but Yoren ended up being killed along with most of the other NW recruits and Arya then experienced captivity under GREGOR CLEGANE and watched the Tickler torture dozens of people. At any moment Arya could have fallen victim to their sadistic tendencies. Neither the NW or the BWB were "pro-Stark", just because they didn't rape or abuse Arya doesn't mean that they were pro-Stark. It is true that Both helped Arya but Sansa was also helped by the fact that she needed to be kept alive while Jaime was in captivity and that she was later married to Tyrion who had little desire to brutalize her. As for falling under the protection of the Hound, yes he saved her from running to her death in the RW but it was Arya who helped the Hound by killing the squire and the Tickler.

I sometimes wonder if some Sansa fans forget or dismiss what Arya has went through and has done to survive. Arya has seen people senselessly murdered, tortured, and raped and she's been forced to kill to survive. Arya has suffered as much as Sansa.

As to the point of this thread, I've always been more of a fan of Arya but I appreciate and like Sansa as a character and her chapters are almost always interesting.

[The Weirwoods Eyes]

Thank you LeClgyne for providing that quote, I am regretting loaning out my books. You don't realise just how much you use them till they are not there.

Jacks Smirking REvenge. I love Arya too she's my third favourate character, I don't think at all that one has to be on Team Sansa OR Team Arya. Some of us are just Team Stark. :wideeyed: