Boarders writing a novel, Part 11

[Tellus Explorer]

Weirdly, the biggest motivator for me at the moment is the fact that it's interfering with my reading - as soon as I start reading I just start thinking about my own idea and I can't concentrate. I think I just need to get it out of my system. Exorcise as opposed to exercise.

Oh gosh! That's the same for me! I start reading and all to soon I get all these ideas pop in my head like a movie, that I must write down, because just as quickly they come, they vanish :leaving: like I wasn't even thinking them up..... Which I find irritating

[Starkess]

Mazel tov! I'm in the waiting process (glacial on a fast day) and chiseling (another way to write) away on the contemp. Kind of itching to get back into fantasy, but I want to get this contemp done first. 21k in out of a projected 65k.

I know the feeling! The one that I am doing a major edit on right now is sci fi, and while I'm really happy with it, I have to corral myself from running away to write another fantasy. (And halfway through that one I would start to miss spaceships!)

[Ebenstone]

I know the feeling! The one that I am doing a major edit on right now is sci fi, and while I'm really happy with it, I have to corral myself from running away to write another fantasy. (And halfway through that one I would start to miss spaceships!)

I'm fighting the urge to write a fantasy. But I wrote down a plan, we'll see if I can follow it.

[Derfel Cadarn]

I've converted the first 11 chapters (and prologue) of my novel to a format compatible with kindle (and similar I think). If anyone's interested in reading these chapters in a format easier to read than Word, PM me your kindle email and I'll forward it. Any feedback is appreciated.

[HexMachina]

Hey there, new to this thread but some of you know me from elsewhere. I've never written a novel or anything, but I have always wanted to. And recently I came up with some ideas that I would really like to translate into a finished piece of work. However, I have no idea qhere to start. Should I make a derailed plan first? Just start writing? Jot down my ideas? Any help ia appreciated thanks :)

[First of My Name]

Hey there, new to this thread but some of you know me from elsewhere. I've never written a novel or anything, but I have always wanted to. And recently I came up with some ideas that I would really like to translate into a finished piece of work. However, I have no idea qhere to start. Should I make a derailed plan first? Just start writing? Jot down my ideas? Any help ia appreciated thanks :)

Just start writing, IMO, and jot down the things you don't want to forget. Good luck!

[Ebenstone]

Hey there, new to this thread but some of you know me from elsewhere. I've never written a novel or anything, but I have always wanted to. And recently I came up with some ideas that I would really like to translate into a finished piece of work. However, I have no idea qhere to start. Should I make a derailed plan first? Just start writing? Jot down my ideas? Any help ia appreciated thanks :)

Figure out what is best for you and start writing. GRRM put it best:

“I think there are two types of writers, the architects and the gardeners. The architects plan everything ahead of time, like an architect building a house. They know how many rooms are going to be in the house, what kind of roof they're going to have, where the wires are going to run, what kind of plumbing there's going to be. They have the whole thing designed and blueprinted out before they even nail the first board up. The gardeners dig a hole, drop in a seed and water it. They kind of know what seed it is, they know if planted a fantasy seed or mystery seed or whatever. But as the plant comes up and they water it, they don't know how many branches it's going to have, they find out as it grows. And I'm much more a gardener than an architect.”

I'm an architect with flexiblilty to change things in the writing, but we're all different.

[Frank Fitzpatrick]

Figure out what is best for you and start writing. GRRM put it best:

“I think there are two types of writers, the architects and the gardeners. The architects plan everything ahead of time, like an architect building a house. They know how many rooms are going to be in the house, what kind of roof they're going to have, where the wires are going to run, what kind of plumbing there's going to be. They have the whole thing designed and blueprinted out before they even nail the first board up. The gardeners dig a hole, drop in a seed and water it. They kind of know what seed it is, they know if planted a fantasy seed or mystery seed or whatever. But as the plant comes up and they water it, they don't know how many branches it's going to have, they find out as it grows. And I'm much more a gardener than an architect.”

I'm an architect with flexiblilty to change things in the writing, but we're all different.

As much as I agree with this, I think whenever someone approaches their first project, the best thing to do is get their head down and write. Don't get bogged down in the planning stage. I've heard so many people say to me that they've spent so much time planning their novel that the idea grew stale and they gave up before they ever started.

[HexMachina]

Just start writing, IMO, and jot down the things you don't want to forget. Good luck!

Thank you! :) I wrote down my ideas, then went to start writing and...nothing. Everything I started just felt wrong. So, I've set aside the writing stage for the time being to develop my ideas on characters, the plot etc. Hopefully inspiration will strike me at some point and I will work out how to start properly

[SpaceChampion]

What if you have to wait twenty years for "inspiration" to strike? That seems to me a way too precious concept of what creativity and artistry is. I don't believe in waiting around to accidentally stumble into a great story. There are things you can do to guide your own thinking and call forth your own creativity.

I recommend taking a look at Dramatica. Not the software, the book of theory on that link (online version is identical to the ebook).

However, don't take it too prescriptively. I think the logic, organization and structure of it is correct, but the specific options for themes and plot looks to me like it's insufficient and limited. The software holds you their intuitively-derived "Table of Elements", but you'll do much better to come up with your own on paper. Promoters of the concept go on about how Dramatica is Science! It is Math! Yet I read elsewhere how parts of it were conceived after waking up from a dream. No science to it, not even basic psychological research about personality traits, even though the table is suppose to relate aspects of the mind, and the concept behind it is that stories function like minds working out a "grand argument".

The parts i like include the idea of dynamic pairs for themes and plot, though I prefer to create my own table; the working out of a problem from four perspectives; and thus Act and scene structure being an iteration through each of four perspectives, dynamics pairs, contrasting characters and contrasting themes.

That said, even as is it is a vast improvement over the dumb hero's journey monomyth concept. [The hero's journey is fundamentally about a spiritual change in the protagonist, but not all stories are about spiritual change.]

[Frank Fitzpatrick]

Thank you! :) I wrote down my ideas, then went to start writing and...nothing. Everything I started just felt wrong. So, I've set aside the writing stage for the time being to develop my ideas on characters, the plot etc. Hopefully inspiration will strike me at some point and I will work out how to start properly

I agree with Space Champ, unfortunately and ultimately it all comes down to hard work.

Published and unpublished writers alike all have bad days, days were you struggle to think of anything half decent, days were you want to give up and spend your time doing something much more fun, but the key is to write anyway. There's no secret formula, no easy way around it, it all just comes down to sitting down at your desk and writing, even if what you write is garbage. That's what revisions are for.

Good luck.

[HexMachina]

Hmm, you are probably right of course. :dunce: I suppose I will just make the effort and write what I want to say without embellishment, then go back and add to it. Since you (obviously) write yourselves, do you ever find yourself writing the middle before the beginning? I think that is what I am struggling most with, introducing story. (Although I have quite a good idea of what my first chapter is going to be, once I find the right way to tell it)

[Frank Fitzpatrick]

Hmm, you are probably right of course. :dunce: I suppose I will just make the effort and write what I want to say without embellishment, then go back and add to it. Since you (obviously) write yourselves, do you ever find yourself writing the middle before the beginning? I think that is what I am struggling most with, introducing story. (Although I have quite a good idea of what my first chapter is going to be, once I find the right way to tell it)

Erm, my first ever attempt at writing was a Fantasy book (I'm now on my third Thriller) and I wrote each POV at a time, but it became an absolute mess later on. Other than that, not really. Before I start I usually have three chapters in mind. The beginning, a middle and an end. Everything else appears by discovery throughout the first and second drafts. Although, I've heard it's not uncommon for well-known writers to begin a good deal in and work their way backwards, I just wouldn't recommend it. But everyone writes differently, I have a very linear writing brain, not everyone else will do.

I'd recommend listening to the Writing Excuses podcast (they're free and only 15-20 minutes per episode), I've found some of it helpful/ interesting, maybe it'll give you some ideas too.

[HexMachina]

Thank you for your words of advice and encouragement. I've sat down tonight and finished the first draft of the first chapter. I need to add in details and such like now, but its done. And I feel I know where I will go noext with it. I appreciate the advice :)

[Arthmail]

Write every day, no matter what, and move forward, not back. Your next drafts are for working out the details, don't be concerned with endless plot consistency on the first draft. The first draft is to crush out the words and then take a step back, evaluate, and then return with a clear idea of what has happened.

There is nothing mystical about the process. It's work. And honestly, the idea that one can just sit down and pump out something that they like the first time that they write is ridiculous. Its like any profession, it takes time and dedication. I finished the first draft of my book when I graduated high school in 1997. I tinkered with that piece of shit for a decade. Four years ago I decided to write something new, and I've finished four books since. I'm working on editing the first three for a self-published release (its how I feel the market is going, I'm not keen on being dictated to), come this august. So it takes time. The first ten years I did what a lot of people do, pull it out, fuck about, do world building, wave my hands about what was going on and not really just dig my hands in and go.

Something else that helped - read. Now, don't read for fun. I mean run your fingers through the guts of another authors work and see how he makes it work. I came to my first understanding of how to write with GRRM. I didn't read the words, I read how he did it. Dialogue, internal monologues, that sort of thing. Find an author that suits you and then start to build your own skill set.

But in truth, its going to be years of slogging about on your own. Expect it. If you don't you're always going to struggle with it. There are so very few that are simply brilliant out of the gate as to be a non-statistic.

[Zoë Sumra]

Something else that helped - read. Now, don't read for fun. I mean run your fingers through the guts of another authors work and see how he makes it work. I came to my first understanding of how to write with GRRM. I didn't read the words, I read how he did it. Dialogue, internal monologues, that sort of thing. Find an author that suits you and then start to build your own skill set.

This. I'm currently working my way through A Popular Thriller Author's entire output (or as much of it is in my local library) to work out how he evolved his writing style from golden age to modern era, as he's one of the few who bridge the two generations - I'm very familiar with golden age thriller structuring but not so familiar with modern. Everything is a learning opportunity.

[Tellus Explorer]

This. I'm currently working my way through A Popular Thriller Author's entire output (or as much of it is in my local library) to work out how he evolved his writing style from golden age to modern era, as he's one of the few who bridge the two generations - I'm very familiar with golden age thriller structuring but not so familiar with modern. Everything is a learning opportunity.

I agree with that 'Everything is a learning opportunity'

I read all types of genres and several different authors, and it definitely helps when your writing. IMO

[C.T. Phipps]

I got a three book contract from Permuted Press. The first one should be out next Summer.

So much Squee.

(Lot of hard work to get there though)

I wish other boarders luck and good will.

[Frank Fitzpatrick]

I got a three book contract from Permuted Press. The first one should be out next Summer.

So much Squee.

(Lot of hard work to get there though)

I wish other boarders luck and good will.

That's brilliant news! Congratulations. A three book deal? Wow, that's really impressive.

[Tellus Explorer]

I got a three book contract from Permuted Press. The first one should be out next Summer.

So much Squee.

(Lot of hard work to get there though)

I wish other boarders luck and good will.

Congratulations, that is too cool, I don't know you but I hope you the best :D