A Character you don't understand why the fandom/forum likes and hates?

[Lord Thornhart]

Well, I mostly like Stannis due to his portrayal on the HBO show (really didn't like him before). I think Stephen Dillane does a fantastic job and he gives Stannis humanity that he lacks in the books (at least earlier).

I still very much like Renly and am somewhat neutral towards Danny. Sorry to be pointing fingers, but I believe, that it is mostly the Stannis fans who have the most bipolar view (like Melisandre :-)) and tend to steer most threads into the worship/hate territory.

I really like Stephan Dillane as an actor. I think if he played the role of Stannis similar to his proptrayal of Thomas Jefferson and shaved the top of his head, he'd be great. What bugs me about his HBO character is that he doesn't make any sense. Dumb&Dumber combined parts of his pyromaniac wife into Stannis to make him more hatable, and now his character doesn't make any sense. Now he lets Meli burn anything because he thinks it gives him power and at the same time he doesn't care about her? WTF? And how could Stannis have not had humanity when he told about how he's been screwed over by everyone, came to the realization that he loved Renly, became The King Who Cared, etc.?

When your favorite character has been butchered, you naturally feel pretty synical about it. I don't mind book Stannis hate in the slightest (though I don't understand it), but HBO Stannis hate really gets under my skin.

[E-Ro]

I have seen people compare Stannis to Rorschach, Alan Moore publicly said he was surprised people liked Rorschach, that's all I said. Get over it.

Whaaaaat? I think you quoted the wrong post dude. Has nothing to do with what I said

[Annara Snow]

Well, I mostly like Stannis due to his portrayal on the HBO show (really didn't like him before). I think Stephen Dillane does a fantastic job and he gives Stannis humanity that he lacks in the books (at least earlier).

I still very much like Renly and am somewhat neutral towards Danny. Sorry to be pointing fingers, but I believe, that it is mostly the Stannis fans who have the most bipolar view (like Melisandre :-)) and tend to steer most threads into the worship/hate territory.

As much as I love Sansa and as much as I consider Sansa lovers to be very insightful posters, I noticed that they often get "blinded" by their love for the little bird when it comes to Tyrion. Insisting that Tyrion is an evil and horrible scumbag, because he didn't want to betray his family and endanger his brother by smuggling Sansa out of King's Landing.

What I don't understand is why Tyrion has to be either an evil and horrible scumbag, or a white knight hero who saves fair maidens who are supposed to be eternally grateful to him, instead of what he actually is, a realistically portrayed, usually pragmatic, flawed man with good and bad sides. It's silly to think that Tyrion is evil and horrible scumbag because he didn't want to betray his family and endanger his brother's life, but it's also silly to claim that Tyrion was Sansa's white knight because he didn't rape her and because he stopped Joffrey from publicly beating and humiliating a valuable hostage/Joffrey's future betrothed, at the time when doing so posed no risk for Tyrion whatsoever, physically or politically. Putting that in the same breath as Jaime trying to protect Brienne from Vargo Hoat and the Bloody Mummers and stepping into the ring one-handed to fight a bear, as the OP did... yeah, that's just absurd.

I also don't understand why every other character (Dany, Jaime, etc.) has to be either a shining flawless hero or a mad villain. Kind of ironic that this is the fandom of a series known for its greyness and moral ambiguity.

[Nictarion]

Whaaaaat? I think you quoted the wrong post dude. Has nothing to do with what I said

The post Bronn responded to was mine.

And just for the record the first time I heard the Rorschach comparison wrt an author being surprised by how a character was received was one of Elio and Linda's YouTube videos. And I felt it was a pretty accurate comparison to Stannis tbh.

[OnionAhaiReborn]

The post Bronn responded to was mine.

And just for the record the first time I heard the Rorschach comparison wrt an author being surprised by how a character was received was one of Elio and Linda's YouTube videos. And I felt it was a pretty accurate comparison to Stannis tbh.

You think GRRM is surprised that people like a character he called 'righteous'? Doubt it. If anything I think he'd be shocked and disappointed in your hate for Stan.

[To catch a Lannister]

You think GRRM is surprised that people like a character he called 'righteous'? Doubt it. If anything I think he'd be shocked and disappointed in your hate for Stan.

Bingooooooo.

As for the OP:

Don't understand the love for Daenerys: Obvious answer is obvious. I've wondered this for two years now. Maybe people just love the fact half her dialogue is in caps lock

Don't understand the hate for Victarion: After my reread Victarion has become one of my favorite characters, he's badass. He can fight, lead ships, has honor, and is fairly complex. Whatever, he's stupid who cares. AFFC was basically one giant book about how stupid Cersei and people still like her(why that's beyond me).

[Bronn Urgandy]

Right back at ya.

I have seen people compare Stannis to Rorschach, Alan Moore publicly said he was surprised people liked Rorschach, that's all I said. Get over it.

The post Bronn responded to was mine.

And just for the record the first time I heard the Rorschach comparison wrt an author being surprised by how a character was received was one of Elio and Linda's YouTube videos. And I felt it was a pretty accurate comparison to Stannis tbh.

I hadn't seen your post when I made mine, I have had people say "Stannis is clearly not meant to be likeable." So I stand by what I said. If your meaning wasnt what I've put in quotations but instead the author merely being surprised then I'll disagree to an extent but have no problem with your comment.

I just have a problem when people tell me I am wrong and then use their 2 dimensial interpretation of the books to put words in the authors mouth to tell me I am wrong. Which is what I think E-Ro was agreeing with.

[Nictarion]

You think GRRM is surprised that people like a character he called 'righteous'? Doubt it. If anything I think he'd be shocked and disappointed in your hate for Stan.

Considering right before that he said "despite everything" I'd say it's possible.

And for the record I don't "hate" Stannis. I just dont get all the love he gets on this board. I enjoy Davos and Melisandre well enough that I enjoy Stannis' storyline, even if I'm not big on him personally.

[Nictarion]

I hadn't seen your post when I made mine, I have had people say "Stannis is clearly not meant to be likeable." So I stand by what I said. If your meaning wasnt what I've put in quotations but instead the author merely being surprised then I'll disagree to an extent but have no problem with your comment.

I just have a problem when people tell me I am wrong and then use their 2 dimensial interpretation of the books to put words in the authors mouth to tell me I am wrong. Which is what I think E-Ro was agreeing with.

Oh ok my apologies for the mix up then. I obviously don't know Martin's feelings on him, it's just speculating on my part.

[Faydra]

Or Robert, Olenna and Tyrion? :)

-killed people (Marq Grafton and other loyalists) for being loyal (as if you're morally bound to support every rebel you come across)

-gave no damn about Elia's fate and that of her dragonspawn

-pardoneded the men who laid before him dead children shrouded in bloody cloaks

-bankrupted the realm

-raped and beated Cersei

-neglected his heir to the throne and engaged the beast to his best friend's daughter

-ordered the murder of an unborn child

Olenna is a misandrist, hateful women who happens to be the female version of Tyrion.

Thank you for explaining it.

[butterbumps!]

-killed people (Marq Grafton and other loyalists) for being loyal (as if you're morally bound to support every rebel you come across)

-gave no damn about Elia's fate and that of her dragonspawn

-pardoneded the men who laid before him dead children shrouded in bloody cloaks

-bankrupted the realm

-raped and beated Cersei

-neglected his heir to the throne and engaged the beast to his best friend's daughter

-ordered the murder of an unborn child

Thank you for explaining it.

right, sure. by why Varys?

[E-Ro]

Because varys fucking sucks

[Roxy Carmichael]

Arya. I just never got the appeal.

[jentario]

Like: I don't hate any character, really. Especially not one that most others like.

Hate: Dany. I think the accessive Dany hate in these forums is stupid. I mean, for a few people to hate her is understandable, but 90% of these forums does. Clearly, that's not what George was aiming for. Sometimes it feels like we read different books :/

Number 2 would be Tyrion. I mean, he becomes a complete asshole early in ADWD, but given what was done to him it's kind of understandable. And going forward (since he seems to be back on track now), he has my full support.

[Guard of the Rainking]

Because varys fucking sucks

Even though I love the character he is a quite delusional. Tommen would make a good king, maybe not as good as Aegon, but still the best king Westeros has seen since Jaehaerys II. Letting Tyrion escape and kill Tywin, assassinating Kevan and Pycelle and being the co-responsible (with Illyrio) for Aegon's invasion has caused and will cause a lot more death and suffering than Aegon is worth.

[Mikkel]

Hate: Dany. I think the accessive Dany hate in these forums is stupid. I mean, for a few people to hate her is understandable, but 90% of these forums does. Clearly, that's not what George was aiming for. Sometimes it feels like we read different books :/

Nowhere near 90% against her. I'd say it's about an even 50-50 on here, while in the broader public, she's the favorite of nearly everyone.

[SlowLoras]

I don't get the Sansa hate. She's a vulnerable young girl in a deeply confusing and frightening situation - much of the hate seems to surround her actions in the first two books, but good lord, she was a naive child being manipulated by those around her, of course she's going to make bad decisions. Comparing her choices to Arya's makes little sense as Sansa was clearly being groomed to be a proper lady, whereas Arya never quite fit that and was left to her own devices much more.

I don't get the Val love. Compared to many of the other women in the series she seems relatively poorly sketched and something of a stereotype.

I like Jaime, but I also remember that he pushed a child from a window.

[butterbumps!]

Because varys fucking sucks

I figured you'd like Varys since he's the one person we can say with certainty doesn't have a bigger dick than Stannis. Being as how everything always comes back to how Stannis' dick measures against everyone else's in your view.

[Carl Rhaego]

The OTT hate for Dany, Catelyn and Sansa always amazes me. I've read comments saying that Catelyn is worse than Ramsay. I mean Ramsay is a sadistic murderer but Cately was mean to Jon so that obviously makes her worse lol.

The extreme love for Stannis is something I don't understand. He's just way too bland and boring. I don't hate him, he's even too uninteresting and boring to hate. He's just 'meh'.

The other thing I don't get is the love for Jaime, while Theon gets no love. Theon did terrible things but at least I can somewhat understand why he did them, he wanted to prove himself to his father and he feels remorse for what he's done. It's more relatable for me than throwing children out of windows to cover up that you're fucking your twin sister and making the king believe that the products of that incest are his.

[Faydra]

right, sure. by why Varys?

-helped Aerys into an early grave

-made no attempt to save Elia and her son (he mentioned that his little birds witnessed the scene of her death)

-raised a kid to believe that he is the son of a dead prince in order to start a war

-sold a young girl to a horselord (letting her to be raped)