Cat of the Rivers Posted October 19, 2014 Share Posted October 19, 2014 I don't see why Robert raping her wouldn't be true though? Who is there for her to lie to? These were her personal reflections on her marriage. I highly doubt she'd lie to herself to make herself feel better for killing him.I do think it's true seeing how she mentions to Ned in the godswood that she aborted Robert's baby. That shows that the baby was unwanted. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dofs Posted October 19, 2014 Share Posted October 19, 2014 "Usually he rolled off and went to sleep as soon as it was done, and was snoring before his seed could dry upon her thighs. She was always sore afterwards, raw between the legs, her breasts painful from the mauling he would give them...In the first few years, when he mounted her more often, she would close her eyes and pretend he was Rhaegar."-aFfC Cersei VIISince Cersei remembers her being "raw between the legs" I do think that it involved penetration.Later on Cersei uh, "finished" him in other ways, though.EDIT: Minor typoYeah, so basically his abuse had ended a long time ago, probably around the time Joffrey was born considering she never got pregnant with his child anymore. So yeah, Robert abused her in the beginning, but you hardly can say that her whole marriage was filled with sexual abuse. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cat of the Rivers Posted October 19, 2014 Share Posted October 19, 2014 Yeah, so basically his abuse had ended a long time ago, probably around the time Joffrey was born considering she never got pregnant with his child anymore. So yeah, Robert abused her in the beginning, but you hardly can say that her whole marriage was filled with sexual abuse. I never claimed that their whole marriage was filled with sexual abuse. But knowing Cersei and Robert it was probably filled with emotional, verbal and physical abuse from beginning to end. That truly was a match made in hell.EDIT: Wanted to add more Yeah, it's a shame they never met in the books. :(They probably met when Ned went to Storm's End to break the siege but probably barely interacted beyond a few courtesies. But yeah Davos/Stannis/Ned would have been an awesome buddy cop thing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cat of the Rivers Posted October 19, 2014 Share Posted October 19, 2014 She did lied to herself about killing Melara. She is a sociopath and I hate this word, but she is, She lies about everything.I agree with you on her being a sociopath. Cersei doesn't always lie but she does so often. But until evidence has proven contrary (and it certainly has many times in Cersei's case) I'm willing to believe her account on Robert's abuse. If we didn't believe her account we would have to question everybody's account because they could all be lying. We'd have to question Lysa's reveal before being shoved out the Moon Door because hey! she was drunk. Or Arya's account on things because she has PTSD. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WSmith84 Posted October 19, 2014 Share Posted October 19, 2014 I appreciate that for Cersei it must have been very difficult growing up in such a sexist world. In fact for Cersei, it was in many ways worse for her because of Jaime. Jaime looked so alike Cersei that when they were young they could swap clothes and no one could tell them apart. So Cersei had to watch someone, identical to her in so many ways, be given things she could never have, no matter how rich or well-born she was. She had to watch another her be offered opportunities that she could never dream of receiving. That must have made her frustration with the system even worse to bear. On the other hand, she clearly shows signs of being despicable from a young age; murdering her friend because she liked Jaime and her abuse of Tyrion. So all in all, I feel no sympathy for her generally. You make your own choices in life; Cersei chose to be a despicable person. Having a hard life doesn't excuse that, though it does make it easier to understand. I did feel some sympathy for her during the WoS though, due to the nature of the punishment and the 'crimes' she was being punished for. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dofs Posted October 19, 2014 Share Posted October 19, 2014 I never claimed that their whole marriage was filled with sexual abuse. But knowing Cersei and Robert it was probably filled with emotional, verbal and physical abuse from beginning to end. That truly was a match made in hell. Well, it was not really physical: Ned touched her cheek gently. "Has he done this before?" "Once or twice." She shied away from his hand. "Never on the face before. Jaime would have killed him, even if it meant his own life." Robert hit her 2 or 3 times in 15 years, that's hardly a physical abuse. But I agree with you about emotional and verbal abuse. Their marriage was definitely filled with that, lol. Robert and Cersei don't fit with each other at all. But to be honest, I don't see anyone who would fit Cersei. She is such a horrible person, only Jaime whos brains are switched off can cope with her, I guess. And it's still a wonder how he could do it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jon's Queen Consort Posted October 19, 2014 Share Posted October 19, 2014 I agree with you on her being a sociopath. Cersei doesn't always lie but she does so often. But until evidence has proven contrary (and it certainly has many times in Cersei's case) I'm willing to believe her account on Robert's abuse. If we didn't believe her account we would have to question everybody's account because they could all be lying. We'd have to question Lysa's reveal before being shoved out the Moon Door because hey! she was drunk. Or Arya's account on things because she has PTSD. Lysa has admitted what she has done. Cersei said that Melara felt into that well and died but we know that she killed her. Seeing what else she has told about "finishing" Robert and what she has told about how Robert didn't cared to touch her I think that is obviously that she is lying. Especially if we remember what she did to Robert with Lancel. She was trying to convince herself that she was right to do what she did. Robert hit her 2 or 3 times in 15 years, that's hardly a physical abuse. But I agree with you about emotional and verbal abuse. Their marriage was definitely filled with that, lol. Robert and Cersei don't fit with each other at all. But to be honest, I don't see anyone who would fit Cersei. She is such a horrible person, only Jaime whos brains are switched off can cope with her, I guess. And it's still a wonder how he could do it. No one would had done it. Just remember what happened with Rhaegar. She wanted so much to marry him and she needed Jaime at KL to share this feeling with her. Robert-Cersei marriage was emotional busive for both of them. Both Cersei and Robert have abused each other. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mladen Posted October 19, 2014 Share Posted October 19, 2014 I don't even believe that Robert abused her as she claimed. Well, if only we had someone who first-handedly have witnessed the abuse... Oh, wait, we have... So, is she a horribly human being? Absolutely. Does that give a pass to those that have wronged her like Robert's abuse or deplorable misogyny by HS? No. Can we sympathize with abused wife or woman in WOS? Yeah. That is a deal for me. I don't generally sympathize with her, but Robert's undoubted abuse with WOS gives us at least two things to be sympathetic for her. But, make no mistake, I want her to pay for all that she has done, the least important of that is pinching Tyrion's penis. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Witch Posted October 19, 2014 Share Posted October 19, 2014 We have no proof she molested Tyrion. Just Oberyn's word. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cat of the Rivers Posted October 19, 2014 Share Posted October 19, 2014 Well, it was not really physical:Ned touched her cheek gently. "Has he done this before?""Once or twice." She shied away from his hand. "Never on the face before. Jaime would have killed him, even if it meant his own life." Robert hit her 2 or 3 times in 15 years, that's hardly a physical abuse. But I agree with you about emotional and verbal abuse. Their marriage was definitely filled with that, lol. Robert and Cersei don't fit with each other at all. But to be honest, I don't see anyone who would fit Cersei. She is such a horrible person, only Jaime whos brains are switched off can cope with her, I guess. And it's still a wonder how he could do it. I consider it physical abuse. I dislike people hitting other people in general. Cersei could marry Cersei of course :P Then the ceremony would be attended by close friends and family only. Which means all by herself. (Got that from another thread) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eyenon15 Posted October 19, 2014 Share Posted October 19, 2014 Also no proof that Jaime is the father of her children Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cat of the Rivers Posted October 19, 2014 Share Posted October 19, 2014 We have no proof she molested Tyrion. Just Oberyn's word.We'd have to doubt everybody's back stories because they might be lying. For example: Catelyn didn't really grow up in Riverrun. No, she was the head of the Faceless Men organization from her birthplace Braavos and faked the identity and brainwashed everybody into thinking that she was truly Catelyn Tully. And Tywin Lannister was actually the Dusky Woman manipulating all of the people around her (actual crackpot theory). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cat of the Rivers Posted October 19, 2014 Share Posted October 19, 2014 Also no proof that Jaime is the father of her childrenAh-ha! Someone has finally grasped the truth. Joffrey's Ramsay's, Tommen's Hodor's and Myrcella was Tom of Sevenstrings! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
morticia Posted October 19, 2014 Author Share Posted October 19, 2014 Ah-ha! Someone has finally grasped the truth. Joffrey's Ramsay's, Tommen's Hodor's and Myrcella was Tom of Sevenstrings! Nah, they're all moonboy's kids. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eyenon15 Posted October 19, 2014 Share Posted October 19, 2014 Also I don't know where this pinching Tyrions penis comes from. As I recall it was a lot more gruesomeIt's not like she was merely annoyed he wasn't wearing green on st Patricks day Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dofs Posted October 19, 2014 Share Posted October 19, 2014 No one would had done it. Just remember what happened with Rhaegar. She wanted so much to marry him and she needed Jaime at KL to share this feeling with her. Maybe someone extremely weak-willed person. :dunno: Cersei could marry Cersei of course :P Then the ceremony would be attended by close friends and family only. Which means all by herself. (Got that from another thread) Ha ha, and the ceremony room would be filled with mirrors, lol. We have no proof she molested Tyrion. Just Oberyn's word. Cersei also remembers in her own POV that when she found out that Baelor imprisoned his sisters, she went and pinched baby Tyrion till he was crying. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thehandwipes Posted October 20, 2014 Share Posted October 20, 2014 She is a pathological liar and a complete sociopath, not a far stretch for her to believe her own lies... Sadly, I do feel sympathy for Cersei sometimes even though I know I shouldn't. She was born evil, it does happen. There is a part of your brain that allows you to recognize others as full people just like you (empathy) and if that part of your brain doesn't function properly there's nothing that can fix it. And it does run in families (Tywin, Cersei, Joffrey). A true psychopath could never admit that anything bad that has ever happened to them was their own fault, certainly not to themselves. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The King in Black Posted October 20, 2014 Share Posted October 20, 2014 I'll sympathise with her the day I sympathise with Ramsay'Oh! Child of rape just wanted his father to recognise him and be proud of him ,had to undergo the daunting challenge of impersonating his slain best friend and go undercover behind enemy lines but pulled it off, brought justice to evil theon ,yada ,yada ,yada ' Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
morgan1213 Posted October 20, 2014 Share Posted October 20, 2014 I literally have never felt an ounce of sympathy for her. I enjoyed every minute of the walk of shame. I did too. And it wasn't enough. She is a terrible person Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JonCon's Red Beard Posted October 20, 2014 Share Posted October 20, 2014 Oh... Cersei... The thing is that she often claims herself victim of a cruel oppressive society, when in fact, she lived way better than 99.999999999% of the women of Westeros, including both noble girls and common women. As a child she was definitely spoiled into being let to do as she pleased, to whoever she wanted. Mostly of her "I was a mare sold to be mount!" attitude is just bitterness as the one mounting her is not the one she wanted. Because we've seen her daydreaming about how she was meant to marry Rhaegar, not Robert. That's what she's mad about, not just for have been sold away, it's that she was forced to some man she doesn't like, like mostly highborn ladies. Then, we have her hypocrisy, which many people seem to forget. Her most militant defenders seem to have forgotten that it was her the one who tried to slut-shame Margaery, to the point of enjoying the idea of several people fingering her to verify her virginity, while accusing her of something she did herself: using her body not for pleasure but for gaining something in exchange. And when she was discovered, the word "misogyny" is often mentioned. So, do I have sympathy for Cersei? A bit, during her walk. But then, when it was over and she was all "I am going to kill them all!!!" and later subtly threatened Kevan's wife, any bit of sympathy fade away. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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