Valyrian/Dragonlord blood is needed to tame/subdue dragons

[Aemond's Eye]

Ran seems to agree that it's not just Targaryen blood, you need the right genes or whatever. "The right drop."

That's what I had been thinking - you need the right "drop" and to approach the right dragon, essentially. I'll give Ran's thoughts a read tonight, thanks.

[Suzanna Stormborn]

Tyrion has read books on dragon control.

...

1. Written by the Targaryens or their supporters.

2. Another piece of evidence that even the Targaryens know this isn't 100% accurate is the fact Viserys I freaks the **** out when Daemon presents his mistress with a dragon egg. If "regular" people can't tame dragons then giving one away isn't a big deal as all they've got is an elaborately caged zoo animal.

3. However, if normal people can tame dragons then it could mean the Doom of House Targaryen's military power. The fact so many other people want Daeny's dragons is also an indication they can be controlled.

Until we have proof dragonblood is needed, it's just in-universe speculation with plenty of evidence against.

1. Are all Maesters Targaryen supporters?

2. If someone gave away any million-dollar heirloom I think the owner would be pissed no matter what it was.

3. No it's not.

4. there is proof, given by the author through his writing on a hundred separate occasions

[C.T. Phipps]

4. there is proof, given by the author through his writing on a hundred separate occasions

People claim this and my response is not only do I think it's not the case, I think the author actively shows other people can ride dragons than the Targaryens. I'm open to being proven wrong but I don't think either side is making any traction here.

[Ser Lepus]

Another piece of evidence that even the Targaryens know this isn't 100% accurate is the fact Viserys I freaks the **** out when Daemon presents his mistress with a dragon egg. If "regular" people can't tame dragons then giving one away isn't a big deal as all they've got is an elaborately caged zoo animal.

2. If someone gave away any million-dollar heirloom I think the owner would be pissed no matter what it was.

That woman had a Targayren bastard in her belly, and that baby most likely would be able to bond with and ride the dragon. Viserys freaked because he feared the birth of parallel lines of dragonriders.

[RumHam]

1. Are all Maesters Targaryen supporters?

If anything the opposite is indicated.

Ask yourself why Aemon Targaryen was allowed to waste his life upon the Wall, when by rights he should have been raised to archmaester. His blood was why. He could not be trusted.

-Marywn, last chapter in Feast

[Lord Varys]

And if you think about the implications of Marwyn's quote it is heavily implied that the problem with Aemon's blood was his dragonlord blood, suggesting that both Marwyn and (allegedly) the other maesters believe that Targaryen blood has special properties/powers. That does not suggest that the Targaryens made this story, especially since Aemon himself apparently was unaware of this whole thing.

[C.T. Phipps]

And if you think about the implications of Marwyn's quote it is heavily implied that the problem with Aemon's blood was his dragonlord blood, suggesting that both Marwyn and (allegedly) the other maesters believe that Targaryen blood has special properties/powers. That does not suggest that the Targaryens made this story, especially since Aemon himself apparently was unaware of this whole thing.

You assume it's about magic instead of politics?

BTW, to clarify, I think the Targaryens have a bunch of magic in their blood. They can see the future like the Starks, after all. We see it with Daemon II.

I just think the idea only Targaryens can tame dragons is ludicrous and contradicted by the text.

[Mithras]

If anything, there is no mystical aspect of the dragons in TPatQ. Targaryens treated/used them like horses with wings and fiery breath.

[Suzanna Stormborn]

You assume it's about magic instead of politics?

BTW, to clarify, I think the Targaryens have a bunch of magic in their blood. They can see the future like the Starks, after all. We see it with Daemon II.

I just think the idea only Targaryens can tame dragons is ludicrous and contradicted by the text.

Is it ludicrous to say that only Starks can bond/tame with direwolves?

They are the only ones we have ever seen sharing thoughts with direwolves, and to a lesser extent Blood of the First Men is required for skinchanging/warging/greenseeing correct? It is exactly the same for Valyrians and dragons.

Laws have to exist for certain magics, otherwise it would not be special and everyone could do it....... which is very uninteresting and would not make for a good novel.

A song of Ice and Fire.

[C.T. Phipps]

Is it ludicrous to say that only Starks can bond/tame with direwolves?

This is going to be annoying to you, sorry, but...yes?

Presumably, any warg or greenseer can bond with them.

It's just the Starks all have that potential and the dire wolves were raised with them.

I have a theory Bloodraven sent the Dire Wolf and stag as a warning as well as the Dire Wolves to guard the Stark children anyway.

Not because Starks are mystically linked to wolves.

[Suzanna Stormborn]

This is going to be annoying to you, sorry, but...yes?

Presumably, any warg or greenseer can bond with them.

It's just the Starks all have that potential and the dire wolves were raised with them.

I have a theory Bloodraven sent the Dire Wolf and stag as a warning as well as the Dire Wolves to guard the Stark children anyway.

Not because Starks are mystically linked to wolves.

yes but all the greenseers/wargs/skinchangers have blood of the first men, that's what I meant.

BOTFM is required for this and Valyrian blood is required for dragon bonding.

No one said anything about mystical connection to wolves. It is something in their blood, just like the Valyrians. Very Simple Answer.

[C.T. Phipps]

OH, no worries, that doesn't annoy me, it just clears all this up and shows that you have a Stark-bias viewpoint, thank you.

No one said anything about mystical connection to wolves. It is something in their blood, just like the Valyrians. Very Simple Answer.

Well I think the Targaryens and Starks both have magic in their blood.

With a big benefit.

It's just plenty of other people have it too.

And I think it fits the setting that the magic can be opposed by the mundane as well as the mystical.

[Suzanna Stormborn]

Well I think the Targaryens and Starks both have magic in their blood.

With a big benefit.

It's just plenty of other people have it too.

And I think it fits the setting that the magic can be opposed by the mundane as well as the mystical.

I agree there is all sorts of magic running around, but there are rules to it. Arya is learning how to change her face with the FM magic. Not just anyone can do it, there are rules.

First men can warg and no one else.

Valyrians can ride/bond and no one else.

[Mithras]

yes but all the greenseers/wargs/skinchangers have blood of the first men, that's what I meant.

BOTFM is required for this and Valyrian blood is required for dragon bonding.

No one said anything about mystical connection to wolves. It is something in their blood, just like the Valyrians. Very Simple Answer.

All the Westerosi have the blood of the First Men; so it is natural that all the wargs/skinchangers have the blood of the First Men.

[Consigliere]

Is it ludicrous to say that only Starks can bond/tame with direwolves?

They are the only ones we have ever seen sharing thoughts with direwolves, and to a lesser extent Blood of the First Men is required for skinchanging/warging/greenseeing correct? It is exactly the same for Valyrians and dragons.

Laws have to exist for certain magics, otherwise it would not be special and everyone could do it....... which is very uninteresting and would not make for a good novel.

A song of Ice and Fire.

Like I mentioned upthread. Nobody seems to bat an eyelid if one were to say that first man blood is a minimum requirement for warging/skinchanging/greenseeing. It seems pretty clear that there is a magical element (similar to warging/skinchanging) when it comes to bonding with a dragon and blood, specifically the "right drop", plays a role in this. I seriously doubt that just anyone can become a warg/skinchanger/greenseer or dragon rider if he/she just puts their mind to it. This would also explain the incest in order to keep the blood of the dragon pure, which coincidentally was practiced primarily by those families who bred and rode dragons.

[Lord Varys]

Not sure why the Citadel would have political reason to not want Aemon as an archmaester. He was a royal prince, the son, brother, uncle, and great-uncle of kings. Surely the Citadel would have profited if one of the archmaesters would have been close to the throne. Archmaester Vaegon set a precedent. It was not improper for a Targaryen to take the mask and rod of an archmaester.

If they had a political reason to keep Aemon out of the inner circle in the Citadel it makes sense to assume that Targaryen magical blood had something to do with it, as any other political reason makes no sense considering that Aemon could have been an asset in pretty much every mundane political agenda.

And this is exactly what Marwyn says. About Aemon and himself...

We have also little to no reason to assume that the Citadel fell prey to its own lies/propaganda it may have told during the dragon age (i.e. that Targaryen blood was magical). Only the Citadel investigates this thing and they should be able to keep truth apart from lies.

[Suzanna Stormborn]

Like I mentioned upthread. Nobody seems to bat an eyelid if one were to say that first man blood is a minimum requirement for warging/skinchanging/greenseeing. It seems pretty clear that there is a magical element (similar to warging/skinchanging) when it comes to bonding with a dragon and blood, specifically the "right drop", plays a role in this. I seriously doubt that just anyone can become a warg/skinchanger/greenseer or dragon rider if he/she just puts their mind to it. This would also explain the incest in order to keep the blood of the dragon pure, which coincidentally was practiced primarily by those families who bred and rode dragons.

Yes I agree with both of your posts. THis is the only thing that makes sense. The ancient Valyrians practiced inbreeding so that each family could have their own line of dragons. So not only is Valyrian blood needed to ride/tame/bond. But further than that, you have to have that specific Valyrians families' blood to ride any particular line of dragon. The Targryens brought the Celtigars and Velaryons with them from Valyria but neither of those families were bonded with the Targ dragons and therefore could not ride either. Dragons can only have specific riders with their families blood. LOL otherwise everyone on the planet would have them! duh

Not sure why the Citadel would have political reason to not want Aemon as an archmaester. He was a royal prince, the son, brother, uncle, and great-uncle of kings. Surely the Citadel would have profited if one of the archmaesters would have been close to the throne. Archmaester Vaegon set a precedent. It was not improper for a Targaryen to take the mask and rod of an archmaester.

If they had a political reason to keep Aemon out of the inner circle in the Citadel it makes sense to assume that Targaryen magical blood had something to do with it, as any other political reason makes no sense considering that Aemon could have been an asset in pretty much every mundane political agenda.

And this is exactly what Marwyn says. About Aemon and himself...

We have also little to no reason to assume that the Citadel fell prey to its own lies/propaganda it may have told during the dragon age (i.e. that Targaryen blood was magical). Only the Citadel investigates this thing and they should be able to keep truth apart from lies.

Good one! ....'fell prey to its own propaganda'.....hahahaha, I am going to have to use that one Bud.

I really think that current US politicians should by the Citadels book on how to best circulate false propaganda. Apparently it is the secret answer to everything in asoiaf.... :)

[C.T. Phipps]

Like I mentioned upthread. Nobody seems to bat an eyelid if one were to say that first man blood is a minimum requirement for warging/skinchanging/greenseeing. It seems pretty clear that there is a magical element (similar to warging/skinchanging) when it comes to bonding with a dragon and blood, specifically the "right drop", plays a role in this. I seriously doubt that just anyone can become a warg/skinchanger/greenseer or dragon rider if he/she just puts their mind to it. This would also explain the incest in order to keep the blood of the dragon pure, which coincidentally was practiced primarily by those families who bred and rode dragons.

I don't see any reason why other magically talented individuals can't be Greenseers. There's no evidence Bloodraven's magic came from his mother rather than he simply learned the magic of the North.

If they had a political reason to keep Aemon out of the inner circle in the Citadel it makes sense to assume that Targaryen magical blood had something to do with it, as any other political reason makes no sense considering that Aemon could have been an asset in pretty much every mundane political agenda.

I would assume the issue would be giving the Targaryens too much influence in the Maesterdom when they prefer to concentrate their power amongst themselves.

Yes I agree with both of your posts. THis is the only thing that makes sense. The ancient Valyrians practiced inbreeding so that each family could have their own line of dragons.

The idea the targaryens need a reason for incest other than being crazy foreigners with weird customs is FAR FAR from sensible.

[Aemond's Eye]

You assume it's about magic instead of politics?

BTW, to clarify, I think the Targaryens have a bunch of magic in their blood. They can see the future like the Starks, after all. We see it with Daemon II.

I just think the idea only Targaryens can tame dragons is ludicrous and contradicted by the text.

Nobody has posted that only the Targaryens can tame dragons, end of story - it's that only those with Targaryen ancestry can tame the Targaryen dragons. There's actually not anything in the text that contradicts it. The text actually hints at sorcery being used by the Vaylrians, so the suggestion that it was involved with bonding a dragonlord's bloodline to a specific line of dragons isn't that out there - no more so that the idea of blood magic being involved, which is actually hinted at in the text.

Now, if you're thinking that folk claim that only Targaryens can tame any dragon? Well then, yeah, the text shows that the Asshai'i were rumoured to have tamed dragons first*, we know that several Valyrian families were dragon lords, that there's some evidence that suggests dragons at one point visiting Westeros prior to the Targaryens, and even the possibility of dragons beyond the The Wall.

Personally, I think the idea that dragons are just big wild animals that can be tamed by anyone using animal husbandry is ludicrous, and is not supported by the text.

*If there is blood magic involved with binding a line of dragons to a bloodline, I think it puts more stock in the suggestions that the Asshai'i were the ones that taught the Valyrians how to do just that.

Yes I agree with both of your posts. THis is the only thing that makes sense. The ancient Valyrians practiced inbreeding so that each family could have their own line of dragons. So not only is Valyrian blood needed to ride/tame/bond. But further than that, you have to have that specific Valyrians families' blood to ride any particular line of dragon. The Targryens brought the Celtigars and Velaryons with them from Valyria but neither of those families were bonded with the Targ dragons and therefore could not ride either. Dragons can only have specific riders with their families blood. LOL otherwise everyone on the planet would have them! duh

Yeah, and inbreeding would also make it less likely for someone to be able to bond with dragons from more than one family.

[Ser Lepus]

I agree there is all sorts of magic running around, but there are rules to it. Arya is learning how to change her face with the FM magic. Not just anyone can do it, there are rules.

First men can warg and no one else.

Valyrians can ride/bond and no one else.

Thanks to the tWoIaF book we know now that all the Westerosi are First Men of have a large percentage of First Men blood. The nobility from the Reach, the Stormlands, the Westernlands and Dorne intermarried with the Andal Invaders, but weren't really conquered. The Riverlands kept many First Men noble families, like the Bracken and the Blackwoods, and even the Royces in the Vale have the blood of the First Men. As for the peasants, they probably have more FM than Andal blood everywhere.