R+L=J v.132

[Alia of the knife]

I've never seen one bigger than twice the size of the one in the picture. Now, I'm not as avid an outdoorsman as some. Only a regular hunter when I was young, and in boy scouts long enough to make Eagle, so call that what you will.

:o :o :o :o :o

Oh gods, thats big enough!!!

[Alia of the knife]

According to GRRM

Interesting that GRRM mentions a Grand Council when discussing the possibility of Jon being released from his vows. Grand Councils are only called for one reason: determining who will sit the IT. That just may have been an unintentional hint by GRRM that Jon has a claim to the IT.

Thats a great call, and that would certainly fit.

[ReleaseTheHound]

Idk why we're talking about weather but in Australia its a warm 29 degrees Celsius which I found to be 84 on the Fahrenheit scale if that's right

[BearQueen87]

According to GRRM

Interesting that GRRM mentions a Grand Council when discussing the possibility of Jon being released from his vows. Grand Councils are only called for one reason: determining who will sit the IT. That just may have been an unintentional hint by GRRM that Jon has a claim to the IT.

And that the GC will play a huge part in putting Jon on a throne in the end, like so many people think

[Alia of the knife]

Idk why we're talking about weather but in Australia its a warm 29 degrees Celsius which I found to be 84 on the Fahrenheit scale if that's right

I don't know you, but you just hurt me. Between the cold and static electricity, I can't even get close to my cats.

[sj4iy]

And that the GC will play a huge part in putting Jon on a throne in the end, like so many people think

^This.

[ReleaseTheHound]

And that the GC will play a huge part in putting Jon on a throne in the end, like so many people think

And he didn't want to make any comment on jon being related to the song of ice and Fire and also that Rhaegar and Lyanna will come to the fore in the later books

Also hilarious that he was like "I'm stopping at SIX SIX SIX!!"

[Alia of the knife]

And that the GC will play a huge part in putting Jon on a throne in the end, like so many people think

On Talking Dead, the actor who plays Penguin is on! :)

[IceFire125]

According to GRRM

Interesting that GRRM mentions a Grand Council when discussing the possibility of Jon being released from his vows. Grand Councils are only called for one reason: determining who will sit the IT. That just may have been an unintentional hint by GRRM that Jon has a claim to the IT.

And guess who will influence to push for the Great Council, the Kingslayer turned Kingmaker, Jaime Lannister. He will cross his arc with Jon's (Ice & Fire, balance), he is neither the best or the worst, "Like him (Criston Cole, a Kingmaker)."

(Jaime) “Good enough. He died, but his king lived. A lot of brave men have worn the white cloak. Most have been forgotten.”

(Loras) “Most deserve to be forgotten. The heroes will always be remembered. The best.”

“The best and the worst.” So one of us (him and Loras) is like to live in song (Jon's song of Ice and Fire). “And a few who were a bit of both. Like him.” He tapped the page he had been reading.

“Who?” Ser Loras craned his head around to see. “Ten black pellets on a scarlet field. I do not know those arms.”

“They belonged to Criston Cole, who served the first Viserys and the second Aegon.” Jaime closed the White Book. “They called him Kingmaker.”

Rhaegar had put his hand on Jaime’s shoulder. “When this battle’s done I mean to call a council. Changes will be made. I meant to do it long ago, but … well, it does no good to speak of roads not taken.

In the practice yard he came upon a dozen king’s men with torches and long spears in their hands. Their sergeant looked at Ghost and scowled, and a couple of his men lowered their spears until the knight who led them said, “Move aside and let them pass.”

**Before Jon noticed that his name was being placed to be as a candidate for the throne, there will be king's men, lords and officials that will look at Jon and Jaime (by his side, he will replace Ghost as Jon's white shadow) with scowling faces, but they will be given room to pass into the great halls, for his name to be sound off to mount the throne.

GRRM will twist and reverse the event that happened in the GC of 233... that instead of Aenys Blackfyre, it will be Jon as the true heir coming before them and Jaime at his side.

Even as the Great Council was debating, however, another claimant appeared in King’s Landing.

When Dany (if she's still alive) or fAegon (if he's still alive) try to kill him with their dragons, I think this is where the revelation will happen. Just as the raven flew 3 times in the air, landed, and approached towards Jon. I think there will be a dragon (I think it will be Drogon) that will fly off following a command, flying in the air, land near Jon and instead killing him, Jon will be the one that will put him in submission, (by whip? I doubt it) I think Bran will be in his head, allowing Jon to ride him. Of course, to the shock off the high lords of all Westeros that will be there.

The shrill sound cut through the clamor like a sword. As Jon walked toward the tables, more of the brothers took note, and fell quiet. A hush spread across the cellar, until the only sounds were Jon’s heels clicking on the stone floor, and the soft crackle of the logs in the hearth.

...

The raven landed on the table nearest Jon. “Snow,” it cawed. It was an old bird, dirty and bedraggled. “Snow,” it said again, “Snow, snow, snow.” It walked to the end of the table, spread its wings again, and flew to Jon’s shoulder.

...

The raven cocked its head and looked at Jon. “Corn?” it said hopefully. When it got neither corn nor answer, it quorked and muttered, “Kettle? Kettle? Kettle?”

**This time it will be Jon to ride on the shoulder of a bigger dark wings.

[Mithras]

No GC would elect Jon while Dany or Stannis or fAegon are alive ;)

[Ygrain]

No GC would elect Jon while Dany or Stannis or fAegon are alive ;)

... and that is good news :P

ETA: Unless Jon marries Dany to solidify his claim. I'd rather him to marry Stannis, though, for the hilarity.

[BearQueen87]

No GC would elect Jon while Dany or Stannis or fAegon are alive ;)

Then what's the point of the GC? There have to be others vying for the throne who have a legitimate reason to claim the throne.

[Mithras]

Then what's the point of the GC? There have to be others vying for the throne who have a legitimate reason to claim the throne.

The point of the GC is to select the king when there is no immediate-acceptable heir or a strong claimant, which would certainly not be the case if fAegon, Stannis or Dany stay alive in the end.

[Renhet]

First post, and starting in the infamous R+L=J threads that got me hooked on this forum way back.

Jumping in the discussion, nothing to do with the GC talk however. Reason I’m posting is this: As a student of history I stumbled upon a name that sounds eerie familiar. Rowland Lee. This guy married Henry VIII in secret to Anne Boleyn, who is rumored to have been pregnant at the time. We all know that GRRM loves easter eggs, and is frequently referencing historic events, especially the tudor era.

I am wondering if anyone else has noticed the similarities in the name Rowland Lee and of course, Howland Reed. Do you guys think that George is telling us that there was a secret marriage between Rhaegar and Lyanna with the use of the name Howland Reed? And even beyond that, that such a liaison might have been accepted - or conducted by the northerners, maybe even by Ned?

I am a supporter of the R+L=J, so maybe I am seeing things, but I believe this is a major hint at a secret relationship that Howland Reed was very much a big part of.

The Rowland Lee guy seems like a pretty unlikable character in the history books, but then again, GRRM continuously questions the way history is being written in Westeros. Bad guys portrayed in history books might be the good guys, which of course mirrors reality in such a fine way.

Anyway, if this has already been mentioned, never mind this newcomer!

[Mithras]

^^Nice catch. Never seen it before. Wellcome to the boards. :cheers:

[Alia of the knife]

And guess who will influence to push for the Great Council, the Kingslayer turned Kingmaker, Jaime Lannister. He will cross his arc with Jon's (Ice & Fire, balance), he is neither the best or the worst, "Like him (Criston Cole, a Kingmaker)."

(Jaime) Good enough. He died, but his king lived. A lot of brave men have worn the white cloak. Most have been forgotten.

(Loras) Most deserve to be forgotten. The heroes will always be remembered. The best.

The best and the worst. So one of us (him and Loras) is like to live in song (Jon's song of Ice and Fire). And a few who were a bit of both. Like him. He tapped the page he had been reading.

Who? Ser Loras craned his head around to see. Ten black pellets on a scarlet field. I do not know those arms.

They belonged to Criston Cole, who served the first Viserys and the second Aegon. Jaime closed the White Book. They called him Kingmaker.

Rhaegar had put his hand on Jaimes shoulder. When this battles done I mean to call a council. Changes will be made. I meant to do it long ago, but well, it does no good to speak of roads not taken.

In the practice yard he came upon a dozen kings men with torches and long spears in their hands. Their sergeant looked at Ghost and scowled, and a couple of his men lowered their spears until the knight who led them said, Move aside and let them pass.

**Before Jon noticed that his name was being placed to be as a candidate for the throne, there will be king's men, lords and officials that will look at Jon and Jaime (by his side, he will replace Ghost as Jon's white shadow) with scowling faces, but they will be given room to pass into the great halls, for his name to be sound off to mount the throne.

GRRM will twist and reverse the event that happened in the GC of 233... that instead of Aenys Blackfyre, it will be Jon as the true heir coming before them and Jaime at his side.

Even as the Great Council was debating, however, another claimant appeared in Kings Landing.

When Dany (if she's still alive) or fAegon (if he's still alive) try to kill him with their dragons, I think this is where the revelation will happen. Just as the raven flew 3 times in the air, landed, and approached towards Jon. I think there will be a dragon (I think it will be Drogon) that will fly off following a command, flying in the air, land near Jon and instead killing him, Jon will be the one that will put him in submission, (by whip? I doubt it) I think Bran will be in his head, allowing Jon to ride him. Of course, to the shock off the high lords of all Westeros that will be there.

The shrill sound cut through the clamor like a sword. As Jon walked toward the tables, more of the brothers took note, and fell quiet. A hush spread across the cellar, until the only sounds were Jons heels clicking on the stone floor, and the soft crackle of the logs in the hearth.

...

The raven landed on the table nearest Jon. Snow, it cawed. It was an old bird, dirty and bedraggled. Snow, it said again, Snow, snow, snow. It walked to the end of the table, spread its wings again, and flew to Jons shoulder.

...

The raven cocked its head and looked at Jon. Corn? it said hopefully. When it got neither corn nor answer, it quorked and muttered, Kettle? Kettle? Kettle?

**This time it will be Jon to ride on the shoulder of a bigger dark wings.

Those are pretty awesome catches. And while I like the notion of redemption and putting things back right with Jaime, Jon is still going to have to contend with the notion that Jaime tried to kill Bran.

But then again, like Lancel, it may become clear to Jon the man Jaime never got to be because of Cersei's corruption.

[Alia of the knife]

First post, and starting in the infamous R+L=J threads that got me hooked on this forum way back.

Jumping in the discussion, nothing to do with the GC talk however. Reason Im posting is this: As a student of history I stumbled upon a name that sounds eerie familiar. Rowland Lee. This guy married Henry VIII in secret to Anne Boleyn, who is rumored to have been pregnant at the time. We all know that GRRM loves easter eggs, and is frequently referencing historic events, especially the tudor era.

I am wondering if anyone else has noticed the similarities in the name Rowland Lee and of course, Howland Reed. Do you guys think that George is telling us that there was a secret marriage between Rhaegar and Lyanna with the use of the name Howland Reed? And even beyond that, that such a liaison might have been accepted - or conducted by the northerners, maybe even by Ned?

I am a supporter of the R+L=J, so maybe I am seeing things, but I believe this is a major hint at a secret relationship that Howland Reed was very much a big part of.

The Rowland Lee guy seems like a pretty unlikable character in the history books, but then again, GRRM continuously questions the way history is being written in Westeros. Bad guys portrayed in history books might be the good guys, which of course mirrors reality in such a fine way.

Anyway, if this has already been mentioned, never mind this newcomer!

That is an awesome catch, and while Reed didn't marry them, (see the wondering Septon), it still points to him as a witness, and I think GRRM would definitely do this.

[Rhaenys_Targaryen]

Those are pretty awesome catches. And while I like the notion of redemption and putting things back right with Jaime, Jon is still going to have to contend with the notion that Jaime tried to kill Bran.

But then again, like Lancel, it may become clear to Jon the man Jaime never got to be because of Cersei's corruption.

Possibly. But Jon never got to witness Cersei's corruption of Jaime from up close..

Neither does he know that Jaime once tried to kill Bran.

Perhaps Jaime will eventually reveal such, if he and Jon do end up on the same team, but only in the end, with Jaime accepting the Wall as his punishment.. for all we know, Jaime could become LC there as well!

[Mithras]

I think Sam (Aemon's counterpart in 233), Bran (Bloodraven's counterpart in 233) and Davos (if he survives) are more likely to be Jon's Kingmakers. If Gerion Lannister returns as the Corsair King and survives, he might play a part as well. Jaime and Cersei are foreshadowed to kill each other while the KL is burned by wildfire.

[sj4iy]

I think Sam (Aemon's counterpart in 233), Bran (Bloodraven's counterpart in 233) and Davos (if he survives) are more likely to be Jon's Kingmakers. If Gerion Lannister returns as the Corsair King and survives, he might play a part as well. Jaime and Cersei are foreshadowed to kill each other while the KL is burned by wildfire.

...what foreshadows Jaime's death, exactly? At least in that way.

Also not seeing how Bran can be a kingmaker to anyone. Just telling Jon isn't enough to be a kingmaker- you have to be able to put him in the throne. I don't really see Davos doing anything if the sort for Jon...Stannis is his king.

Sam, I agree...he could have a part in it, the same way he manipulated the LC election. Plus he is highborn and extremely intelligent in such matters.

But I think we have foreshadowing that Jaime could very well be a kingmaker, too. The dream about Rhaegar and protecting his children, as well as the references to kingmakers of the past, and Jaime's determination to fill the pages of the books...I don't think his only deed will be choking Cersei to death.