Season 6 Foreshadowing...

[Channel4s-JonSnow]

I think Rickon could die, throwing the secession into a turmoil, since they did not cover the will in the show.

And I don't know what went on with the editor.

I dunno, to bring Rickon back... only to kill him straight away.. seems like such a waste. He was such a minor wasted character anyway, constantly moaning about shaggydog. I think he needs to have an important role.

[Alayne's Shadow.]

I dunno, to bring Rickon back... only to kill him straight away.. seems like such a waste. He was such a minor wasted character anyway, constantly moaning about shaggydog. I think he needs to have an important role.

I don't think he'll die, but if he does, then his storyline is clearly a shaggydog. 

[Alayne's Shadow.]

I'm enjoying my scenes with Ramsay and the Boltons. In fact, I'll be dissapointed when they're gone. The Sand Snakes mean nothing to me and were seriously the worst thing the show has ever done. Much like in the book, never got into them or Dorne really.

The Sand Snakes suck. But seriously, I can't take anything seriously that involves a sidekick that's supposed to be a servant (Myranda) thinking she can own the scenario. Is Show!Westeros "realistic" or is it only realistic when it involves sexual violence? Because I've studied High Middle Ages and Late Middle Ages, and in none of them the Kennels Master's daughter would even have the opportunity to taunt the Lady of the Household. Not to mention her first-row seat to the wedding of Sansa and Ramsay. Not to mention her "I thought you'd marry me" complaint to Ramsay. So much for "historical realism". Even setting aside any type of logical argument that Sansa would most definitely use to not go marry Ramsay, what do the Boltons win by keeping her locked up? It's her identity that passes legitimacy to their rule. Unlike FArya, she's the real Sansa Stark. 

I may not like what they did with Sansa this season, but I admit I liked the season even Sansa's episode.

See above. 

[GeorgeIAF]

I don't think he'll die, but if he does, then his storyline is clearly a shaggydog. 

It's too predictable for things to happen in this way, i believe that the shaggydog story is a red herring and Rickon will play an important role, and if the rumours are true about a time-gap being included in the last book, he could be a major character there. The Wild Wolf reborn.

[Channel4s-JonSnow]

The Sand Snakes suck. But seriously, I can't take anything seriously that involves a sidekick that's supposed to be a servant (Myranda) thinking she can own the scenario. Is Show!Westeros "realistic" or is it only realistic when it involves sexual violence? Because I've studied High Middle Ages and Late Middle Ages, and in none of them the Kennels Master's daughter would even have the opportunity to taunt the Lady of the Household. Not to mention her first-row seat to the wedding of Sansa and Ramsay. Not to mention her "I thought you'd marry me" complaint to Ramsay. So much for "historical realism". Even setting aside any type of logical argument that Sansa would most definitely use to not go marry Ramsay, what do the Boltons win by keeping her locked up? It's her identity that passes legitimacy to their rule. Unlike FArya, she's the real Sansa Stark. 

See above. 

I hated Myranda as much as Ramsey, she was incredibly one note and bond villain as a character. But I don't see any real reason why Lord Ramsey can't choose whoever he wants as his bit on the side, and bring her along to any events he wants. Hes basically acting like a crazy dictator anyway. 

Justinian I of the Byzantine empire married a prostitute, her dad was a bear trainer and her mother a dancer. High born marry low born in history.   Myranda would have been given a special place in Ramseys court, if he favoured her at the time. 

And I don;t see the problem with the 'locked up' thing. I mean its not like she was there 24/7. She was dragged out sometimes, and if she needed to be paraded in front of people she could have been.

[Alayne's Shadow.]

I hated Myranda as much as Ramsey, she was incredibly one note and bond villain as a character. But I don't see any real reason why Lord Ramsey can't choose whoever he wants as his bit on the side, and bring her along to any events he wants. Hes basically acting like a crazy dictator anyway.

Well, for starters, realistically, Ramsay, according to GOT, is a noble bastard in the same sense as Edric Storm. I'd believe he wouldn't even have the opportunity to up Myranda's status. They just wouldn't even interact, if the discussion is about historical realism. Myranda's a servant in a highly hierarchic society, in which her access to Ramsay would be short to none. Even if they do interact, it's unlikely he'd be able to bring her to any events, due to her social status. Although we tend to think that mistresses were commoners, due to their role as mistresses, they were really mostly from a higher societal status than most people in a society. At most, Ramsay would, and that's a big leap, sleep with the girl. When we're talking about crazy dictators, it's just too big of a leap to imagine that someone like Myranda would have access. And even if she did slept with Ramsay, realistically, she'd never even be near of Ramsay's wife. After all, Sansa could have Myranda literally maimed and murdered for the words she said to her in Episode 6. 

Justinian I of the Byzantine empire married a prostitute, her dad was a bear trainer and her mother a dancer. High born marry low born in history.   Myranda would have been given a special place in Ramseys court, if he favoured her at the time. 

Ehh, you're comparing Byzantine Early History with the High Middle Ages/Late Middle Ages period? Besides being two very distinct societies and historical moments, Theodora most likely wasn't a common prostitute, and in fact exercised a role in Byzantine society that wasn't exactly a prostitute - She was an actress, which did included sexual favors off-stage,  and by the time she met Justinian, she had already left her former profession. Justinian was allowed to marry her, but she did suffered several societal prejudice, especially since he had to abolish a law to marry her officially. Nonetheless, the issue isn't really about the Byzantine Empire, but how that scenario was completely unrealistic for a feudal society which is based on noble birth and blood as markers of societal worth. Even the King's favorites were usually women with a decent lineage. 

And I don;t see the problem with the 'locked up' thing. I mean its not like she was there 24/7. She was dragged out sometimes, and if she needed to be paraded in front of people she could have been.

She was dragged out once because she tried to escape. That's it. Also, considering they changed up the marriage, the motivations, Ramsay's character, the bride and the guests, the rape and the locking up thing don't really work. 

[Channel4s-JonSnow]

Actually, I do think her being at the wedding is a bit odd, doesn't make a lot of sense, given her position etc. Her character is clearly a replacement for Ramseys goons in the book, though, so makes sense she's around him.

As for them meeting, I don't have a problem with it. Ramsey could potentially try it on with any low born girl he wants, no reason he wouldn't take her for a lover for an extended period of time, especially when he was a bastard. Why wouldn't he make a move on an attractive girl he saw around the castle? She was also his secret lover at that point too. Make sense to me.

As for her access to Sansa.. well often they bumped into each other walking around Winterfell, which could happen.. and also Ramsey sent her directly to Sansa to bathe her, as you might send any servant girl. I'm not seeing the issue here either.

 

She was dragged out once because she tried to escape. That's it. Also, considering they changed up the marriage, the motivations, Ramsay's character, the bride and the guests, the rape and the locking up thing don't really work. 

Yet that doesn't mean they couldn't drag her out if they wanted to display her to whoever they wanted. 

[LordImp]

Anonther foreshadowing i noticed. Edd says when he leaves this world , he dosent want to come back. Could it be that he comes back as a wight? 

[Maid So Fair]

 

The big improvement in the show for her storyline is she is at least interacting with the main plot, and not being isolated away from the rest of the story while GRRM works out what to do with her. 

She did manage to become an integral element to the Ramsey and theon storyline, as well as setting up storylines in the future in terms of her and Jon, and Rickon as well. 

I'm not sure why the issue of her affecting the plot is the important one, the important one is that shes interacting with the main plots, that there is a connection between stories, something I continuously bang on about as one of D&Ds main motivations when making changes. This was a very good example of it.

If you must know, I don't even like the Winterfell storyline in the show. Ghost of Winterfell in the books is far superior, but not because it doesn't have Sansa, but because it has a greater sense of internal dialogue and Theons character. 
And obviously I hate Dorne, and a few other things, but I don't need to keep repeating that every time I post.

 

Because if she doesn't affect it, how can you claim she 'interacts' with it? If you interact with something you are vy definition affecting it. If her presence, relationships and conversations have little to no effect on anybody of importance (save Theon but he's hardly a crucial character) and worse, has no real character arc, any claims that her new plotline is somehow inferior to the original fall flat.

Especially when we contrast her wwithf!Arya, a tertiary character, and see her actually have bigger effect on the plot in the same situation than Sansa ever had in S5. Her contribution starts and ends with giving Theon a reason to escape (to what en we do not even know yet). As for Ramsay, her presence has had no offect on him. There was no tension in WF caused by his treatment of her, the Bolton army easily overpowered Stannis and Ramsay himself is still the same sadistic psycho from the beginning of the season. I guess his plaything/gf got a bit jealous which he solves in about 30 seconds? And since Jon in the show makes no move to help his sister, either by aiding Stannis or sending Mance, and gets stabbed without the benefit of the Pink letter, his and Sansa's story remain completely separate when in the book he is one of the main players in the Northern storyline and is at least partially inspired to get involved because of his love for Arya.

Fair enough, though in that case I'm not sure why you're defending a plotline you don't even like.

[Maid So Fair]

I think the thing with mistresses is that any power they might wield basically derives from their lover. A supreme ruler might get away with openly keeping a mistress and even granting her some position in his household, but Ramsay is hardly in that position. Being a recently legitimised bastard his position is precarious at best, with the possibility of being delegated to the second place soon as Walda pops out a boy. He is by default on the defensive when it comes to his status in the noble society, with the  only way to secure it being marrying someone above his station. Unlike say Tytos Lannister he has no legitimacy to confer on Myranda. All Ramsays power derives from Roose, which makes his lack o objection to Ramsay prancing about with Myranda all the more glaring. That being said, I don't think their relationship is impossible - until quite recently her and Ramsay were not that far in social status. Until Roose legitimised Ramsay he was a miller's son.

[Colonel Green]

I think Rickon could die, throwing the secession into a turmoil, since they did not cover the will in the show.

The absence of the will means there wouldn't be any turmoil in the succession if Rickon died.  Without the will, Jon has no standing whatsoever, and the heir (or, rather, Bran's heir, but since he's not around that's pretty much the same thing) is unquestionably Sansa.

[The Fattest Leech]

Actually, I do think her being at the wedding is a bit odd, doesn't make a lot of sense, given her position etc. Her character is clearly a replacement for Ramseys goons in the book, though, so makes sense she's around him.

As for them meeting, I don't have a problem with it. Ramsey could potentially try it on with any low born girl he wants, no reason he wouldn't take her for a lover for an extended period of time, especially when he was a bastard. Why wouldn't he make a move on an attractive girl he saw around the castle? She was also his secret lover at that point too. Make sense to me.

As for her access to Sansa.. well often they bumped into each other walking around Winterfell, which could happen.. and also Ramsey sent her directly to Sansa to bathe her, as you might send any servant girl. I'm not seeing the issue here either.

Yet that doesn't mean they couldn't drag her out if they wanted to display her to whoever they wanted. 

It is quite possible that Ramsay could chose who he wanted to as his girl not to marry, as opposed to his high born to marry. If you search Urban Dictionary you can find the modern day term Ramsay might use for Myranda

I agree with this. Sansa may have free roam of the castle, or restricted to parts of it, but she is "sent to her room" when she does bad things and dragged out to parade her around. Too bad there wasn't anyone to parade her to...

[The Fattest Leech]

The absence of the will means there wouldn't be any turmoil in the succession if Rickon died.  Without the will, Jon has no standing whatsoever, and the heir (or, rather, Bran's heir, but since he's not around that's pretty much the same thing) is unquestionably Sansa.

But if I had my way with S6, Rickon would come strolling back in to the scene like a little post-apocalyptic kid from Mad Max, wearing a unicorn head for a helmet and riding Shaggy Dog who has grown to a monstrous size from eating magical unicorns on Skagos. He will unite Skagos back to the North! Manderly would try to control him but would fail (and I love Manderly).

This is a book and TV request by the way

[Maid So Fair]

But if I had my way with S6, Rickon would come strolling back in to the scene like a little post-apocalyptic kid from Mad Max, wearing a unicorn head for a helmet and riding Shaggy Dog who has grown to a monstrous size from eating magical unicorns on Skagos. He will unite Skagos back to the North! Manderly would try to control him but would fail (and I love Manderly).

This is a book and TV request by the way

King in the North! King in the North!

[Le Cygne]

"The main plot" aka Winterhell is not even the main plot on the show, but in the books Sansa was right near Lady Stoneheart, and there were many connections there, relevant to her story. LF's story, too. And there was a lot of intricate setup, that was not, as the author said, just for hoots and giggles. Unless someone has a copy of TWOW, there's no saying what the "main plot" is, but much of what we are seeing, it's doubtful will be in the books. They said they are going even more off book than last season, but the timing is all off, too.

[The Fattest Leech]

I keep thinking on something, pardons if it's been talked to death already (pun intended), but is there a chance that Sansa is now carrying Ramsay's child?

She doesn't seem to have a maester on hand for moon tea, and if there was one, chances are that maester is Bolton bought and wouldn't allow it. This is, of course, assuming she lives after jumping 100 feet into a dusting of snow right after that same fall killed Myranda, and Sansa doesn't lose such potential baby that way.

[Colonel Green]

I keep thinking on something, pardons if it's been talked to death already (pun intended), but is there a chance that Sansa is now carrying Ramsay's child?

She doesn't seem to have a maester on hand for moon tea, and if there was one, chances are that maester is Bolton bought and wouldn't allow it. This is, of course, assuming she lives after jumping 100 feet into a dusting of snow right after that same fall killed Myranda, and Sansa doesn't lose such potential baby that way.

There would be a chance in the sense that it is theoretically possible the character is pregnant based on what has transpired in-universe.

Narratively, I see no reason to think that would happen.

[Wavey Sauce]

Anonther foreshadowing i noticed. Edd says when he leaves this world , he dosent want to come back. Could it be that he comes back as a wight? 

uhh no not really. Was just telling his friends that if he dies in the up coming fight to be sure to burn his body cause he doesn;t want to come back. I dont think there was any hidden message pending the future imo

[Lord Friendzone]

I dunno, to bring Rickon back... only to kill him straight away.. seems like such a waste. He was such a minor wasted character anyway, constantly moaning about shaggydog. I think he needs to have an important role.

It's not like they didn't do that before with Myrcella, but I guess they killed her because of the prophecy by Maggy. I hope he stays alive and rule. I hate to see another Stark death, but I guess we'll prepared for eventally one death, but hopefully much later. Whether it would be Arya, Sansa or if we count Jon there him as well.

Mummer's farce is almost done and a new King in the North shall arise!

The Sand Snakes suck.

Not like The Sand Snakes were anything special in the books either, but I'm not trying to justify shows crappy approach to them or even the whole Dorne plot. Show seems to elevate everything bad about them and whole Dorne. It was basically a filler. More of Doran and Arienne...and it would've been a bit better.

[Channel4s-JonSnow]

 

Because if she doesn't affect it, how can you claim she 'interacts' with it? If you interact with something you are vy definition affecting it. If her presence, relationships and conversations have little to no effect on anybody of importance (save Theon but he's hardly a crucial character) and worse, has no real character arc, any claims that her new plotline is somehow inferior to the original fall flat.

Because the one major gaping flaw of Book Sansa's story is that it is completely isolated from every other storyline, to the point where you are leaving the reader / viewer wondering what the actual point of what they  are reading / seeing. Its a narrative silo, a complete cul de sac of a story. Thats even ignoring the fact that in terms of actual plot and story momentum its totally lacking any real interesting events or scenes. She 'interacts' with nothing of relevance in the books, to the point where you could basically cut out all of her chapters and I don't think it would matter one jot. I take the piss out of it saying she's just wiping a kids nose, obviously theres more to it than that, but looking after Robert and interacting with a few very minor lords is basically her entire story. Its a real problem for anyone making an adaptation.

In a tv show I really don't think you get the luxury of having entire threads of story that seemingly go nowhere and seem unrelated to anything else. 

What I'm defending is D&Ds comments, which have been twisted to mean something they don't mean, plus the decision to make Sansa a more central character on the show. I'm not defending the quality of the writing of those scenes and thats the difference. There are plenty of elements of this season worthy of being slated, but most of the things brought up around here I find rather ludicrous as criticisms.