A Bastard Snow Posted August 2, 2015 Share Posted August 2, 2015 The Riverlands were not the North. I believe that Robb had good intentions but you know the saying as the saying goes the way to hell is paved with good intentions. Oh c'mon! Do you really believed that he had a chance to win? :lmao:"Nothing is certain but winter" Everything is certain until it's not. People thought Roberts Rebellion didn't stand a chance yet we know how that ended. People were certain that you couldn't cross the Alps with an Army until Hannibal was at the gates. Robb had more then a chance as he never lost a battle.It took people breaking guest right and treason to beat him.Tywin never once was able to beat him in the field. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jon's Queen Consort Posted August 2, 2015 Share Posted August 2, 2015 "Nothing is certain but winter" Everything is certain until it's not. People thought Roberts Rebellion didn't stand a chance yet we know how that ended. People were certain that you couldn't cross the Alps with an Army until Hannibal was at the gates. Unlike Robert's Rebellion where there were 4 Great Houses against 2 it was Robb against Tywin and the Tyrells when IBorns had took the North. It isn't rocket science to see what will happen at the end. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Modesty Lannister Posted August 2, 2015 Share Posted August 2, 2015 Sure, it's not far-fetched at all. :cool4: How come nobody in fandom except you believes it in then? Thankfully we have geniuses like you to enlighten us peasants. Keep up the good work. Are you aware of your own statements? I'd laugh, but I see much deeper problems behind your sentences, so I'll politely refrain. I'd just remind you that you barged into an exchange between myself and another poster who actually liked my theory. You have just called him "nobody". Previously, you addressed yourself as "we". I'd think about that if I were you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ramsay Gimp Posted August 2, 2015 Share Posted August 2, 2015 Kind of OT, but I think Rickard Karstark probably embodies the old Kings of Winter far more than Robb does. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vastet Posted August 2, 2015 Share Posted August 2, 2015 The Riverlands were not the North. I believe that Robb had good intentions but you know the saying as the saying goes the way to hell is paved with good intentions. Oh c'mon! Do you really believed that he had a chance to win? :lmao: If Robb hadn't alienated the Frey's and Karstark's he would have won easily. His campaign to take Casterly Rock would have been successful, and the Lannister's would have been exposed as broke. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Free Northman Reborn Posted August 2, 2015 Share Posted August 2, 2015 Catelyn's traitorous release of Jaime cost the North a strategic military asset that might well have been the equivalent of 10000 dead Northern soldiers. She should have lost her head long before Rickard. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jon's Queen Consort Posted August 2, 2015 Share Posted August 2, 2015 If Robb hadn't alienated the Frey's and Karstark's he would have won easily. His campaign to take Casterly Rock would have been successful, and the Lannister's would have been exposed as broke. Could be, If Robb wasn't idiot he wouldn't be in that situation anyway. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ramsay Gimp Posted August 2, 2015 Share Posted August 2, 2015 She should have lost her head long before Rickard. IMO, giving Catelyn a serious punishment (not execution but perhaps a harsh public condemnation from Robb followed by imprisonment) may well have prevented Rickard from taking matters into his own hands. Rickard was largely motivated by Robb's dismissive attitude towards the whole thing, which understandably came off as a slight Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Selig Posted August 2, 2015 Share Posted August 2, 2015 Catelyn's traitorous release of Jaime cost the North a strategic military asset that might well have been the equivalent of 10000 dead Northern soldiers. She should have lost her head long before Rickard. This thread keeps getting ever more hilarious. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bobby b's bobby Posted August 2, 2015 Share Posted August 2, 2015 If Robb hadn't alienated the Frey's and Karstark's he would have won easily. His campaign to take Casterly Rock would have been successful, and the Lannister's would have been exposed as broke. Thats tv show not book Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ramsay Gimp Posted August 2, 2015 Share Posted August 2, 2015 If Robb hadn't alienated the Frey's and Karstark's he would have won easily. His campaign to take Casterly Rock would have been successful, and the Lannister's would have been exposed as broke. You're thinking of the show. Nothing in this post is true in the books Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ramsay Gimp Posted August 2, 2015 Share Posted August 2, 2015 This thread keeps getting ever more hilarious. I'm not saying she should have lost her head, but what's your defense of Catelyn's actions? In Rickard's shoes would you not be seriously pissed? Robb barely even chewed her out Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Modesty Lannister Posted August 2, 2015 Share Posted August 2, 2015 If Robb hadn't alienated the Frey's and Karstark's he would have won easily. His campaign to take Casterly Rock would have been successful, and the Lannister's would have been exposed as broke. The Lannisters are not broke in the books. Far from it. GRRM reacted to the show invention about their mines being dry. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Modesty Lannister Posted August 2, 2015 Share Posted August 2, 2015 DP. Sorry. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fat Mac Posted August 2, 2015 Share Posted August 2, 2015 If Robb hadn't alienated the Frey's and Karstark's he would have won easily. His campaign to take Casterly Rock would have been successful, and the Lannister's would have been exposed as broke. Robb never had a plan to take Casterly Rock. Probably because it's basically impossible. Robb could never do it. Visenya on dragonback didn't think she could do it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Selig Posted August 2, 2015 Share Posted August 2, 2015 I'm not saying she should have lost her head, but what's your defense of Catelyn's actions? In Rickard's shoes would you not be seriously pissed? Robb barely even chewed her out It was a risk worth taking considering the situation at the time - Stannis about to attack the capital soon which meant Sansa likely dying and Jaime's value as a hostage declining dramatically once Joff and his siblings were executed by him, which seemed likely at the time. And people keep saying that the mission was totally doomed but forget that Jaime and Brienne made it to Maidenpool, which is about two thirds of the way from Riverrun to KL. Would I be pissed if I were in Rickard's place? Most likely, but grieving parents usually don't act reasonably and rationally. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Free Northman Reborn Posted August 2, 2015 Share Posted August 2, 2015 It was a risk worth taking considering the situation at the time - Stannis about to attack the capital soon which meant Sansa likely dying and Jaime's value as a hostage declining dramatically once Joff and his siblings were executed by him, which seemed likely at the time. And people keep saying that the mission was totally doomed but forget that Jaime and Brienne made it to Maidenpool, which is about two thirds of the way from Riverrun to KL. Would I be pissed if I were in Rickard's place? Most likely, but grieving parents usually don't act reasonably and rationally. The potential benefits of the plan - all of which were extreme longshots, no matter what you try to claim to the contrary - all related to saving her own daugthers. None related to serving the war effort. In fact, it directly weakened the war effort significantly. As such, she deserved severe punishment as a traitor. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Selig Posted August 2, 2015 Share Posted August 2, 2015 The potential benefits of the plan - all of which were extreme longshots, no matter what you try to claim to the contrary - all related to saving her own daugthers. None related to serving the war effort. In fact, it directly weakened the war effort significantly. As such, she deserved severe punishment as a traitor. Sure, bringing back the heirs of the king of the North wouldn't help the war effort at all. But Tywin getting Jaime, his heir (not even that since he isn't even eligible due to his KG membership) back somehow is an incredible help for their war effort. That makes total sense. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boarsbane Posted August 2, 2015 Share Posted August 2, 2015 Sure, bringing back the heirs of the king of the North wouldn't help the war effort at all. But Tywin getting Jaime back somehow is an incredible help for their war effort. That makes total sense. Jaime is a peerless warrior and skilled commander, Sansa is a bargaining chip for a marriage and Arya is useless Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Free Northman Reborn Posted August 2, 2015 Share Posted August 2, 2015 Sure, bringing back the heirs of the king of the North wouldn't help the war effort at all. But Tywin getting Jaime, his heir (not even that since he isn't even eligible due to his KG membership) back somehow is an incredible help for their war effort. That makes total sense. What an asinine response. The girls had zero strategic value with regards to winning the war. Jaime in turn had huge strategic and bargaining value with respect to the Starks biggest threat - Tywin Lannister. But then, this has been discussed hundreds of times before, so no use wasting some of the finite number of words that one's fingers can type in a lifetime on trying to educate you on this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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