Star Wars Episode VII THE SPOILERS AWAKEN

[HexMachina]

Only really disappointed with Phasma in that interviews made out she had a bigger role. There were a lot of characters, so quite a few of them will have small roles. I liked the design of her armour

 

I agree with your lightbulb moment.

Hidden Content

Yeah, I am just reading back over the last few pages now and see the Phasma thing was already made. 

Everyone is disappointed with Phasma so far.  But apparently she is in the next one and the story is not over.  

What, she survived? But...how? They were planning to stuff here down a rubbish chute or something, surely that's not the most opportune place to be rescued as the plant implodes...If she is back though, I suspect she'll be primary antagonist to Fin. Certainly seemed like that's what they were trying to set up

ETA: still reading back over comments...I see some people are still commenting on Carrie Fisher looking like "death warmed up"  I can only hope I look so good in death...

(this is not aimed at those commenting on her performance, because I wasn't blown away by that either)

[The Human Abstract]

I have no idea how Phasma survived, but I felt this was common knowledge since Kathleen Kennedy already confirmed in the press that she would be returning to play a bigger role.  

[Jabronius Maximus]

I was looking for info regarding what exactly Snoke could be, and came across a post comparing him to this Emperor Vitiate (aka Valkorion) from about 5000 years before the movie's time. 

http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Valkorion

In my limited understanding of this guy, it seems he's able to use the Force to extend his life, through some Sith ritual. And he ruled for over 1300 years doing so. 

I'm not saying Snoke is this guy, but it could be a template. Seems fitting because Snoke has been described as an ancient, powerful yet vulnerable evil. And of course Han mentioned how Snoke would dispose of Ben after using him for his power. It's possible Snoke uses Ben in some kind of ritual to extend his life. Or he dies in the attempt.

I know it's still pointless speculation, but I thought it was an interesting tidbit. 

[elmis]

Over all, I'll score the move 4/6. Though I have some issues with the move.

Continuity:
How the did Maz have Anakin and Luke's lightsaber from A New Hope and Empire Strikes Back. Luke lost that when he lost his hand on Bespin. Even if she found it afterwards how did she know it used to belong to Anakin and then Luke? Luke made a new green lightsaber as part of his training becoming a Jedi Knight - between Empire and Return of the Jedi. Makes no sense.

How the hell did Finn manage to survive even for a couple of seconds against Kylo Ren in a Lightsaber duel? The whole reason for lightsabers is that Jedis/Siths can use the force to predict the future, which aids them with the lightsaber (defecting blasters and whatnot)? Wasn't that the reason we we're given for Anakins Podracing abilities? How could someone who hasn't even seen a lightsaber before survive against a somewhat trained, future seeing, force wielder? That was super silly.

Other:
JJ Abrams really has a hard-on for destroying planets. First in Star Trek, and now in Star Wars. 4? 5? planets using the laser missile? And apparently all the planets hit (including Coruscant!) were in the same system as Maz' space pirate drinking den - so close you could even see it from the surface?

 

Anyways, 4 out of 6, as it is Star Wars after all.

[AndrewJ]

They went to great lengths to make it very clear that Ren was injured. So he wasn't fighting at anywhere near his best against Finn (and Rey). 

[Jabronius Maximus]

And he had just killed his own father. It's a wonder he was even able to fight properly. 

[elmis]

They went to great lengths to make it very clear that Ren was injured. So he wasn't fighting at anywhere near his best against Finn (and Rey). 

He was also as wounded when he force pushed Rey like 30 + meters into a tree.

Why not have the movie go like this: Force push onto Finn, get him impaled on some branch or whatever, to get him injured and out of the fight. Get Rey all pissed off, and queue lightsaber duel. I can buy her matching Kylo in his "weakened" state or heck, even unweakened. Who knows, she's obviously made of Jedi material.

I don't buy the Finn duel at all.

[AndrewJ]

The fact that he didn't use force powers against Finn is a valid criticism. I simply take it that he saw Finn coming at him with a light saber as a challenge and an insult. He intended to show this little prick that he was zero threat - he didn't need force powers to do it. 

[red snow]

Over all, I'll score the move 4/6. Though I have some issues with the move.

Continuity:
How the did Maz have Anakin and Luke's lightsaber from A New Hope and Empire Strikes Back. Luke lost that when he lost his hand on Bespin. Even if she found it afterwards how did she know it used to belong to Anakin and then Luke? Luke made a new green lightsaber as part of his training becoming a Jedi Knight - between Empire and Return of the Jedi. Makes no sense.

How the hell did Finn manage to survive even for a couple of seconds against Kylo Ren in a Lightsaber duel? The whole reason for lightsabers is that Jedis/Siths can use the force to predict the future, which aids them with the lightsaber (defecting blasters and whatnot)? Wasn't that the reason we we're given for Anakins Podracing abilities? How could someone who hasn't even seen a lightsaber before survive against a somewhat trained, future seeing, force wielder? That was super silly.

Other:
JJ Abrams really has a hard-on for destroying planets. First in Star Trek, and now in Star Wars. 4? 5? planets using the laser missile? And apparently all the planets hit (including Coruscant!) were in the same system as Maz' space pirate drinking den - so close you could even see it from the surface?

 

Anyways, 4 out of 6, as it is Star Wars after all.

Bold point 1) This was probably a case of seeding ideas for future anthology films (along with "death at Jedi academy/Ben goes bad) and JJ leaving things for the other directors/writers to sort out. It was frustrating how Rey didn't say "I'd rather you just tell me now".

bold point 2) Well he didn't, did he. We still don't know whether he'll be in an exo-suit next film but as it stands he'd have died at the hands of Ren unless Rey had saved him

bold point 3) I guess they didn't have to be in the same system in order to see planets explode (just relatively near by) but it could be that some star systems have a lot of inhabitable planets. The important lesson is "don't have your entire federation in a single area that can be destroyed.

While you've got me in nitpicking mode the entire segment with the aliens running around Solo's ship was bad/out of place.

I'm also curious as to whether the star killer could move? Otherwise it could only fire one shot? I guess it must have been able to move or was in a binary star system? A friend of mine posited it may move via recoil which I found fun as it would mean the weapon was operated by a master snooker player who could shoot a planet so that it sent him to the next star. Like Lister in Red Dwarf

[Vels]

It was fun. But the similarities with ANU were distracting for me.

At least during the planning of the attack you could see the characters almost laughing at what they were saying - Han saying "there has to be a weakness - these things always have a weakness" made me chuckle. Then the talk about the landing party, disabling the shield, then the fleet arrives got my eyes rolling. Flying along a trench?

Phasma - waste of space really. Hopefully she has a big role in the next one. I hadn't thought about it until someone a few posts up mentioned that she was locked in a garbage compactor when the planet exploded - wtf?

Also, required a massive suspension of disbelief when they explained the Star-Killer sucks up a star to power up. Um... gravity? Black holes? Doesn't seem likely or remotely safe. Also, does the base move around? What star did they use for the first blast? Did the system have 2 suns?

I absolutely loved the chase scene with the 2 tie fighters and the Falcon. Favorite scene for me I think.

I liked Kylo. Some guy in the cinema gave a ha-ha when he took off his mask - got the rest of the cinema laughing. But I think Driver pulled it off. I liked how he seemed so calculating and in control but then would totally lose his shit. Maybe a bit heavy-handed but it helped show how the character is in constant conflict within himself. Interesting how he said that he felt seduced by the light side. Goes to show that evil is really based on a point of view which is what Anakin was saying.

Do people think that he would have turned good if the sunlight hadn't disappeared at that moment?

 

[The BlackBear]

The Bad: 

Captain Phasma. Well...what a waste that was. The whole situation with Phasma and shutting down the shield was pretty disappointing. Shame really,i do love Gwen.

 

Also, went into this expecting to hate BB-8 as some gimmicky annoying setpiece, but damnit i just couldnt dislike him. Im not made of stone people!

Christie really bigged her up as well, so I hope she gets some payback in later films.

BB-8 is clearly female no?

[Werthead]

JJ Abrams really has a hard-on for destroying planets. First in Star Trek, and now in Star Wars. 4? 5? planets using the laser missile? And apparently all the planets hit (including Coruscant!) were in the same system as Maz' space pirate drinking den - so close you could even see it from the surface?

That wasn't Coruscant, it was a neighbouring Republic system. This was a massively confused plot point and one that was really poorly explained or handled.

[ab aeterno]

BB-8 is clearly female no?

This is an on-going debate, which seems to be inconclusive. Even the cast/crew can't make their minds up.

 

You know, I just realized that The Force Awakens now continues what I will dub The Great Jedi Fail Train: (apologies if anyone else has pointed this out so far.) 

Yoda trained Dooku, who trained Qui-Gon, who trained Obi-Wan (and Anakin), who trained Anakin and Luke, who trained Kylo Ren.

That is... not a good success rate.

Edited to correct Obi-Wan/Luke.

[Manhole Eunuchsbane]

This is an on-going debate, which seems to be inconclusive. Even the cast/crew can't make their minds up.

 

You know, I just realized that The Force Awakens now continues what I will dub The Great Jedi Fail Train: (apologies if anyone else has pointed this out so far.) 

Yoda trained Dooku, who trained Qui-Gon, who trained Obi-Wan (and Anakin), who trained Anakin, who trained Luke, who trained Kylo Ren.

That is... not a good success rate.

Anakin didn't train Luke. 

[ab aeterno]

That wasn't Coruscant, it was a neighbouring Republic system. This was a massively confused plot point and one that was really poorly explained or handled.

Honestly, this sort of thing is one of my few main criticisms of the movie (along with the pedestrian score and the pacing in the latter part of the movie.)

The exposition is far too heavy on some issues, best demonstrated by Snoke's - Your Father. Han Solo. On the Millennium Falcon, line,  (Seriously, guys, stop saying Millennium Falcon, we get it.)

And then on other things, such as which planets were destroyed, - again, seriously, guys, billions of people died, "Welp, that was the Republic," is probably not a strong enough reaction, - and why R2 suddenly wakes up, could have done with more explanation. Now, it's not that we can't work out what is supposed to have happened, but some of these things just felt a little brushed over.

Not that these issues bother me all that much, I'm nit picking really, not saying these are major flaws.

[ab aeterno]

Anakin didn't train Luke. 

Oops, missed Obi-Wan off there. Thanks for pointing out. Will edit.

[Relic]

 

While you've got me in nitpicking mode the entire segment with the aliens running around Solo's ship was bad/out of place.

 

Worst sequence in the movie. Should have cut that and spent the allotted time developing a couple of other characters. 

[ab aeterno]

Worst sequence in the movie. Should have cut that and spent the allotted time developing a couple of other characters. 

Yeah, that was really unnecessary. You could remove the entire sequence with no impact on the plot. It felt like it was just there to give someone an excuse to say "Han Solo" and "Millenium Falcon".

[ab aeterno]

As for why Rey managed to beat Kylo Ren, well, personally I just accepted that 1) Finn had injured him even more, 2) he was tired as well as inured, 3) she was at one with the Force, which in case anyone forgot is exactly the thing that Luke used to learn how to fight with a lightsaber in the first place on the ship (when Finn picked up the little shooter-hover-ball thing, that was awesome - a much better reference than the 10 seconds or so they wasted on the chess-type game).

I'd also add a few points to the Rey/Kylo fight here:

Firstly, it seems to be suggested that perhaps Kylo was never a particularly proficient Jedi/force user in the first place, contributing to his crippling inferiority complex.

Secondly, Ren isn't using any particularly complex technique when he's fighting, or showing much evidence of training, it's mostly brute force and instinct, so if Rey is tapping into her own latent force sensitivity, it's reasonable that she'd be able to put up a decent fight even reactively - (and he's injured, of course.)

Thirdly, as you mentioned Luke - we never see him getting any more lightsaber training after his work with the remote in ANH. During his training with Yoda, there's no real suggestion that Yoda spent much time on saber combat, etc. but he's still able to just about hold his own against Darth Vader, who is highly proficient with a lightsaber - he defeated Dooku, nearly defeated Obi-Wan in his prime, etc. 

To me, Rey winning felt like a callback to how lightsaber combat used to work before the EU and the prequels.

 

 

[Werthead]

Haha. Not really a spoiler, if you want to know who Daniel Craig played in the movie:

Apparently he was the stormtrooper mind-controlled by Rey into letting her out of her cell.