LBGTQ - 4 out of 5 cats prefer lesbians

[Whitestripe]

I had an interesting conversation with my 10 year old daughter last night.  While we were driving home from ice skating, NPR was on. The story was about the election and the LGBTQ vote. Delia says "What does LGBTQ stand for anyway?"  I told her what the letters meant, and she was silent for a second, then said "But isn't it wrong to call them that?" (meaning, I think that you shouldn't even label people at all). So I said "Well, not really. I mean gay people use the term LGBTQ  to identify with their community and people who are like them."  She said, "Oh," in non-convinced sort of way and was silent. Then I asked her (even though I knew the answer) if she knew what it meant to be gay. She said, "Yes, it's when a man loves a man or a woman loves a woman." So then I said "Well,  some people think that isn't right, so members of the LGBTQ community feel like they need to fight to be equal." To which she said "That's silly. You can love whoever you want, and you shouldn't even have to call yourself anything different."  In her mind, you just are what you are, and nobody should even feel the need to take notice of it.

[felice]

4 hours ago, Whitestripe said:

In her mind, you just are what you are, and nobody should even feel the need to take notice of it.

That's awesome 8)

[karaddin]

So there is a discussion in Lit now on depictions of queer characters in Fantasy

Would love to see contributions of other positive depictions, especially when they're ones I haven't read. Also would love input from bi/pan folk and asexual folk on some of the comments around the difficulties with depictions, I think it can be really hard but don't know that my ideas are necessarily spot on here.

[Robin Of House Hill]

On 10/31/2016 at 9:56 AM, Whitestripe said:

"You can love whoever you want, and you shouldn't even have to call yourself anything different."  

 

It would be nice if the world was like that.

[Whitestripe]

9 hours ago, Robin Of House Hill said:

It would be nice if the world was like that.

I know, right? My only hope is that  Delia's attitude is the future.  

[aptdando]

So, this is a request of advice for you nice people.

I'm currently in my fourth out of six year of medicine but I'm considering changing my studies. I was in a bad place during my last years of high school, so I basically let my clueless (or not?) parents decide my university for me. Unfortunately I have always felt extremely dissatisfied with medicine and I'm still trying to gather enough courage to quit (therapy is helping, thankfully).
Problem is, I basically have no idea about what to do.
I realized that gender studies are one of the very few things that never fail to interest me and I am actually passionate about, but what kind of studies could bring me there? Consider that here in my country this is still a niche topic.

[Xray the Enforcer]

I think it would depend on what aspect most interests you. But generally you could probably switch to something like sociology. Or you could focus more on the aspects that most interest you -- pyschology or politics or cultural studies/criticism or anthropology or media studies -- and have gender be the lens through which you approach those broader areas of study. Or you could try to transfer to a university in a country where gender studies are better established, although I realize that this option is not really possible for most people for a number of reasons.

[Sivin]

Posted in two whole threads this week, might as well go for the hat trick. I have a confession/plea, my atypical friends and allies. I have no earthly idea how to do anything regarding day to day living as a woman. I never really let myself get involved in the fairer experiences as a kid, I was busy with other pursuits, and my attempts at research via YOUTUBE and GOOGLE leave my head spinning. 

I quite literally do not know the most basic part of what to do with my lengthening hair, I would have had it cut off several inches ago. 

I have been encouraged to start toying with makeup, but I have no idea what any of it does or why. The verbiage is likewise completely beyond me, and tutorial videos do nothing but make me self conscious.

My VA contacts continuously advise me to experiment with different fashion, positing that even if feminine garb is not something I am ready for then I should try some moderately androgynous articles I find appealing. But I see clothing as a functional extension of one's body and am intimidated by the very idea of altering my cargo shorts or jeans and T shirt combination. Of course I have long pined to prance through the fields of Naboo like Padme in a pretty dress, but such accoutrements would not at this time be remotely appropriate to me. And such thoughts only further my fashion paralysis. I cannot make heads or tails of feminine sizes, cannot find sites to assist me in buying for my frame that is irregular to the feminine producer, and lack the courage to go to an outlet materially represented.

At this point my entire focus is on work and reducing my weight, but if I am ever going to transition openly these issues must be addressed, sooner preferably to late. 

Advice, tips, tricks, or links? Since my banishment and subsequent return I appear to do nothing but ask for help and lament my problems while having no solutions to offer others.

[Xray the Enforcer]

The trick to buying women's clothing is to know three critical measurements: your bust size, waist size, and hip size. Do not pay any fucking attention to the size numbers that manufacturers put in the clothing, except as a general guideline. Once you identify a clothing item that you want to buy, find the company's online size-guide. Buy whichever size best matches your three critical measurements. 

There is nothing wrong with staying within your jeans-and-tshirt comfort zone for now, but maybe try to change it up with accessories (earrings, necklace, etc) or by choosing non-traditional colors. Or buy some fabulous shoes and a sequinned scarf. That's how one of my queer colleagues rolls.

If you're interested, I can post a few articles that cover gender-non-conforming fashion. Those designers will probably be able to accommodate your physique.

Makeup can be confusing. My suggestion: Start with mascara and a tinted lip balm. We can provide you with tons of suggestions in the makeup thread, so join us there!!! My suggestion is to start by going to the grocery store and buying Maybelline Define-A-Lash mascara: https://www.maybelline.com/eye-makeup/mascara/define-a-lash-lengthening-washable-mascara Get it in black. This particular formulation is very easy to use (avoid anything that says it'll build volume for now, it's much harder to deal with), so you can practice. Once you're comfy wearing mascara and lip tint, then we can move on to things like eye shadow and eye liner. I'd save foundation or even tinted moisturizer until much later -- and don't just buy that yourself. Go to a department store with a few good brands (Bobbi Brown, NARS, MAC) and get one of the people there to match your skin to a foundation color. 

[Yukle]

1 hour ago, Sivin said:

My VA contacts continuously advise me to experiment with different fashion, positing that even if feminine garb is not something I am ready for then I should try some moderately androgynous articles I find appealing. But I see clothing as a functional extension of one's body and am intimidated by the very idea of altering my cargo shorts or jeans and T shirt combination. Of course I have long pined to prance through the fields of Naboo like Padme in a pretty dress, but such accoutrements would not at this time be remotely appropriate to me. And such thoughts only further my fashion paralysis. I cannot make heads or tails of feminine sizes, cannot find sites to assist me in buying for my frame that is irregular to the feminine producer, and lack the courage to go to an outlet materially represented.

Do you have a female friend you can shop with? I suggest going with her and beginning in op shops. This means that you won't have to worry about spending money - everything is dirt cheap. The idea isn't to look fab, as such, it's to see what styles and cuts and brands you feel comfortable with.

Depending on your size it will be hard to find things in an average store, but the other thing about op shops is that they tend to have a wider variety of sizes, since they're not fashion centres, they're second hand goods stores.

Shopping with somebody removes the element of feeling on the spot, I think, since you will just seem like an interested buddy diligently shopping with a girlfriend.

And yeah, like Xray said, you need to know your bust, chest and waist and hips. Measure just under your chest bulge, then at its thickest point (if, for instance, you pad or you plan to), and your waist at its narrowest and your hips at their widest.

The rule is MEANT to be for women's clothing that it's your size in inches minus 20. So a size 0 is a 20" circumference waist. Unfortunately, precisely 0% of clothing labels measure humans as their standard, so when they say 8, 10 and 12 they really just mean, "arbitrary sizes 1, 2 and 3".

Also, some brands measure hip size, some waist size, some chest size... it's all so confusing! And don't even get me started on bras... Basically every style of bra comes in one or at best 2 cup sizes per chest size. Which, like, 80% of women don't adhere to.

Edited to add: I'm mostly useless when it comes to makeup. I can't really wear it as I've sensitive skin. So I generally don't. You need to practise a bit, though. Basically it's all pretty much the same, it's how heavy handed you are applying it that makes the difference. In most cases, you'll find that you need to underuse it rather than overuse it. You can accentuate what you want to draw attention to. I have a quite long jaw, for instance, but I can colour my face to make it look rounder and more feminine.

[Sivin]

2 hours ago, Xray the Enforcer said:

The trick to buying women's clothing is to know three critical measurements: your bust size, waist size, and hip size. Do not pay any fucking attention to the size numbers that manufacturers put in the clothing, except as a general guideline. Once you identify a clothing item that you want to buy, find the company's online size-guide. Buy whichever size best matches your three critical measurements. 

There is nothing wrong with staying within your jeans-and-tshirt comfort zone for now, but maybe try to change it up with accessories (earrings, necklace, etc) or by choosing non-traditional colors. Or buy some fabulous shoes and a sequinned scarf. That's how one of my queer colleagues rolls.

If you're interested, I can post a few articles that cover gender-non-conforming fashion. Those designers will probably be able to accommodate your physique.

 

I have been thinking about getting earrings, but I'm wary of appearing too feminine for the coming winter as it is becoming more likely by the day that I will be resigned to considering Tennessee as my "home" and I would prefer any progression I take while living here to be removable.

I do like emeralds, though. Is that a thing that can be done with earrings? As for jeans, I am becoming increasingly determined to acquire a more feminine cut. I am anxious to see what progress my butt has made . But my chief concern with that is I am not sure if I can find any women's jeans that will accommodate my long legs. Men's have waist and inseam, do women's come with any consideration of the leg length?

And yes, I would be very grateful for any links.

1 hour ago, Yukle said:

Do you have a female friend you can shop with? I suggest going with her and beginning in op shops. This means that you won't have to worry about spending money - everything is dirt cheap. The idea isn't to look fab, as such, it's to see what styles and cuts and brands you feel comfortable with.

Depending on your size it will be hard to find things in an average store, but the other thing about op shops is that they tend to have a wider variety of sizes, since they're not fashion centres, they're second hand goods stores.

Shopping with somebody removes the element of feeling on the spot, I think, since you will just seem like an interested buddy diligently shopping with a girlfriend.

And yeah, like Xray said, you need to know your bust, chest and waist and hips. Measure just under your chest bulge, then at its thickest point (if, for instance, you pad or you plan to), and your waist at its narrowest and your hips at their widest.

The rule is MEANT to be for women's clothing that it's your size in inches minus 20. So a size 0 is a 20" circumference waist. Unfortunately, precisely 0% of clothing labels measure humans as their standard, so when they say 8, 10 and 12 they really just mean, "arbitrary sizes 1, 2 and 3".

Also, some brands measure hip size, some waist size, some chest size... it's all so confusing! And don't even get me started on bras... Basically every style of bra comes in one or at best 2 cup sizes per chest size. Which, like, 80% of women don't adhere to.

Edited to add: I'm mostly useless when it comes to makeup. I can't really wear it as I've sensitive skin. So I generally don't. You need to practise a bit, though. Basically it's all pretty much the same, it's how heavy handed you are applying it that makes the difference. In most cases, you'll find that you need to underuse it rather than overuse it. You can accentuate what you want to draw attention to. I have a quite long jaw, for instance, but I can colour my face to make it look rounder and more feminine.

I don't have any friends, unfortunately, but your explanation of the sizing system is most appreciated. I felt like I was looking at computer code every time I tried to look up what sizes I should be after. I've already run into a nightmare with bras, as I'm developed enough to definitely need one but nobody seems to make the right chest/cup combination for me to be able to use anything but yoga and sports bras at the moment. 

I don't really want to get too into tops at the moment, as I am determined to lose a deal of weight and don't want to have to buy a 3rd wardrobe. I also want to see where my body goes as well and adjust from there, but of course all insight and advice is appreciated.

[Dr. Pepper]

31 minutes ago, Sivin said:

I have been thinking about getting earrings, but I'm wary of appearing too feminine for the coming winter as it is becoming more likely by the day that I will be resigned to considering Tennessee as my "home" and I would prefer any progression I take while living here to be removable.

I do like emeralds, though. Is that a thing that can be done with earrings? As for jeans, I am becoming increasingly determined to acquire a more feminine cut. I am anxious to see what progress my butt has made . But my chief concern with that is I am not sure if I can find any women's jeans that will accommodate my long legs. Men's have waist and inseam, do women's come with any consideration of the leg length?

 

Often you can find short or long/tall inseam for women's jeans.  It mostly depends on brand.

I think skinny jeans tend to be a good universal cut as a starting point for jeans.  I think that cut gives a lot of room for you to explore a style in tops and shoes that you might like.

Also, where in Tennessee?  

[Sivin]

9 minutes ago, Dr. Pepper said:

Often you can find short or long/tall inseam for women's jeans.  It mostly depends on brand.

I think skinny jeans tend to be a good universal cut as a starting point for jeans.  I think that cut gives a lot of room for you to explore a style in tops and shoes that you might like.

Also, where in Tennessee?  

Hillsboro. It's about 45 minutes south of Murfreesboro. Which is about 45 minutes south of Nashville. Which is about 135 minutes north of Chattanooga.

[Yukle]

Just now, Sivin said:

Hillsboro. It's about 45 minutes south of Murfreesboro. Which is about 45 minutes south of Nashville. Which is about 135 minutes north of Chattanooga.

Your local area has really pretty names.  

[karaddin]

Please don't compare clothing size to computer code, code normally makes sense if you know how to read it, clothing size never does  Jeans with the leg length as an option is an American privilege - it should be standard but for some reason its not - here in Aus they at least tell you these days but its almost all 32 or 34, the latter on fits me with heels which means its way too long for most women. Getting clothes at first was such a terrifying experience, and I only managed it due to being able to do it with friends. Ordering online could be a saving grace here? I really didn't appreciate how much my butt changed after I stopped wearing men's jeans until a year or two later when I tried to put the old pair on and they actually didn't fit anymore lol.

I stuck almost entirely to my jeans and t-shirt comfort zone at first, just changed to the feminine styles and cuts. Got some cardigans at first which I barely wear now as I followed it up with some awesome leather jackets a little later that are now my staple. As I got more comfortable I started wearing skirts and dresses more and now much prefer them when the weather permits (I'm a very cold person so that's not as much as it should be), but you can happily exist in a femme-tomboy kinda mid zone that is quite clearly asking to be read as a woman but still wearing jeans and t-shirt.

Make up is going to be overwhelming for a while, I never got good at it and I rarely wear it, but when I do most commonly it is just mascara and lipstick. I favour dark vampy lips, but that's pretty full on to start with as they're quite eye catching and they kinda go with my "visibly queer" thing.  X's advice on starting light is definitely a good approach I think, its really just a matter of practice until you get more comfortable. I will recommend very very strongly to invest in brushes for your eye makeup when you start doing eyeshadow - they're a lot easier and better than the dodgy things that come with cheaper eye shadow.

I still get terrified the first couple of times I go into a new "women's space", doesn't really matter what it is - its that I haven't been in that kind of space before, but that fades pretty quickly and I relax. 

If you wanted to add me on FB feel free - shoot me a PM for the details.

[Dr. Pepper]

6 hours ago, Sivin said:

Hillsboro. It's about 45 minutes south of Murfreesboro. Which is about 45 minutes south of Nashville. Which is about 135 minutes north of Chattanooga.

omigosh, tiny town.  I'm already freaking out just at the idea of maybe moving to the Chattanooga area soon.

[Jen'ari]

On 03/11/2016 at 1:53 AM, Whitestripe said:

I know, right? My only hope is that  Delia's attitude is the future.  

I think it will be in honesty, one only has to look at the attitude changes in the last 30 years or so, sadly it will probably still take longer than anyone hopes.

[Xray the Enforcer]

11 hours ago, Yukle said:

And don't even get me started on bras... Basically every style of bra comes in one or at best 2 cup sizes per chest size. Which, like, 80% of women don't adhere to.

This is not true for quality bras -- which sadly US chain stores seem to carry very few of. Sivin, if you ever get to NYC give me a holler. The owner of the lingerie store around the corner from my building is very open to doing bra fittings for trans and genderqueer individuals. She's AWESOME and wonderfully body-positive. I just went for a fitting last weekend and discovered I went up another two cup sizes to a 34G. O____o

BTW: Herroom.com carries bras and bralettes from 28A to 56K

[Xray the Enforcer]

Oh yeah, and to echo Karaddin -- I don't wear much makeup, mostly because I'm lazy AF. But I'll get into that in the makeup thread.

[karaddin]

I think I was too busy swooning when we met to really pay attention to how much make up you were wearing, so it clearly works anyway