Sanrast Posted June 29, 2017 Share Posted June 29, 2017 I watch the show but only now I have started the first book (I'm somewhere around the half). My question to you who have read the books is, do every character has a personal sigil (except the sigil of his/her house)? I know that Sansa has one (a wolf with some leafs/flowers) and Stanis (a flaming heart). But do other characters have also? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Angel Eyes Posted June 29, 2017 Share Posted June 29, 2017 She does? Never seen it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sanrast Posted June 29, 2017 Author Share Posted June 29, 2017 Just now, Angel Eyes said: She does? Never seen it. here Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stormking902 Posted June 29, 2017 Share Posted June 29, 2017 In the books Sansa still uses the regular house Stark sigil, only cool characters and Freys have there own personally unique sigil. My favorite of all is the black fish since it suits him so much better then the silver trout, I think jon will take a white dire wold as his sigil eventually. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Davjos Posted June 29, 2017 Share Posted June 29, 2017 Most sigil's are just the family's sigil. They don't get a personal one, probably because the family name is the biggest part of their identity. If bastards take a sigil they often swith the colours around, as Jon will with a White Direwolf. If a house forms a cadet-branch, such as the Lannisters of Darry they often quarter their heraldry. So some people walk around with 2,3 or 4 sigils combined. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ferocious Veldt Roarer Posted June 29, 2017 Share Posted June 29, 2017 Most characters don't have their personal coats of arms. Some do. Littlefinger, some Targs (Maekar, Bloodraven). I'm not sure if Stannis' new logo counts as "personal", or rather as rebranding House Baratheon of Dragonstone. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Angel Eyes Posted June 29, 2017 Share Posted June 29, 2017 Well, in the books Garlan and Loras appear to have their own sigils; Garlan has two golden roses on green (second son) and Loras has three (third son). Sansa's signal appears to be an invention of the show, since it uses the show's House Stark sigil. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Commentator Posted June 29, 2017 Share Posted June 29, 2017 The majority of the nobles are very proud of their houses and unlike to have a personal sigil. Stannis had his own banner because of his change of faith. Jon shouldn't have his own banner because he's a man of the night's watch. One like Tyrion who defected from House Lannister could have his own banner if he ever comes in a position where people follow him. Something like a Bobcat would do nicely for a Tyrion sigil. Daenerys can have multiple sigils depending on the occasion. The sigil of her house, House Targaryen. She could have a new one made for her status as the Mother of Dragons. 13 minutes ago, Angel Eyes said: Well, in the books Garlan and Loras appear to have their own sigils; Garlan has two golden roses on green (second son) and Loras has three (third son). Sansa's signal appears to be an invention of the show, since it uses the show's House Stark sigil. Off topic but I am a fan of Lee Van Cleef. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cpg2016 Posted June 29, 2017 Share Posted June 29, 2017 All noble houses have their own sigils. Whether one takes a sub-sigil (e.g. Garlans 2 Golden Roses) seems to be a matter of personal preference, and also seems very tied to the attitudes of the head of House and the prevalence of Andal chivalric culture. For example, I don't think we see any Northerners doing this (though someone can correct me if I've forgotten). Likewise, in a House like the Lannisters, dominated by a guy who is so focused on the honor of the House, Tywin seems to have allowed very little deviation from the typical Lannister styling. The Freys seem to do it as a way of differentiating the various children/grandchildren of Lord Walder, since half of them are also named Walder. I would also guess that personal sigils (as opposed to House sigils) are more important for tournament knights, where you might have several men from one House competing, and more definition is needed. But honestly those are guesses. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sanrast Posted June 29, 2017 Author Share Posted June 29, 2017 2 hours ago, Stormking902 said: My favorite of all is the black fish since it suits him so much better then the silver trout Oh yeah I forgot to include him in my post. Thanks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prince Yourwetdream Aeryn Posted June 29, 2017 Share Posted June 29, 2017 Sansa's sigil reminded me Laughing tree. Hmmmm. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shouldve Taken The Black Posted June 30, 2017 Share Posted June 30, 2017 I seem to recall a SSM where GRRM discusses this, and suggests that the rules of heraldry are pretty loose in Westros, citing as an example that Robb uses a direwolf’s snarling head as a badge rather than the running direwolf which is normal for the Starks. Splitting of sigils seems to be a personal decision – for example Joffery quarters his sigil with both the stag and the lion, obviously a move to give prominence to the Lannisters. Littlefinger simply abandons his family sigil, the Titan’s Head, for a mockingbird. Some bastards reverse the colours of their family sigil, others use a bend sinister, others just make up their own (check out Bittersteel’s badassery of a sigil). Generally, I think most use the family sigil as standard, occasionally altering it according to taste, or because like the Blackfish they’ve got a cool nickname and want to celebrate it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Graydon Hicks Posted July 30, 2017 Share Posted July 30, 2017 normally, its only the house sigil, with few exceptions, like brynden tully and a few others. but most of those sigils begin as the personal sigil for the founder of a house. sigil of house blackfyre began as the personal emblem of the Great Bastard himself. any knights that go on to found a house, or small folk who are raised, like the founder of the cleganes, maybe choose or be given a emblem, to denote their new status. after the house is founded, then that sigil would go from personal to being the house sigil. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brightstar_ Posted July 30, 2017 Share Posted July 30, 2017 I think it's most common for bastards to do this, most of the time switching the colours (think of Daemon Blackfyre) to show they are still part of that house even if they aren't really accepted, and not allowed to wear the actual house sigil. Some nobles' personal arms like the Blackfish' also seem to, in a way, demonstrate that he doesn't really belong to House Tully (in the traditional way of fathering sons and continuing their line that is). There's also a few examples of combining sigils (think Bittersteel), as a way to also show pride towards your maternal House I'd guess. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Luddagain Posted July 30, 2017 Share Posted July 30, 2017 In medieval times most young Lords did have their own personal badge or sigil. After all if brothers were in the same tourney they would need something to distinguish themselves. They would give their particular badge to their personal servants and if relevant their armies. I think we see it all the time - the green apple fossoways, white direwolf, black dragon/red dragon, black fish, the three Ryswell brothers with different colour horses. The most obvious from history is the white and red roses of the two Plantagenet branches - York and Lancaster. It seems to me that if Robb chose a snarling head (did he - is it in the books?) Jon a white direwolf, I think Rickon would have a black wolf. Bran as the son to inherit perhaps will just keep Ned's. Somehow I rather like the idea of Arya's being just as she suggested - a wolf with a fish in its mouth. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trigger Warning Posted July 30, 2017 Share Posted July 30, 2017 There doesn't seem to be any rules for the granting of arms, just take it at face value, you can have different arms but most people don't bother. Reality is either GRRM doesn't want to go through the individual arms of most people and so only gave them to a select few or just didn't want things getting more complicated than it already is, most people wouldn't even know what most heraldry terms means. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shouldve Taken The Black Posted July 31, 2017 Share Posted July 31, 2017 21 hours ago, Luddagain said: It seems to me that if Robb chose a snarling head (did he - is it in the books?) It's described in GOT through Bran's POV when Rob's setting off to war (I think) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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