Ded As Ned Posted February 22, 2018 Share Posted February 22, 2018 Thamel and Forde doubling down on the FBI scandal drama. Quote So how deep did Miller’s operation go? One source with knowledge of the investigation estimated that ASM Sports was paying more than three times as many prospects, and families of prospects, as clients they signed. The impact on the NCAA landscape is expected to be significant. No one is certain if the federal government is targeting other NBA agents amid the competitive landscape, but it is widely believed within the sport that Miller was far from the only agent operating in this manner. I'm still skeptical that much more will come of the FBI investigation. What will the NCAA do? Just invalidate entire seasons because so many schools were involved? If the FBI had enough incriminating evidence against more people, I feel like they would have been charged already. The fact that they haven't makes me think they don't have enough on the other parties to get convictions... now as to how the evidence applies to amateurism rules and the NCAA is an entirely different thing... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RedEyedGhost Posted February 23, 2018 Share Posted February 23, 2018 Had to get tested to get cleared to play after the last time he was banned for PEDs, gets tested and they find trace amounts in his system yet again. Seems like a smart guy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rhom Posted February 23, 2018 Author Share Posted February 23, 2018 Welp... there's the other shoe. Quote The documents tie some of the biggest names and programs in the sport to activity that appears to violate the NCAA’s amateurism rules. This could end up casting a pall over the NCAA tournament because of eligibility issues. (NCAA officials declined a request for comment.) There’s potential impermissible benefits and preferential treatment for players and families of players at Duke, North Carolina, Texas, Kentucky, Michigan State, USC, Alabama and a host of other schools. The documents link some of the sport’s biggest current stars – Michigan State’s Miles Bridges, Alabama’s Collin Sexton and Duke’s Wendell Carter – to specific potential extra benefits for either the athletes or their family members. The amounts tied to players in the case range from basic meals to tens of thousands of dollars. Looks exactly like we figured. Payments to recruits by an agent, but not necessarily on behalf of a school. And its just one agent, if we were to get listings from more agents it would get even bigger. You know its bad when Fred Van Vleet is getting paid. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rhom Posted February 23, 2018 Author Share Posted February 23, 2018 If you want a quick idea of what to expect here... watch what Duke does. Current player Wendell Carter is named. If Duke sits him out from here out, hold on tight because its going to be a bumpy ride. If he plays, just work on the assumption the NCAA isn't going to do anything. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ded As Ned Posted February 23, 2018 Share Posted February 23, 2018 1 hour ago, Rhom said: If you want a quick idea of what to expect here... watch what Duke does. Current player Wendell Carter is named. If Duke sits him out from here out, hold on tight because its going to be a bumpy ride. If he plays, just work on the assumption the NCAA isn't going to do anything. Or... watch and see if UK sits out Kevin Knox? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ferrum Aeternum Posted February 23, 2018 Share Posted February 23, 2018 My guess is the NCAA won't do anything, because it can't risk gutting its cash cow. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ded As Ned Posted February 23, 2018 Share Posted February 23, 2018 No doubt. The NCAA wouldn't exist without the money from the big 3 sports and their exploitation of these athletes... if they do try to bring down the hammer maybe the power 5 schools will get serious about leaving the NCAA? It's been discussed ad nauseum over the years, but the NCAA's "amateurism" rules are a joke. How about this... If the athletes aren't allowed to make money (or take even a free meal) off their talents, then the NCAA isn't allowed to either? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rhom Posted February 23, 2018 Author Share Posted February 23, 2018 Remember. The College Football Championship is not a NCAA thing. The actual NCAA's biggest money maker is the NCAA Men's Basketball tournament. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ded As Ned Posted February 23, 2018 Share Posted February 23, 2018 Wow you're right. I figured regular season football took more than that... but after doing some research it's all a drop in the bucket compared to the March Madness revenue. Interesting. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rhom Posted February 23, 2018 Author Share Posted February 23, 2018 Apparently, much of the claimed travel in the books would appear to be a bit iffy. On the same day he claimed a hotel stay at the Loews Vanderbilt in Nashville for a meeting with Wade Baldwin, he also had a meal with Texas’ Prince Ibeh. The meal with Ibeh was supposed to be at the Lava Café, which is in…Philadelphia? Searching Google I do not see a Lava Cafe in Texas or Nashville. So the day after losing to Kansas in Austin, Ibeh travelled to Philadelphia for a $37 dinner? Philadelphia also has a Loews Hotel so I guess Ibeh and Baldwin could have both travelled to Philly… in the middle of the week? Edit: Minor correction... On 3/1 he had a meal with Ibeh at Lava Cafe, and also a meal with Brice Johnson and Dion Bathea (his AAU coach) at Carrabba’s. Then had a meal with Isaiah Taylor (also of Texas) at PF Chang’s on the 2nd, and that was the date he marked the Baldwin meeting at the Loews as well. So in a 2-day span, he met with players for UNC, Texas, and Vanderbilt, and somehow didn’t expense any flights? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
S John Posted February 23, 2018 Share Posted February 23, 2018 9 hours ago, Rhom said: Welp... there's the other shoe. Looks exactly like we figured. Payments to recruits by an agent, but not necessarily on behalf of a school. And its just one agent, if we were to get listings from more agents it would get even bigger. You know its bad when Fred Van Vleet is getting paid. When I saw Texas on the list I'm thinking OK might see Mo Bamba, Jarrett Allen, maybe Matt Coleman. But its Eric Davis and Prince Ibeh? What the fuck. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ramsay B. Posted February 24, 2018 Share Posted February 24, 2018 Well damn. http://www.espn.com/mens-college-basketball/story/_/id/22559284/sean-miller-arizona-christian-dawkins-discussed-payment-ensure-deandre-ayton-signing-according-fbi-investigation Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RedEyedGhost Posted February 24, 2018 Share Posted February 24, 2018 2 hours ago, Ramsay B. said: Well damn. http://www.espn.com/mens-college-basketball/story/_/id/22559284/sean-miller-arizona-christian-dawkins-discussed-payment-ensure-deandre-ayton-signing-according-fbi-investigation The way he's been hiding out regarding this the entire season makes me think he eats a bullet within a year. I hope I'm wrong, but I'm getting that feeling big time. Self on it: Apple on it: The only thing I've seen regarding KU was the stuff about Jackson's mom and that Elijah Johnson's name was in it - with the name of a team he played for in Europe attached to his "loan", so obviously that's after his eligibility ran out. I haven't had any time to delve into all of this today though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
S John Posted February 24, 2018 Share Posted February 24, 2018 39 minutes ago, RedEyedGhost said: The way he's been hiding out regarding this the entire season makes me think he eats a bullet within a year. I hope I'm wrong, but I'm getting that feeling big time. Self on it: Apple on it: The only thing I've seen regarding KU was the stuff about Jackson's mom and that Elijah Johnson's name was in it - with the name of a team he played for in Europe attached to his "loan", so obviously that's after his eligibility ran out. I haven't had any time to delve into all of this today though. Seems like there’s going to be a pretty wide range of impropriety from free dinner on one hand to Sean Miller wheelin’ and dealin’ 6 figure payouts. From what I saw earlier, for at least half of the implicated schools, it was ‘dinner’. Doesn’t mean there’s not more dirt yet to come out on anyone and everyone, but it looks to me like a good chunk of the named schools - based on what we know so far - probably still don’t have much to worry about. A few of them are def. gonna get toroedoed though. Huggins apparently commented about this today as well but the article was behind a pay wall. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rhom Posted February 24, 2018 Author Share Posted February 24, 2018 5 hours ago, S John said: Seems like there’s going to be a pretty wide range of impropriety from free dinner on one hand to Sean Miller wheelin’ and dealin’ 6 figure payouts. From what I saw earlier, for at least half of the implicated schools, it was ‘dinner’. Doesn’t mean there’s not more dirt yet to come out on anyone and everyone, but it looks to me like a good chunk of the named schools - based on what we know so far - probably still don’t have much to worry about. A few of them are def. gonna get toroedoed though. Huggins apparently commented about this today as well but the article was behind a pay wall. Yeah, I’d say Thamel and Forde definitely did their usual schtik and over sensationalized this whole thing to generate clicks. Is it bad? Sure. Is there a bigger problem in college basketball? Probably. But this in and of itself isn’t earth shaking. Now... if the FBI got records like this from say, the top ten agents out there? That would likely have a lot more names and something to worry about. From Kentucky’s standpoint, the only worrying claim is Bam. It looks like Noel was a loan after he left school and Knox was one of those who had a meal. Adebayo though? Well that looks pretty damning. It is marked as a “bad loan.” He didn’t sign with ASM and there was some talk that people were trying to get him to go to NCState. Some speculation (likely baseless... but that’s what we do) is that the money went to a family friend who was supposed to get him to NCSt. Miller on wiretap is crazy though. There was a time I thought I would favor him as next coach at UK. Guess not anymore... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sperry Posted February 24, 2018 Share Posted February 24, 2018 There are 4 programs that have consistently recruited the top 5 star kids from the cesspool of elite AAU and basketball factory prep schools: Arizona, Kentucky, Duke, and Kansas. You cannot fish in that pond without getting your hands dirty. We all know the NCAA won't do anything to the latter 3, so it's almost a surefire that Zona is getting nuked from orbit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joe Pesci Posted February 25, 2018 Share Posted February 25, 2018 I'm really going to enjoy it if/when Sean Miller gets his comeuppance. His father is considered the measuring stick of high school basketball coaches in the Pittsburgh area, but he was known to get kids to "transfer" into the school district well before it became commonplace. Not really surprised that circumventing the rules runs in the family. Also making my day was Pitt dropping a 7 spot in the first half against Virginia. What a hot mess that program is, and it all boils down to the fact that the fans/alumni/administration think they're a top tier hoops program when that is just simply not the case. I fucking love it! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
S John Posted February 25, 2018 Share Posted February 25, 2018 56 minutes ago, Joe Pesci said: I'm really going to enjoy it if/when Sean Miller gets his comeuppance. His father is considered the measuring stick of high school basketball coaches in the Pittsburgh area, but he was known to get kids to "transfer" into the school district well before it became commonplace. Not really surprised that circumventing the rules runs in the family. Also making my day was Pitt dropping a 7 spot in the first half against Virginia. What a hot mess that program is, and it all boils down to the fact that the fans/alumni/administration think they're a top tier hoops program when that is just simply not the case. I fucking love it! I had to do a double take on that halftime score. Seven points in a half. Seven. I’ve seen WVU lay their fair share of eggs in my day, but wow. Lol. Hard to not soak up the schadenfreude. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dbunting Posted February 25, 2018 Share Posted February 25, 2018 The wire tap thing caught some people off guard, many were ready to defend him at first. The majority of what came out was to me trivial, dinners should not be an issue especially if the schools had no clue it ever happened. I mean it's not like the kids would come back from the dinner wearing t-shirts and having 5 bags of take out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rhom Posted February 25, 2018 Author Share Posted February 25, 2018 I went to the Missouri game and then out with a friend and his wife for his birthday. So we sat at a bar and watched Zona v Oregon. Great game. I’ve been favoring Bagley as number one in the draft, but I think Ayton has passed him for me. Speaking of... so I gotta figure that Miller arranged the payment to Ayton and then the FBI case broke before the payment was made. Hence the decision to sit Miller and play Ayton. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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