Football: 3rd Season Meltdown

[Philokles]

2 hours ago, A Horse Named Stranger said:

Max Meyer is rumoredly in talks with Crystal Palace, not sure how he fits in with the more phyiscal EPL play.

Strange move for a world class player who could play for any club in Europe.

2 hours ago, A Horse Named Stranger said:

AndChelsea is in talks with Dortmund about Pulisic. The transfer fee would supposedly be around 73m €. Which is pretty much in line with what I said on the last page, that Dortmund thinks 70m+ is the right price for him.

That figure seems about right for Pulisic the player, but way too low for his brand. Even if Abramovic didn’t want to pay that much, Nike could come to some agreement as they could stump up most the money and still make a profit off the shirt sales.

[A Horse Named Stranger]

1 hour ago, Philokles said:

Strange move for a world class player who could play for any club in Europe.

Quote

World class is pushing it. He is a talented player, who last season finally managed to perform accordingly. But clearly not World Class. And I'd guess a lot of clubs agree with that assessment, as in there were probably not that many clubs interested in him. Whether Palace is a step up for him from a sporting perspective, that's not for me to judge, But EPL money probably makes that move worth his while.

1 hour ago, Philokles said:

That figure seems about right for Pulisic the player, but way too low for his brand. Even if Abramovic didn’t want to pay that much, Nike could come to some agreement as they could stump up most the money and still make a profit off the shirt sales.

I don't think the player is worth 70m right now, well at least to a non EPL club. He is a talented player, nobody questions that. But he really should take the next step mentality wise. Which was one of the criticisms from Dortmund officials last season, that he really tuned out in difficult games and in a difficult period in general. If he can play to his potential in those difficult games and situations, then he is worth the 70m. Admittedly Pulisic is still young and can grow as player, but he really has to take that step. As for the marketing value, suffice to say, he actually looks like the first US player. who could get into the World Class bracket (unlike Ado or Donovan), but again, he has to take that final step.

[Philokles]

25 minutes ago, A Horse Named Stranger said:

World class is pushing it. He is a talented player, who last season finally managed to perform accordingly. But clearly not World Class. And I'd guess a lot of clubs agree with that assessment, as in there were probably not that many clubs interested in him. Whether Palace is a step up for him from a sporting perspective, that's not for me to judge, But EPL money probably makes that move worth his while.

Yes, that was meant as a joke about how his agent’s rather lofty estimation of his ability hasn’t been shared by managers and sporting directors around Europe. Meyer will probably do well at Palace if played as a deep lying midfielder, but it was only ever going to be midtable PL clubs who would be interested in a non-elite player on those wages.

 

[A Horse Named Stranger]

Ah, ok, the irony in your post was a bit lost on me. 

[Jordan La Cabra]

18 hours ago, Mark Antony said:

I know Rugani played under Sarri at Empoli and that was the basis in the interest from Chelsea but they don’t need a CB imo. Christensen had his shaky moments in the 2nd half of last season but I rate him pretty highly and think him and Rudiger would be a good partnership in a back four. If David Luiz stays healthy he can slot in fine as well. The fullback situation looks much worse than the CB one at Chelsea. Will be interesting to see if Azpi moves back to one of the flanks. Too good not to start but maybe not suited to playing CB in a back four so I imagine he will.

 

17 hours ago, Iskaral Pust said:

Chelsea seem like the last team who need another CB, especially if they do commit to a back four.  As @Mark Antony pointed out, they'll have a bigger problem with getting the right balance in FBs/WBs.  Azpi and Moses may split time depending on opposition.  When Liverpool fixed their FB positioning problem last year (around November/December), Gomez became noticeably more defensive than Moreno so that it almost looked like a back three when attacking.  It worked well enough so I would not discount Azpi as a RB in the new system, but a DM like Kante could probably provide a lot of cover for Moses and Alonso.

Defence is an area Chelsea look stacked in, on paper. 

Sarri prefers to play 433, so we will see a switch back to a back four, as we have done in preseason. It's when you try to compile our best back four with the players we have, that you begin to wonder if we are strong enough at the back.

Take right back, for starters. Azpilicueta, Zappacosta and Moses are likely to be our three options, but I am unsure as to whether any of them bring the right balance. Azpilicueta began his Chelsea career at full back; while he was as strong defensively as any full back in the league, he wasn't quite as good going forward. He seemed to create more chances playing at RCB under Conte, as he was often left unmarked, occupying half spaces from which he could have time to cross the ball into the box. Moses was initially a forward, so making the transition to RWB was possible, but the transition to a complete full back might be difficult for him. Zappacosta might actually bring the most balance, but I would still pick Azpilicueta ahead of him due to his defensive ability and leadership qualities.

Left back is a bit more simple. Alonso and Emerson should find the switch from wing back to full back easy enough. The only problem with Alonso is that he is a lot better in the final third than the defensive third. Again, wing back probably suited him more, as he had extra cover when going forwards. Hopefully, as Isk points out, a player like Kante can provide the cover needed when the full backs go forward. 

Trying to work out our best centre back pairing is tough. David Luiz had his best season during 16/17, playing in the middle of a back three. As much as I highly rate Christensen, he reminds me of the type of defender that would suit a back three more than a back four, too, as he likes to come out with the ball. Gary Cahill, clearly, can play in a back four, but I wonder how high up Sarri's list of choices he will be. Rudiger was our best centre back last season, but, again, that was in a three man defence. I think he played in a back three for Roma, too. I'd say Rudiger is most likely to start, it's just a matter of who should play alongside him, and none of the other three players mentioned are clear frontrunners, which is probably why Sarri showed an interest in bringing in one of his own choices. 

Side note: I've been very impressed by Ampadu anytime I've seen him play. I wouldn't like to see us sign someone new if it meant further blocking his path. The Europa League group stage would be a great opportunity to let him find his feet.

[Iskaral Pust]

Now I'm worried.  Liverpool fans are crowing too much about Mourinho, and gleefully monitoring every word on RedCafe.  Expectations are so low now that he's guaranteed to exceed them and make Liverpool fandom look stupid.  Why do we always get drawn into hyperbole?

[Iskaral Pust]

Basel got knocked out of the CL qualifiers by PAOK.  That pushes Roma from pot 3 to pot 2.

If Benfica also fail in the CL qualifiers then Liverpool will also get promoted from pot 3 to pot 2.  Benfica play Fenerbahce in the CL qualifying third round and, if successful, would then have a fourth round qualifying tie too.

Hopefully after this coming season Liverpool will have accumulated enough points to go directly into pot 2 in future (or into pot 1 when we finally win the PL).  Right now the look-back period includes too many years when we weren't in the CL or even in European competition at all.

Overall, pot 1 looks really solid as usual.  Lokomotiv Moscow are the only soft draw there, although I wouldn't be terrified of PSG.  I'd even welcome a group with Madrid to get more experience playing teams like that instead of learning the hard way in the final.

Pot 2 just got tougher with Roma in place of Basel.  Shakhtar, Benfica*, Porto and Dortmund are probably the choice draws in that order.  It's difficult to know how a very good Napoli team will do without Sarri.  (*if they qualify)

Pot 3 has a lot of variation.  Monaco and Liverpool are the teams to avoid.

Pot 4 has some teams from very small leagues (Celtic, Brugge), but also some big clubs who have not been a consistent CL/EL qualifier lately, e.g. Valencia, Inter, PSV.  Valencia and PSV have a good chance of ending up in pot 3 depending on who makes it through the qualifying rounds.

[Iskaral Pust]

I heard from friends who went to the Chelsea-Arsenal match in Dublin today that Arsenal had more supporters, Chelsea were the better team, Jorginho and Hudson-Odoi (in Hazard’s position) were very good but Morata was terrible, Arsenal’s defense looked vulnerable with a high line and at set pieces, Ozil/Mkhi/Auba/Laca grew into the game and had more quality than Chelsea’s patched-together attack. 

It reminds me of going to see preseason games in Dublin when I was a kid.  Although Liverpool/Spurs/Celtic against Bohemians at Dalymount Park or Shelbourne Rovers at Tolka Park back then is very different from Chelsea vs. Arsenal or Liverpool vs. Napoli at the Aviva Stadium now.  Still, I was lucky that Dublin was a regular preseason destination back then and tickets didn’t cost much (2 pounds for kids at the stiles for the open standing area).  I saw Barnes, Beardsley, Rush, Aldridge, Whelan, Houghton, Gazza, Lineker, among others, scorie past hapless Irish part-timers. 

[Raja]

So, they mic'ed up Brad Guzan whilst he was playing against the Juve in a friendly. This is hilarious.

[Jordan La Cabra]

7 hours ago, Iskaral Pust said:

It reminds me of going to see preseason games in Dublin when I was a kid.  Although Liverpool/Spurs/Celtic against Bohemians at Dalymount Park or Shelbourne Rovers at Tolka Park back then is very different from Chelsea vs. Arsenal or Liverpool vs. Napoli at the Aviva Stadium now.  Still, I was lucky that Dublin was a regular preseason destination back then and tickets didn’t cost much (2 pounds for kids at the stiles for the open standing area).  I saw Barnes, Beardsley, Rush, Aldridge, Whelan, Houghton, Gazza, Lineker, among others, scorie past hapless Irish part-timers. 

I was at a Bohemians vs Tottenham mid-season friendly at Dalymount Park in 2003. Though it was the Irish part-timers that prevailed, putting 3 goals by a much, much changed Tottenham side, whose biggest stars on the night were the likes of Sheringham, King, Carr, Etherington, Anderton and Doherty. Robbie Keane was there, but he didn't play.

Chris Hughton was there, too, but in a coaching capacity.

 

[Iskaral Pust]

With one week remaining in the transfer window, I doubt Liverpool are making any more additions.  I think their focus now is on moving out some peripheral names.  

Looking at the squad compared to a year ago, we have lost Coutinho, Can and Ox (just for this season) and gained Shaqiri, Fabinho and Keita, plus gained VVD and Alisson.  So we haven’t actually added any depth for our midfield and attack, just redistributed the concentration on Coutinho.  Really our major improvement is at CB and GK.  It helps that Clyne, Lallana and Sturridge are all fit now, but none of them were expected to miss the whole season at this point last year and who knows who’ll be struck down this time? (Sturridge will; we all know that one for sure)

With Origi and Ings no longer viewed as back-ups for our forwards, and grave doubts about Solanke, we still look thin up top.  Lallana and Shaqiri will be viewed as back-ups to the wide forward positions, just as Lallana and Coutinho were last year.  And Rhian Brewster may get a chance as a back-up striker but he has been injured for all of pre-season.

Fingers crossed then that our front three stay healthy and free of injury.  

[Mark Antony]

Seems Inter hesitated on Vidal because they have dreams of Modric which enabled Barca to get another gazump in. Vidal at Inter seemed like a much better fit. Shame. Maybe they will actually get Modric but I doubt it. 

[Vin]

36 minutes ago, Mark Antony said:

Seems Inter hesitated on Vidal because they have dreams of Modric which enabled Barca to get another gazump in. Vidal at Inter seemed like a much better fit. Shame. Maybe they will actually get Modric but I doubt it. 

Modric isn't going anywhere. Papa Perez is in a bit of a spot now that he offloaded Ronaldo and failed to replace him with Hazard or get a world class striker to finally send benzema to the farm . Not to mention that fans are still somewhat miffed about the way beloved zidane left and think Perez had something to do with it . I really don't see him selling the fan favorite best midfielder in the world (even if he's old , no drop off in performance and kovacic can rest him in unimportant games ) who just led his nation to the world cup final . Inter are delusional if they think they're getting him without including icardi and a fuck ton of money in the deal.

[Consigliere]

I don't think Real Madrid fans need to worry about Modric being sold. Reliable Madrid journalists have reported that Perez has made it clear that Modric will not be sold unless someone pays the buyout clause. If Inter delayed on Vidal because they thought that they could land Modric then they were playing a fool's game. 

[Mark Antony]

Di Marzio and Fabrizio Romano both reported that Inters interest in Modric was genuine and they are reliable for Italian teams. 

[Consigliere]

I'm sure their interest was genuine but it matters not since the Madrid based journos are all saying that Perez has ruled out the possibility of Modric being sold. No club can afford to pay his buyout. 

[Jordan La Cabra]

Wonderful bicycle kick goal from Lewis Ferguson of Aberdeen to make it 1-1 away to Burnley (2-2 on aggregate).  

[Iskaral Pust]

1 hour ago, Jordan La Cabra said:

Wonderful bicycle kick goal from Lewis Ferguson of Aberdeen to make it 1-1 away to Burnley (2-2 on aggregate).  

I can't believe Burnley might fluff their only ever chance in Europe.  This looks like it's going to ET.

[Iskaral Pust]

Opening matches are a week away.  Usually there's a lot of randomness in the first week or two, especially after a WC, and generally with new players/managers and not everyone yet up to match sharpness.

Although Utd have some justifiable moans about players arriving late after the WC, I have some sympathy too for Leicester who have lost Mahrez and won't have Vardy or Maguire available for the opening match, plus they're away from home.  So the season opener may not offer top quality, but it could at least be unpredictable.

Liverpool will also miss some late returnees: Lovren and Henderson very unlikely to play, Trent and Firmino might have a chance.  But they won't be happy with an early kick-off on Sunday.  Our track record in early matches under Klopp is really abysmal.  Their opponents West Ham have a new manager and lots of new players (and Lanzini injured and Keyoute sold), so it's really hard to predict what they'll be like.

Arsenal will have a more settled team than City for their opener, as I've mentioned before, but several of City's players have returned early and should be available for the Arsenal match, although probably not the Community Shield.  Still a good time for Arsenal to face them.

Burnley will have played competitive matches in the EL before the PL starts, which usually gives a slight advantage in the opening week or two of the PL.

 

[Davrum]

Sean Dyche wasn't messing around today, Chris Wood scored to put Burnley one up and then gave away the second with a horrible clearance, so Dyche pulled him at half time.