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The Young Maester

Was Cregan Stark likely to support Aegon II

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Obviously Cregan declared for Rhaenyra in return for a Targaryen princess to wed his Rickon. But to me, it seems that Cregan had no intentions of declaring for Rhaenyra. Of course, the offer of a princess managed to persuade him, but had Rhaenyra not offered anything, Cregan would likely declare for Aegon or stay neutral. Despite Rhaenrya being the rightful heir since her father decreed it, Cregan seems like the sort of man that would prefer a son over a daughter. This is because of him refusing to name his granddaughters (by his deceased first born) heir to Winterfell. Instead, he wed the girls to his 2nd and 3rd sons and named his 2nd son heir. 

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30 minutes ago, The Young Maester said:

Obviously Cregan declared for Rhaenyra in return for a Targaryen princess to wed his Rickon. But to me, it seems that Cregan had no intentions of declaring for Rhaenyra. Of course, the offer of a princess managed to persuade him, but had Rhaenyra not offered anything, Cregan would likely declare for Aegon or stay neutral. Despite Rhaenrya being the rightful heir since her father decreed it, Cregan seems like the sort of man that would prefer a son over a daughter. This is because of him refusing to name his granddaughters (by his deceased first born) heir to Winterfell. Instead, he wed the girls to his 2nd and 3rd sons and named his 2nd son heir. 

If you read things closely then you know that Aegon II's people also wrote letters to Winterfell. They made offers, too, offers that were apparently rejected.

We have no idea what exactly happened around Cregan's own succession at this point. But one cannot use that to explain his actions decades earlier.

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Cregan seems more pragmatic than anything else. If Rhaenyra hadn't offering him anything, and Aegon II offer was not good either he would no doubt sit that one out. Even with huge promisses in the end he was the last lord to mobilize and only arrived when the war was at the end, and used it to get riddle of useless mouths in the North.

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Cregan obviously took his sweet time in getting involved in war, putting his realm's interest first, especially the coming winter and the plight of his people, and after honoring the promise given to Rhaenyra's son.

He was also promised Targaryen princess as a bride in Pact of Ice and Fire,which in my opinion wasn't really great deal for the North relying on possibility of Jacaerys Velaryon having a  daughter and her coming of age, for immediate support. If Mushroom's rumors are true of him marrying Sarah Snow than it makes him obvious deal breaker ( with his betrothal to Baela)

Marriage alliance taken in person by heir of claimant , beats any lettered offer as seen in Storm's End when both sides sent fort their princes and one who accepted marriage won their alliance.

I think that Cregan was mostly holding to his own moral system , but also was presumptuous, self serving and arbitrary in his dealing of justice ( demanding continuation of war until almost extinction when missing  it's entirety and devastation involved,  letting go Velaryon men and  Seasnake on a whim and for benefit of marrying a woman.)

So from what I have seen Cregan would probably join with Aegon II side if they had better offer before he accepted the one of Rhaenyra or if he felt slighted. 

 

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2 hours ago, Lord Varys said:

We have no idea what exactly happened around Cregan's own succession at this point. But one cannot use that to explain his actions decades earlier.

Well yes, you can. Fact that he wanted his sons to inherit pretty much shows what he thinks when daughters inherit. I doubt this sort of thinking would change decades later. 

3 hours ago, Lord Varys said:

If you read things closely then you know that Aegon II's people also wrote letters to Winterfell. They made offers, too, offers that were apparently rejected.

Probably not as good as the one he received from Rhaenrya. 

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6 minutes ago, The Young Maester said:

Well yes, you can. Fact that he wanted his sons to inherit pretty much shows what he thinks when daughters inherit. I doubt this sort of thinking would change decades later. 

But we don't know why he wanted his sons to inherit or even more if he indeed wanted her daughter to inherit  and his sons pulled an Aegon on them. We know next to nothing about that, the Starks also passed an older brother for his younger so...

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4 minutes ago, frenin said:

But we don't know why he wanted his sons to inherit or even more if he indeed wanted her daughter to inherit  and his sons pulled an Aegon on them. We know next to nothing about that, the Starks also passed an older brother for his younger so...

Thats true. He likely wanted to avoid a civil war in the North. Or he just wanted his sons as Lord. We never know but we can speculate. 

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1 minute ago, The Young Maester said:

Thats true. He likely wanted to avoid a civil war in the North. Or he just wanted his sons as Lord. We never know but we can speculate. 

I think that we can speculate from things we know. Stark was as many of the great lords, an opportunist there. He was there for the exploits and he was charmed by Jace. We are told that the Starks were never particularly loyal so it's likely that he would just sit out of that. The best thing, nothing good comes from a Stark in the South.

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42 minutes ago, The Young Maester said:

Well yes, you can. Fact that he wanted his sons to inherit pretty much shows what he thinks when daughters inherit. I doubt this sort of thinking would change decades later. 

The Starks already backed the female line over the male back in 101 AC and were seen as potential dissidents by the Greens when they staged their coup. And frankly, your own succession has nothing to do with the royal succession, nor do we know whether the Starks had had some ties with the Black faction that is not mentioned. Cregan's father could have had some ties to court for all we know, he could have been one of the lords who swore a vow to Rhaenyra, etc.

42 minutes ago, The Young Maester said:

Probably not as good as the one he received from Rhaenrya. 

Rhaenyra didn't offer anyone anything. Jacaerys Velaryon did, and he died. Rhaenyra wasn't bound by his offers, nor was she ever able to fulfill Jace's part of the Pact of Ice and Fire after his death - the deal was the young Rickon would eventually marry Jace's eldest daughter. Such a girl was never born. Yet Cregan didn't decide at the point of Jace's death to not support Rhaenyra anymore. Nor did she, to our knowledge, offer him any other marriages when she wrote letters to Winterfell asking for more men - which triggered his march down south. She could offered either Baela or Rhaena to Cregan himself, or after Daemon's death, even her own hand in marriage, yet she never did that.

In that sense the idea that Cregan was motivated by some promised reward that no longer could come seems to be an idea that's not supported by the text.

And this is hardly surprising. Nobody was offering any major rewards or marriages to any of the other Blacks.

To be sure, it certainly helped Rhaenyra's cause that Jace showed up personally with his dragons and was offering rewards and favors. But nobody would have been bribed by such approaches if they were determined to not support her. If a dragon intimidated them, they could have just prevaricated and sent as few men as possible or none at all.

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On 4/9/2020 at 3:40 PM, Lord Varys said:

If you read things closely then you know that Aegon II's people also wrote letters to Winterfell. They made offers, too, offers that were apparently rejected.

Having an actual dragonrider on hand seems to have been important. The Baratheons had previously voted for a female claimant and were still related to The Queen Who Never Was, but Aemond arriving first with a marriage offer resulted in them switching. Conversely, Daemon flying to Harrenhal resulted in the Tullys joining him even though Lord Grover insisted Aegon II was king. Helaena was a dragonrider, but she never used Dreamfyre to fly to potential bannermen like Daemon did.

On 4/9/2020 at 4:00 PM, Arthur Peres said:

Cregan seems more pragmatic than anything else. If Rhaenyra hadn't offering him anything, and Aegon II offer was not good either he would no doubt sit that one out. Even with huge promisses in the end he was the last lord to mobilize and only arrived when the war was at the end, and used it to get riddle of useless mouths in the North.

The northmen behave unusually, and not in a way we'd consider "pragmatic" for any other kingdom. They sent multiple waves, and with the intent of dying in battle. Cregan was disappointed that the war was over and had to be restrained by the other regents. So one reason for him not to support Aegon II is that he wouldn't have any reason to attack King's Landing, and it would be more of a hassle to put together a navy to die in battle on Dragonstone.

On 4/9/2020 at 7:38 PM, Lord Varys said:

Rhaenyra didn't offer anyone anything. Jacaerys Velaryon did, and he died. Rhaenyra wasn't bound by his offers, nor was she ever able to fulfill Jace's part of the Pact of Ice and Fire after his death - the deal was the young Rickon would eventually marry Jace's eldest daughter. Such a girl was never born. Yet Cregan didn't decide at the point of Jace's death to not support Rhaenyra anymore.

It was Aemond who offered himself to one of Borros Baratheon's daughters, and after Aemond died Borros seized King's Landing from the Three Kings and just demanded another betrothal. It was actually earlier that he was a somewhat unreliable ally, going after the Vulture King rather than the Blacks.

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4 minutes ago, FictionIsntReal said:

Having an actual dragonrider on hand seems to have been important. The Baratheons had previously voted for a female claimant and were still related to The Queen Who Never Was, but Aemond arriving first with a marriage offer resulted in them switching. Conversely, Daemon flying to Harrenhal resulted in the Tullys joining him even though Lord Grover insisted Aegon II was king. Helaena was a dragonrider, but she never used Dreamfyre to fly to potential bannermen like Daemon did.

Borros is said to have been quite a different man than his father (i.e. a euphemism for treacherous ass, in my opinion ;-)). I don't think Luke and his dragon would have made much of an impression on him if Aemond hadn't shown up. He may have offered his help ... but it would have been about as quickly coming as the help he gave Aegon II.

The Tullys only joined Rhaenyra when Addam Velaryon landed with Seasmoke in the yard of Riverrun.

Daemon flew to Harrenhal because Rhaenyra had friends in the Riverlands. And that turned out to be true. They didn't need bribes or promises, just a place to assemble.

If Cregan had been 'bribed' by Jace, then one would imagined he would have demanded that Rhaenyra marry now him, after Daemon had died. That would have been the ultimate price. Or that she grant him at least the hand of either Baela or Rhaena who were unmarried and without a betrothed at this time.

Even if Rhaenyra hadn't agreed to any of that ... Cregan had the power and opportunity to take either Baela or Rhaena as a bride after he arrived in KL as a reward for his loyalty to King Aegon III. Yet he did nothing of this sort. Which means we are not supposed to believe he did not fight for the promise of a mop of platinum hair.

Unlike Borros Baratheon - who was a man without principles or loyalty to his own kin - Cregan Stark was true to the vow his father may have sworn to Rhaenyra at the foot of the Iron Throne and/or to the arguments/beliefs the Starks had put forth at the Great Council of 101 AC.

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30 minutes ago, Lord Varys said:

Borros is said to have been quite a different man than his father (i.e. a euphemism for treacherous ass, in my opinion ;-)).

I'm glad you now view treachery as an individual characteristic rather than hereditary in the Baratheons :)

Quote

I don't think Luke and his dragon would have made much of an impression on him if Aemond hadn't shown up. He may have offered his help ... but it would have been about as quickly coming as the help he gave Aegon II.

If Luke still has nothing to offer, you might be right.

Quote

If Cregan had been 'bribed' by Jace, then one would imagined he would have demanded that Rhaenyra marry now him, after Daemon had died. That would have been the ultimate price. Or that she grant him at least the hand of either Baela or Rhaena who were unmarried and without a betrothed at this time.

The latter sounds more likely than the former. Rhaenyra had already had six kids and two husbands. That's more than Catelyn, who didn't make any new betrothal after Ned.

 

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4 minutes ago, FictionIsntReal said:

I'm glad you now view treachery as an individual characteristic rather than hereditary in the Baratheons :)

Like Stannis one wishes that they had all one neck to hack through and be done with them.

I never said all Baratheons were 'traitors' as such ... just that they had belligerent and quarrelsome that make them a danger to themselves and others ... and just a pain in the ass for anyone who wants to rule the Seven Kingdoms in peace and quiet. Even the Ironborn can behave better than these guys.

4 minutes ago, FictionIsntReal said:

If Luke still has nothing to offer, you might be right.

Luke had nothing to offer. And neither had Jace for that matter. He took it upon himself to make offers and pacts and the like, but his mother had not giving him permission to arrange marriages and such. And we don't know whether she agreed to any of the deals Jace made (aside from sending Joff any Rhaena to the Eyrie).

4 minutes ago, FictionIsntReal said:

The latter sounds more likely than the former. Rhaenyra had already had six kids and two husbands. That's more than Catelyn, who didn't make any new betrothal after Ned.

Cat wanted to give Ned even more children. And Rhaenyra was only in her early thirties, she could still bear children. And a queen cannot possibly remain without a consort. She would have remarried, and Cregan would have been as good a choice as any. Perhaps even the best. Those Lads were too young. In fact, if she had not gone to Dragonstone and instead continued to White Harbor it might have been Prince Consort Cregan Stark leading her into the throne room to ascend the steps of the Iron Throne a second time.

He would have crushed her enemies, and together they would eradicated all the Greens.

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On 4/10/2020 at 1:38 AM, Lord Varys said:

The Starks already backed the female line over the male back in 101 AC and were seen as potential dissidents by the Greens when they staged their coup. And frankly, your own succession has nothing to do with the royal succession, nor do we know whether the Starks had had some ties with the Black faction that is not mentioned. Cregan's father could have had some ties to court for all we know, he could have been one of the lords who swore a vow to Rhaenyra, etc.

Cregan and his father might’ve been different men with different agendas.
Not referring to how winterfells succession should be in par with the Iron throne. More like how Cregans way of thinking mightve conflicted with the succession of the Iron throne.
And Cregans father could indeed have ties to court, but that is unlikely. Starks werent the most loyal vassals in those days. They cared little for what happened in the south. And kept to their own. 

On 4/10/2020 at 1:38 AM, Lord Varys said:

Rhaenyra didn't offer anyone anything. Jacaerys Velaryon did, and he died. Rhaenyra wasn't bound by his offers, nor was she ever able to fulfill Jace's part of the Pact of Ice and Fire after his death - the deal was the young Rickon would eventually marry Jace's eldest daughter. Such a girl was never born. Yet Cregan didn't decide at the point of Jace's death to not support Rhaenyra anymore. Nor did she, to our knowledge, offer him any other marriages when she wrote letters to Winterfell asking for more men - which triggered his march down south. She could offered either Baela or Rhaena to Cregan himself, or after Daemon's death, even her own hand in marriage, yet she never did that.

In that sense the idea that Cregan was motivated by some promised reward that no longer could come seems to be an idea that's not supported by the text.

And this is hardly surprising. Nobody was offering any major rewards or marriages to any of the other Blacks.

To be sure, it certainly helped Rhaenyra's cause that Jace showed up personally with his dragons and was offering rewards and favors. But nobody would have been bribed by such approaches if they were determined to not support her. If a dragon intimidated them, they could have just prevaricated and sent as few men as possible or none at all.

Rhaenyra/Jacaerys. Same thing she sent him as an envoy to negotiate an agreement of sorts.

This was the first war the north ever got fully involved. It wouldnt be surprising if Cregan stayed neutral. He indeed mightve if it wasnt for Jacaerys visiting winterfell.

Once Jacaerys died, the promised reward was obviously null. But by than Cregan had already raised the black flag and sent warriors south to fight for the dragon queen. Why pull back or switch sides when that would sully your honour. 

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Posted (edited)
On 4/10/2020 at 2:38 AM, Lord Varys said:

Rhaenyra didn't offer anyone anything. Jacaerys Velaryon did, and he died. Rhaenyra wasn't bound by his offers, nor was she ever able to fulfill Jace's part of the Pact of Ice and Fire after his death - the deal was the young Rickon would eventually marry Jace's eldest daughter. Such a girl was never born. Yet Cregan didn't decide at the point of Jace's death to not support Rhaenyra anymore. Nor did she, to our knowledge, offer him any other marriages when she wrote letters to Winterfell asking for more men - which triggered his march down south. She could offered either Baela or Rhaena to Cregan himself, or after Daemon's death, even her own hand in marriage, yet she never did that.

She very much was, those pacts were made in Rhaenrya's name, if you don't fullfil your end of the deal,, people don't support you. By that time Cregan's men had already died fot the Blacks and he himself was a Black.

 

12 hours ago, Lord Varys said:

Borros is said to have been quite a different man than his father (i.e. a euphemism for treacherous ass, in my opinion ;-)). I don't think Luke and his dragon would have made much of an impression on him if Aemond hadn't shown up. He may have offered his help ... but it would have been about as quickly coming as the help he gave Aegon II.

He wasn't, as Cregan did, he picked a side. Being obligated to support a family you neither know nor you care about for their only benefit is solidarity. 

 

 

8 hours ago, The Young Maester said:

Cregan and his father might’ve been different men with different agendas.
Not referring to how winterfells succession should be in par with the Iron throne. More like how Cregans way of thinking mightve conflicted with the succession of the Iron throne.
And Cregans father could indeed have ties to court, but that is unlikely. Starks werent the most loyal vassals in those days. They cared little for what happened in the south. And kept to their own. 

It's unlikely that the Starks had any ties in the court and the only reason we're given about their vote was simply that they wanted to piss off Jaeharys, it's unlikely that the Starks ever gave a shit about the Throne prior Cregan.

 

 

12 hours ago, Lord Varys said:

Unlike Borros Baratheon - who was a man without principles or loyalty to his own kin - Cregan Stark was true to the vow his father may have sworn to Rhaenyra at the foot of the Iron Throne and/or to the arguments/beliefs the Starks had put forth at the Great Council of 101 AC.

Don't be ludicrous, we know about the lords who fought moved by those oaths, Cregan was certainly not one of them, the riverlords, the stormlanders and the reach lords all fought moved by loyalty. Winterfell, and Storm's End were simply war profiteers.  Had Cregan been true to any vow, which isn't true since the Starks didn't guve a damn, Jacaerys wouldn't have need to bribe him.

 

11 hours ago, Lord Varys said:

I never said all Baratheons were 'traitors' as such ... just that they had belligerent and quarrelsome that make them a danger to themselves and others ... and just a pain in the ass for anyone who wants to rule the Seven Kingdoms in peace and quiet. Even the Ironborn can behave better than these guys.

Ofc, the Baratheons have provoked the all the wars since the conquest with their belligerent and quarrelsome traits... Oh wait.

 

@Alyn Oakenfist I like Cregan too much and the Starks but...

 

This we do know: Cregan Stark and Jacaerys Velaryon reached an accord, and signed and sealed the agreement that Grand Maester Munkun calls “the Pact of Ice and Fire” in his True Telling . Like many such pacts, it was to be sealed with a marriage. Lord Cregan’s son, Rickon, was a year old. Prince Jacaerys was as yet unmarried and childless, but it was assumed that he would sire children of his own once his mother sat the Iron Throne. Under the terms of the pact, the prince’s firstborn daughter would be sent north at the age of seven, to be fostered at Winterfell until such time as she was old enough to marry Lord Cregan’s heir.

 

When Cregan marched south, he talked his own promises, not ones made  three decades earlier when he was not even born. 

Edited by frenin

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Nah, he would have supported Rhaenyra anyways. As @Lord Varys pointed out they had supported Rhaenys in 101, so they didn't have any particular biases in the regard, and one thing that is crucial, they had taken a vow to protect Rhaenyra's right to the Throne. Now that didn't mean that much to most, but given the Starks, and Cregan's in particular, sense of duty and honor, I think that was what sealed the deal. The marriage was just the icing on the cake. As to why it took Cregan so long to mobilize, well the North is huge. Put it this way, It took the Reach Greens half the war to go from Oldtown to Tunbletown, which was more or less near KL. Now imagine going from Winterfell to KL, while the North is in winter. Of course it took him a long time. It took him a long time to mobilize his troops, and even longer to march them to KL. Same thing in Robert's rebellion, it took 2 years for Ned to go to the North, mobilize his troops, and finally reach the Riverlands and the Trident.

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I assume that Cregan waited until all adult dragons were either dead or without rider. After all it would have been suicidal to engage with hostile dragon. So he came south after he was sure that his enemies did not have any access to dragons any more.

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9 hours ago, The Young Maester said:

Cregan and his father might’ve been different men with different agendas.

Or not. We don't know. But it is possible that Cregan's father or grandfather were among the leal lords who swore vows to defend Rhaenyra's rights. As were likely many of the other houses who rose for her without being offered anything - the Reach houses, for instances, the Riverlords, etc.

9 hours ago, The Young Maester said:

Not referring to how winterfells succession should be in par with the Iron throne. More like how Cregans way of thinking mightve conflicted with the succession of the Iron throne.

If he had been, he wouldn't have fought for Rhaenyra.

9 hours ago, The Young Maester said:

And Cregans father could indeed have ties to court, but that is unlikely. Starks werent the most loyal vassals in those days. They cared little for what happened in the south. And kept to their own. 

That isn't unlikely in light of the fact that half the Realm or more swore vows to Rhaenyra. Viserys I had his lords show up at his court to do that - that could also have involved the Lord of Winterfell. Previous Lords of Winterfell also moved their asses down south if the king commanded it - like Brandon Stark in 49 AC.

9 hours ago, The Young Maester said:

Rhaenyra/Jacaerys. Same thing she sent him as an envoy to negotiate an agreement of sorts.

We see that they were not sent with authority to make deals of this kind at Luke's example who definitely couldn't agree to marry a daughter of Borros - or make other deals of any kind. He and Jace had the job to deliver the letters they mother gave them, not presume that they were endowed with royal authority to seal pacts.

One sees this later also with Aegon II - who was neither happy about nor willing to confirm the deal Alicent made with Corlys Velaryon.

9 hours ago, The Young Maester said:

This was the first war the north ever got fully involved. It wouldnt be surprising if Cregan stayed neutral. He indeed mightve if it wasnt for Jacaerys visiting winterfell.

That visit had very little effect. Cregan marshaled his large only when Rhaenyra wrote her letters from KL and Duskendale. And those were pleas for help, one imagines.

9 hours ago, The Young Maester said:

Once Jacaerys died, the promised reward was obviously null. But by than Cregan had already raised the black flag and sent warriors south to fight for the dragon queen. Why pull back or switch sides when that would sully your honour. 

Pull out wouldn't have sullied his honor. He could have easily enough abandoned Rhaenyra after she was hounded out of KL or her cause after she had been killed by her half-brother.

1 hour ago, Alyn Oakenfist said:

Nah, he would have supported Rhaenyra anyways. As @Lord Varys pointed out they had supported Rhaenys in 101, so they didn't have any particular biases in the regard, and one thing that is crucial, they had taken a vow to protect Rhaenyra's right to the Throne.

The latter we don't know. I think it is a possibility but we don't know who did take that vow aside from Otto Hightower the traitor and a couple of the Riverlanders who rose for Rhaenyra because they took the vow.

1 hour ago, Alyn Oakenfist said:

Now that didn't mean that much to most, but given the Starks, and Cregan's in particular, sense of duty and honor, I think that was what sealed the deal. The marriage was just the icing on the cake. As to why it took Cregan so long to mobilize, well the North is huge. Put it this way, It took the Reach Greens half the war to go from Oldtown to Tunbletown, which was more or less near KL. Now imagine going from Winterfell to KL, while the North is in winter. Of course it took him a long time. It took him a long time to mobilize his troops, and even longer to march them to KL. Same thing in Robert's rebellion, it took 2 years for Ned to go to the North, mobilize his troops, and finally reach the Riverlands and the Trident.

Cregan and his lords sent men early on, but there was little need to send more once Rhaenyra had taken the throne. The war seemed pretty much won by then - and would have been won if those blasted Betrayers hadn't turned their cloak. The new Black armies in the Vale, the North, and the Riverlands are only raised after they realized they had to crush the Greens at Tumbleton and retake KL from the rioters and rebels there.

We should not necessarily imagine that Cregan was raising a host for months and months while there seemed to be no need. He would have started raising his host when Rhaenyra's first letter from KL reached him.

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1 hour ago, Lord Varys said:

We should not necessarily imagine that Cregan was raising a host for months and months while there seemed to be no need. He would have started raising his host when Rhaenyra's first letter from KL reached him.

I mostly agree. Throughout the whole Dance, most Lords only raise smallish hosts of more professional troops; knights, men at arms etc. Probably for pragmatic reasons because there's no point in the Lannisters sending 30,000 men to invade the Riverlands if there's a good chance Daemon swoops down and incinerates their entire populace.

For a land as vast and scarcely populated as the North, to mobilise an infantry army would take too long. Sending 2000 cavalry probably seemed like enough at the time. Before Tumbleton the North still had troops active in the south and the war was presumed to be all but over. If Hugh and Ulf had stayed loyal, it likely would have been. So yeah, prior to Tumbleton and the Fall of King's Landing, there would be no sense in Cregan raising more troops.

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2 hours ago, Adam Yozza said:

I mostly agree. Throughout the whole Dance, most Lords only raise smallish hosts of more professional troops; knights, men at arms etc. Probably for pragmatic reasons because there's no point in the Lannisters sending 30,000 men to invade the Riverlands if there's a good chance Daemon swoops down and incinerates their entire populace.

For a land as vast and scarcely populated as the North, to mobilise an infantry army would take too long. Sending 2000 cavalry probably seemed like enough at the time. Before Tumbleton the North still had troops active in the south and the war was presumed to be all but over. If Hugh and Ulf had stayed loyal, it likely would have been. So yeah, prior to Tumbleton and the Fall of King's Landing, there would be no sense in Cregan raising more troops.

It is not just all that - it is simply the fact that it still takes Cregan months to get his army down south even after Rhaenyra wrote her letters from KL and Duskendale.

If we imagine him marshalling men since early 129 AC only to finally show up well into 131 AC this wouldn't really fit with the time it takes Robb to marshal his army. And Cregan doesn't even assemble that many men.

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