Arthur Peres

It was not part of the plan, if anything Roose did everything Robb asked him, not to. From the start Robb was hesitant to face Tywin: Robb hesitated. “The Greatjon thinks we should take the battle to Lord Tywin and surprise him,” he said, “but the Glovers and the Karstarks feel we’d be wiser to go around his army and join up with Uncle Ser Edmure against the Kingslayer.” He ran his fingers through his shaggy mane of auburn hair, looking unhappy. “Though by the time we reach Riverrun . . . I’m not certain . . . ” Then Robb started to explain his plan Robb drew a map across the table, a ragged piece of old leather covered with lines of faded paint. One end curled up from being rolled; he weighed it down with his dagger. “Both plans have virtues, but . . . look, if we try to swing around Lord Tywin’s host, we take the risk of being caught between him and the Kingslayer, and if we attack him . . . by all reports, he has more men than I do, and a lot more armored horse. The Greatjon says that won’t matter if we catch him with his breeches down, but it seems to me that a man who has fought as many battles as Tywin Lannister won’t be so easily surprised.” “I’d leave a small force here to hold Moat Cailin, archers mostly, and march the rest down the causeway,” he said, “but once we’re below the Neck, I’d split our host in two. The foot can continue down the kingsroad, while our horsemen cross the Green Fork at the Twins.” He pointed. “When Lord Tywin gets word that we’ve come south, he’ll march north to engage our main host, leaving our riders free to hurry down the west bank to Riverrun.” Robb wanted to draw Tywin north, then take Jaime by surprise, he wanted Tywin on march so that he could not help Jaime and he did not thought to surprise Tywin, instead he wanted the infantry to stall for time. Greatjon was sacked because he idea was either too risk or too foolish, instead they go with Roose for cunning. Tywin did fall for Robb's plan, and went on to march North like the young wolf wanted, he would waste even more days if Roose did not marched on him. “My lord,” he said, “Ser Addam bid me tell you that the Stark host is moving down the causeway.” “So the wolfling is leaving his den to play among the lions,” he said in a voice of quiet satisfaction. “Splendid. Return to Ser Addam and tell him to fall back. He is not to engage the northerners until we arrive, but I want him to harass their flanks and draw them farther south.” “We are well situated here,” Ser Kevan pointed out. “Close to the ford and ringed by pits and spikes. If they are coming south, I say let them come, and break themselves against us.” “The boy may hang back or lose his courage when he sees our numbers,” Lord Tywin replied. “The sooner the Starks are broken, the sooner I shall be free to deal with Stannis Baratheon. Tell the drummers to beat assembly, and send word to Jaime that I am marching against Robb Stark.” If anything, Roose should have stopped his march the moment he is harassed by the Lannisters skirmisher, and either retreat to draw Tywin even more, or picked a place to defend himself. Tywin would just see that as Robb losing his temper and being coward as his coments show. His father had set a grueling pace, and it had taken its toll. Men wounded in the battle kept up as best they could or were abandoned to fend for themselves. Every morning they left a few more by the roadside, men who went to sleep never to wake. Every afternoon a few more collapsed along the way. And every evening a few more deserted, stealing off into the dusk. Tyrion had been half-tempted to go with them. He had been upstairs, enjoying the comfort of a featherbed and the warmth of Shae’s body beside him, when his squire had woken him to say that a rider had arrived with dire news of Riverrun. So it had all been for nothing. The rush south, the endless forced marches, the bodies left beside the road . . . all for naught. Robb Stark had reached Riverrun days and days ago. Tywin was days away from helping Jaime, he forced marched his host and still came way too late to help Jaime's host, but Roose actions only gained Robb a single day, if he had retreated back already would have acomplished his mission, instead he wasted more than a 1/3 of his army for nothing. Roose went against the purpose of his command and seeked battle, he tired his men with the intention of surprising Tywin just to threw away the element of surprise, he waited for the Lannisters to form up, he abandoned the high ground, he threw the men of other houses into the mess and shoot them with arrows, and preserved his forces during all this.

For me it's very clear that he botched the battle of the Green Fork on purpose.

We see Robb send ravens from Ashmark to Winterfell, we see Stannis send ravens to all the lords in the realm. Roose sending a raven from the Twins to the Dreadfort is much easier to be done. I don't belive that Roose ordered the attack on Winterfell, but I belive he did ordered the kidnaping of Donella. Very diferent moments.

At the start of the book is very clear, that all camps are sending several messages between each other. Tywin orders a new army be raised by Stafford, Robb get the news of events that happened after the end of AGoT, like the death of the young lord Darry. The news of the death of the lord hornwood and his heir cleary already got to the north as we see several houses making their claim. I don't see why Roose would not inform Ramsey of what was happening during all this. I don't understand your point about Luwin. Roose was at the the Twins or at the Ruby ford at the start of the book and Ramsey at the Dreadfort. They don't need Luwin to write to each other.

Roose took comand of the North infantry and imediatly he disobeys Robb going after Tywin when his first order was to stall for time, draw Tywin north and avoid the battle if possible. What he did is what the Greatjon told Robb to do and was discarded for being either too risk or too foolish. I also think that Roose botched the battle on purpuse, everything that happened there is too weird. After the battles of WW and GF everyone already knew about the death of Lord Hornwood and his heir, a lot of time passes from the end of AGoT and ACoK, several battles in the riverlands, the discussion for the next Hornwood lord and etc, a lot of letters were being written and send, I don't see why Roose and Ramsey would not keep in touch about the situation in the north and in the south. I think Roose ordered Ramsey to abduct Donella to secure that he would be the one to get at least part of that land, the majority of the houses that wanted to be lords of the Hornwood lands were trying it by marrying her after all. Ramsey's acted way overboard forcing Donella into a marriage with him and torturing her, invading the lands and presenting himself as a clear criminal for everybody to see. From there on I think is Ramsey that botched everything being defeated and captured and Roose decided to distance himself from it and left Ramsey to his fate. Roose later on went on to take the lands for himself when he was declared Warden of the North.

Manderly was the closest kin with the widow, he also had the control of the region after defeating Ramsey, and he is the one with the better army, close to the land, and the richer lord in the region. He would be my guess.

Balon did not cared one bit for Theon, to the point he went on to pray for his son's death. Theon being a hostage would not be his concern. Without Theon the IB would be kicked out of the north by Rodrik, Ramsey would be hanged, and Robb would stil be in a losing position in the south but would probably be alive for longer.

Renly and Stannis calling each other horrible is like the pot calling the kettle black. But Renly being awful does not turn Stannis good. If Stannis did not cared for being king, he could just made what Master Aemon did and get out of the way of his brother, instead he choose to murder him.

Stannis wanted to be king, and was willing to let one brother to die, and kill the other. Do you see any other decent character in his position doing the same? Do you see Bran letting Robb to die, and then killing Rickon to become King in the North? Do you see Garlan letting Willas to die and then killing Loras to become King ? Would Ned let Brandon to die and then kill Benjen? Only evil men like Stannis would do such a thing.

House Dayne is from Dorne, and the Yronwoods are stronger. Hightower is easily stronger than the other houses in the reach and might be even stronger than the Tyrells, acording to Randyl Tarly they can field at least three times more than any other house sworn to the Tyrells, they are also very rich, even being compared to the Lannisters.

Theon would have no way to send the letter, Balon blocked the ports and I doubt that he would trust Theon anywhere close to the ravens. So if Theon tried that he would be imprisoned by his father. Without Theon taking Winterfell the IB invasion would fail for sure, Rodrik would deal with Ramsey then gather the army and push Asha back into the sea while Victarion is starved, poisoned and bleed by the Cragnoman, eventually Rodrik would also push them away. Without Winterfell falling Bran and Rickon are not considered "dead", Catelyn does not free Jaime, Robb does not sleep with Jeyne, Roose will keep his options open. Robb will still be in a losing position after Blackwater, he would still be fighting Lannisters, Tyrells, IB, Crowlands and the Stormlords, but he is not that weak, Red Wedding would probably not happen as Walder is not that pissed with him but would still try distant himself, if the purple Wedding still happen the odds of Robb improve by a lot or at the very least he can negotiate a peace with Tommen now that Joffrey is dead and his beef was with Joffrey.

At the time of A Dance of Dragons, sure. At the time of A Clash of Kings Doran had plenty of options of how to screw with the Lannisters and actually take revenge on Tywin. Now he is in this weird position where everybody that was involved in his family death is now dead, Aerys, Rhaegar, Lorch, Gregor, Tywin, Kevan and even Robert, Jon, Ned and Hoster are all dead, but he keeps saying that he wants revenge while pointing out that the current Lannisters had nothing to do with Elia's death. At the same time he's plotting to overthrow Tommen in favor of Daenerys. What does he think will happen to Tommen after that? Doran's plan beyond being stupid, do not go along with what he wants. He and Balon really are a pair running neck and neck about who is dumber. This was during Daeron's reing. During Aerys reing this does not seems to be the case considering how he talked about Elia. The Martells have all the reasons in the world to hate the Targeryans as much as they hate the Lannisters. The worst thing a Dornish ruller could do is to support the Lannisters, the second is to support a Targeryan. Doran is doing the first as a front and the second as a plot...The more time I think about his plan the worst it gets.

And he still the best one by far. He even raised one of the very few decent Targeryan Kings in Egg. Dragonkight, might or might not have cucked his king... Arthur Dayne died fighting a lost civil war trying to stop a brother to see his dying sister. Barristan is the next close thing to a good knight, but the sad thing is that he served the wrong king...twice. Daemon Blackfyre tried to usurp the crow.

Duncan the Tall and is not even close.

He is one of my favorite characters. But I don't know if he is sympathetic. His actions towards the Lannisters are and I have a soft spot for tragedy, but what about everything else? Cheating in a duel and killing a powerfull lord over a pointless affair, kidnaping his bastard from the arms of the mother that is crying and begging to keep the child, raising his kids to become either complete idiots or psychos with some being both... He is very charismatic, but I don't know about sympathetic.