Mladen Posted November 21, 2021 Share Posted November 21, 2021 Hello, everyone... Long time no see. It is good to be back on Westeros. So, I have watched all three episodes. And I am IN LOVE with Rosamund. She still has a lot to get to my all time favorites, but I have a strong feeling by the end of this, I will love her Moiraine almost as much as I love Cate Blanchett's Galadriel. ALMOST I have several problems. Mostly with pace and structure. That said, I can't forgive the exclusion of Prologue. It is one of the most memorable prologues in epic fantasy and I would have preferred it over Moiraine's speech. I feel as if the entire Two Rivers plot has been too rushed. It would have been better for to have built the danger a bit slower. For Moiraine to be a bit more mysterious, to have more interactions. That said, I loved the asexual nature of bath scene with Moiraine and Lan. There is a lot of nudity in WoT without sexual connotation and I like that they have done that. Channeling is too generic for my taste. I like how Rosamund Pike described that dance she and Daniel did in showing the bond between Aes Sedai and her Warder. But, it takes a lot from the really interesting part of weaving. At least have strings in different colors. I wish they thought it better. A lot of LOTR references. I especially enjoyed Aragorn and Arwen reference with Lan and Nyn. I enjoyed the cinematic nature of the show. There's a clear Peter Jackson influence on those shots. But, hey, I loved it. As for Whtecloaks debate, I agree it was problematic. Overall, I wish we got more Tam. Michael was great. The main cast is quite solid - having no big gripes with the main 5. And I am not impressed with the casting for Logain. I always thought someone like Ben Barnes for Logain (actually, his Darkling in "Shadow and Bone" would perfectly work for me as Logain) That would be that. Good to be back Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Myrddin Posted November 21, 2021 Share Posted November 21, 2021 17 hours ago, Rhom said: Just watched eps 2 and 3. They are much better than the first. Agreed. Each episode is an improvement on the previous. Thom and Matt's scene by the cage especially impressed me, given it was completely from the writer's room. As an aside, neither of my non-reader family caught the comment about Aiel hair coloring. Even when the scene cut to Rand. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fionwe1987 Posted November 21, 2021 Share Posted November 21, 2021 5 hours ago, SpaceChampion said: One thing I miss from the books is Lan looking out for Rand in a bit of big brother / fatherly way, knowing this journey to becoming the Dragon Reborn is going to be hard, and treating him like a human being rather than an instrument in their war against the Dark. That really only starts in book 2, though. Before that, Lan is kinda agnostic to them. Moiraine even notes that his increased concern for the Two Rivers folk is Nynaeve's influence. So I hope the show will build up to this. 5 hours ago, Ran said: Again, he did not believe it could be Aes Sedai because whatever his suspicion or belief the actual facts he had were that they did, indeed, seem to adhere to them -- no Child ever heard an Aes Sedai tell a provable lie and no Aes Sedai turned the One Power on the Children or other men except in defense of their life, etc He clearly says that it looks like they're now openly violating the Oaths. I think it's clear the Whitecloaks think the Oaths are a cover, and no one who dares touch the One Power would voluntarily give up the amount of power the Oaths take away from them. 5 hours ago, Ran said: Using the Oath against them would provide ready fodder to prove that it was all a lie far earlier. Confused. How so? Let's say you go asking women if they're Aes Sedai. You do that, and for anyone who gives it a moments thought, that means you think they genuinely cannot lie. Which then makes it bizarre to claim their Darkfriends. 5 hours ago, Ran said: 5 hours ago, IFR said: The increased threat of the Whitecloaks is an interesting approach, and I'm not sure I'm a fan of how it is handled so far. Hide contents It hasn't been addressed yet, but if Whitecloaks were actively mutilating and burning Aes Sedai, one would expect there to be some kind of response by Tar Valen and its allies. I'd imagine Whitecloaks would be straight up outlawed in places like Caemlyn. I couldn't see the White Tower not encouraging allied nations to heavily embargo Amador and pressuring other nations to do the same. I wonder if all out wars are regularly occurring over this issue? The institutional effort to torture and murder Aes Sedai is a big deal. Harassment with occasional death, as portrayed in the books, is one thing. Effective terrorism is an entirely different scenario. It also seems like it would introduce a nebulous issue with the three oaths, too. Yes I agree. I don't see how the increased threat posed by the Whitecloaks makes too much sense, so far, unless maybe they have it be that they're recently emboldened, and Valda is doing more than Whitecloaks did in the past. I liked Pike's line that Valda wasn't the only one who saw a face to remember that day. It was very Moiraine, in both content and deliver, and it promised a future encounter that will hopefully be memorable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Poobah Posted November 21, 2021 Share Posted November 21, 2021 2 hours ago, Gertrude said: Again, I'm having to head-cannon this, but I'm wondering if he uses this time questioning to decide if it's worth keeping a closer eye on them instead of a direct confrontation. He wasn't searching thoroughly, so it's not hard to extrapolate that he wasn't searching all that hard, just trying to get them off balance. He noticed her hand, looking for a ring indentation - say he saw one, I still don't think he would double down on the search, I think he'd just let them think they passed the screening and then follow them to wait for an opportunity to take them down - however it is that he does it. I doubt he's collected so many rings by relying on luck that the Aes Sedai he's just confronted wasn't powerful enough to hand him his ass. Yeah it's kinda weird. In the books the Whitecloaks are described as looking to kill Aes Sedai through assassination, not direct confrontation, so maybe he lets someone he thinks is an Aes Sedai go and then plans an ambush later on? Though if we're supposed to buy the confrontation at face value then perhaps the (to me) absurdly slow way in which the show depicts channelling comes in? If it takes like 30 seconds to charge up one lighting bolt then yeah I think a few dozen Whitecloaks have pretty good odds against an Aes Sedai. The only way the Trollocs didn't beat her in the Winternight battle is because they milled around waiting to die. The only major instance of really effective combat channelling I saw was when she saves Egwene by cutting that Trolloc up with air - I understand that they want something visually impressive to draw in the kids or whatever, and they also have to balance budget with creating a sense of threat and danger so it's probably not feasible to show her killing dozens of Trollocs with every wave of her hand - but all these incredibly slow charge up spells didn't really do it for me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Corvinus85 Posted November 21, 2021 Share Posted November 21, 2021 Btw, did Valda's costume include the shepherd's crook? I missed it if it did. And if it didn't, then that's a shame. No reason not to put it on a few of the costumes. Having made him a Questioner, I wonder if they're combining him with Jaichim Carridin. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darryk Posted November 21, 2021 Share Posted November 21, 2021 Well after three episodes, I would say I enjoyed them, but I don't see it blowing people away and becoming a phenomenon the way GoT did. At best it will be a niche success with fantasy fans. This is a shame, as personally I think the books had the potential to be something really epic and cinematic, approaching LOTR levels even. Things I like so far: - The Trollocs look really cool; just have enough of their own thing going to not feel like blatant rip-offs of orcs - Rosamund Pike is nailing Moiraine, perfectly cast for the role and I can't wait to see her journey play out - I think Lan and Thom Merrilin have been well cast too; different to how I pictured them from the books, but I think the show's versions are better - I'm enjoying the dynamic between the four kids from Two Rivers, and I think the actor playing Mat is doing an especially good job which makes it a real shame he's been recast Things I don't like: - Can't get over them not using the original prologue - The Dragon Reborn prophecy pretty much feels like an afterthought so far, whereas in the books it felt important right from the beginning - The lack of Ishamael is a shame; they could have cast a really charismatic actor in the role and have him appear to the kids in their dreams and taunt them, like he does in the books. The dead bats scene in the show was a lame substitute for what happens in the book with Ishamael and the rat. - The show isn't really capturing the dark, ominous atmosphere of the books; and the feeling of there being thousands of years of history behind everything that's happening. Maybe that will come in time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darryk Posted November 21, 2021 Share Posted November 21, 2021 8 hours ago, Ran said: Good point. It's not an issue in the books because an Aes Sedai has nothing to fear from a Questioner, generally. Okay, one can argue that in this turning of the Wheel, the Children don't belive the Three Oaths are real... ... but wouldn't it behoove a Questioner to just test it and ask and see what happens? On a separate note, discovered that Brandon Sanderson has been commenting extensively on Reddit on the first two episodes, commenting on things he didn't like, why certain changes happened, and things he did or tried to do to make things a bit more faithful to the books. He, too, felt Abell Cauthon had been done dirty, and generally isn't too happy with the sense that they've made some of the characters and their backgrounds "grittier" or more "grimdark", but is understanding. One of he more interesting comments was on that "11,000" notes thing, which he said Judkins confided to him and found overwhelming. He also drew attention to the fact that there's a lot of producer credits on this show, implying there's maybe too many cooks in the kitchen to the detriment of the show. He does reiterate that he's happy with it, after again noting: His thing about it being just "a new turning of the Wheel" doesn't work for me. A new turning of the wheel but where the people involved have the exact same names and come from the exact same places, with events playing out in almost the exact same way? That makes the Wheel of Time sound more like Groundhog Day. Why doesn't he just view it as what it is: An adaptation that is taking liberties with the source material, much like any other adaptation? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jace, Extat Posted November 21, 2021 Share Posted November 21, 2021 2 minutes ago, Darryk said: Why doesn't he just view it as what it is: An adaptation that is taking liberties with the source material, much like any other adaptation? Because he doesn't like it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ran Posted November 21, 2021 Share Posted November 21, 2021 On to a fresh thread! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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