UK Politics X

[Lummel]

National Front

BNP

English Dem

Fresh choice for Londen (UKIP)

and the guy from the residents assosisiation which judging from the leaflet he put though my door his campingn is. "I live locally, and I won't let London law become Sharia Law"

Wow. I think that's almost a Full House.

I love the disconnect in the residents' association's candidate's leaflet. Wrong election my friend, you need to stand for parliament not the council to do things like that. Maybe he also promised to end the war in Afghanistan and leave NATO too.

I got to vote last year, but we had nowhere near that range of candidates in my true blue ward, just the usual suspects Tory, Labour, Lib Dem and an independent.

[The Marquis de Leech]

National Front

BNP

English Dem

Fresh choice for Londen (UKIP)

and the guy from the residents assosisiation which judging from the leaflet he put though my door his campingn is. "I live locally, and I won't let London law become Sharia Law"

I'm now having images of the various candidates claiming to be the one true fascist candidate, and that the others are cheap knock-offs.

[Hereward]

Fascist and racist are not the same thing. Nor are right-wing and racist.

I wouldn't vote for any of them, but I think it's a stretch to categorise UKIP and the English Democrats as racist, even if figures from both parties can be found to have said bigotted or racially insensitive things. I wouldn't have to try too hard to find the same sort of examples from the Big Three, after all.

[mormont]

Going to have to disagree with you there, H. I find the actual platforms of both UKIP and the English Democrats to contain what I would describe as racism. They talk about a 'tide' of immigration, bewail the 'undermining' of our 'traditional values' and 'culture', bang on about 'patriotism': if they're not racist, they've surely managed to hit every single number in the game of racist code-word bingo just the same. I doubt I could tell the UKIP manifesto from the NF one just by the quotes. I don't think that's happened by coincidence.

[Darth Visenya]

First time I've bothered voting.

Voted for Boris.

[Maltaran]

I didn't have any racists (unless you count UKIP, but I'm with Hereward on that - they're xenophobic, true, but calling them racist is a stretch*). Having decided last year that I'm not going to vote for the Lib Dems as long as they're in bed with Cameron, my vote went to the Green candidate. Not that it really matters who I vote for here in inner city Birmingham, it'll be a Labour landslide anyway. The more interesting vote was the referendum on whether we should have an elected mayor, to which I voted yes.

*although there are certainly racists within the party, but I'm not comfortable with labelling the entire group as racist.

[Stalker]

Fascist and racist are not the same thing.

Going to have to disagree with you there, H. I find the actual platforms of both UKIP and the English Democrats to contain what I would describe as racism. They talk about a 'tide' of immigration, bewail the 'undermining' of our 'traditional values' and 'culture', bang on about 'patriotism': if they're not racist, they've surely managed to hit every single number in the game of racist code-word bingo just the same. I doubt I could tell the UKIP manifesto from the NF one just by the quotes. I don't think that's happened by coincidence.

Your point of racist code word bingo is very apt, and I don't see much difference between all those parties. It's indeed a trait of extreme politics to not be able cooperate and unite in one party. One can see the same in the far left.

But I think you lost his initial point about Fascism there. Unless it's used as a generic insult, as it often is, I don't think any of those parties fits, possibly excepting the BNP. And if it is, well, then all parties are Fascist. Especially yours.

[Stalker]

The server is pleasant today.

[Pebble thats Stubby]

I guess its where you draw the line.

to me UKIP appears racist, not as full on racist as BNP. And I don't think they would support thug like behaviour (even secretly) but I do get the impression they want all foreigners to go away and leave us alone. UKIP members may even have foreign friends.

From what I have seen UKIP's policiys and what they say appear to be anti intigration, anti anyone not British. That to me suggests a racist platform. maybe once their party once Euroskeptic to Euopeans and other non Brits do not belong here. Go Home. keep Britain for real Brits.

[mormont]

Oh, I agree that UKIP couldn't remotely be described as 'fascist'. No question there.

I find it a bit depressing that I had a choice of six candidates today and a transferable vote, and could not find anyone who I would even consider giving a second preference to.

[Derfel Cadarn]

I didn't vote and got lectured at work for this dereliction of duty. "A vote not casted is a vote for the Tories," a work colleague retorted that she voted for the Lib-Dems last time - which became a vote for the Tories anyway.

[Maltaran]

I do get the impression they want all foreigners to go away and leave us alone.

This is why I call them xenophobic rather than racist.

"A vote not casted is a vote for the Tories,"

Somewhere else that line might work, but in Scotland?

[Derfel Cadarn]

That was my reply. There are some long memories.

[Hereward]

Going to have to disagree with you there, H. I find the actual platforms of both UKIP and the English Democrats to contain what I would describe as racism. They talk about a 'tide' of immigration, bewail the 'undermining' of our 'traditional values' and 'culture', bang on about 'patriotism': if they're not racist, they've surely managed to hit every single number in the game of racist code-word bingo just the same. I doubt I could tell the UKIP manifesto from the NF one just by the quotes. I don't think that's happened by coincidence.

OK, having done some further research I'm going to cede some, but not all, ground! I've read the English Democrats manifesto and statements by its leader, and while they explicitly reject racism and express a desire to emulate the SNP, which I think we can all agree is not racist, there is certainly some worrying language. Having said that, I don't think they're smart enough to deliberately use dog whistle language. I tend to the view that they don't think of themselves as racist, though they might have some tendencies in that direction.

I think UKIP is xenophobic rather than out and out racist, but they certainly do knowingly use dog whistle language and I find them far more cynical on the subject.

Edit: I didn't vote for the first time ever yesterday. I feel a bit ashamed, but I couldn't find anyone I had the slightest desire to give my backing to.

[Usotsuki]

I didn't vote for the first time ever yesterday. I feel a bit ashamed, but I couldn't find anyone I had the slightest desire to give my backing to.

Never blame oneself when there are politicians within easy reach.

If your local parties are no longer prepared to buy votes with beef and bread and beer and the promise of dubious planning decisions taken by narrow vote in the middle of the night in the traditional manner then clearly they have betrayed the founding principles of local government and you abstain as a matter of honour.

[Lummel]

...I've read the English Democrats manifesto and statements by its leader, and while they explicitly reject racism and express a desire to emulate the SNP, which I think we can all agree is not racist, there is certainly some worrying language. Having said that, I don't think they're smart enough to deliberately use dog whistle language...

So the conclusion is that they are racist but not clever enough to realise it?

[Talleyrand]

I have to go to the Zoo with some visiting relatives and their children tomorrow and it occurred to me that in Scotland there are twice as many Pandas as there are Tory MPs.

Not really relevant to anything, I just find it rather amusing

[Lummel]

If Edinburgh asks nicely maybe Westminster will send a breeding pair of Torys north. You might need to keep them in seclusion so they can acclimatise before being released though.

[Daeric]

Keighley only had the main 3 parties to vote for.

A few interesting things that's fallen out in Yorkshire from the votes is apart from Doncaster all the major cities have voted no to having an elected Major, and Bradfords done it again with voting in more Respect party members, 5 of them.

[williamjm]

I have to go to the Zoo with some visiting relatives and their children tomorrow and it occurred to me that in Scotland there are twice as many Pandas as there are Tory MPs.

Not really relevant to anything, I just find it rather amusing

Speaking of animals and Scottish elections, apparently one of the Liberal Democrat candidates in Edinburgh managed to get fewer votes than Professor Pongoo, a man dressed as a giant penguin.

There's also some good news, apparently the BNP lost all six of their council seats that were up for grabs (the English Democrats were also similarly wiped out).